Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items









Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest Forums > Gear & Maintenance
 Not a Member? 



Like Tree2Likes
  • 2 Post By dacap06

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 01-08-2012
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Seattle
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 0
conniede is on a distinguished road
Send a message via MSN to conniede
Question Coconut Connie

Ahoy,
I live in Seattle, have a 38' C&C Landfall, just acquired it in 2010. It's a great boat, handles very nicely.
To save myself from re-inventing the wheel,
I was wondering if anyone has ever tried to install a second bilge pump on a Landfall and how would it be pumped out? The route out the stern thru hull fitting is very difficult to access. There is already the manual as auxillary pump but I was trying to install an add'l automatic for added safety.
Thanks for any helpful ideas,
Connie
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 01-09-2012
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: N. VA
Posts: 374
Rep Power: 5
dacap06 is on a distinguished road
Send a message via Yahoo to dacap06
Connie,

Welcome to Sailnet! You can make many friends here and find a lot of good information as well, although the Sailnet built-in search capability leaves much to be desired. Your best bet is to use Google, believe it or not! A Google query that looks like this:
site:sailnet.com "2nd bilge pump"
would grab all Sailnet threads with the phrase, 2nd bilge pump, in them.

Now, on to your question. I recommend starting with this thread. It's an oldie, but it covers the basics rather nicely IMO including wiring.

There are two kinds of electric bilge pumps. The submersible rotary pump is by far the more common. It is an all-in-one solution that sucks from the bottom of the pump into a rotating impeller, which essentially throws the water into the discharge hose via centripetal force. Submersibles are inexpensive, high volume, low pressure pumps. However, their pumping ability degrades quickly with height. The higher they have to pump the discharge water, the more you must de-rate their capacity. Rule, Shurflo, and several other manufacturers makes a ton of quality pumps of this sort.

The other kind is the diaphragm pump, which is a positive displacement pump. They are more expensive but the pump inlet can be at the other end of a long hose. This kind of pump is sometimes mounted in a locker or under a settee with an intake hose that reaches into the bottom of the bilge. The pumping volume is lower but the the capacity reduction from pumping height is pretty small. This kind of pump requires a separate float switch to sense when the bilge requires pumping. Diaphragm pumps work well when you don't have room for a submersible, such as getting the intake into a deep V, or where the bilge is so deep that it is awkward or impossible to get yourself down into it to mount it or work on the pump. David Pascoe published this article a little while back that recommends the Jabsco diaphragm pumps. If you go this route, I recommend you read the Pascoe article.

As for putting in a second pump, it is a good idea so long as you run a separate discharge hose to a separate outlet (e.g. a through-hull). Putting two pumps on the same hose is just asking for trouble. A clog causes you to lose both pumps, and unless you install check valves (which are prone to clogging and are not recommended in bilge hose by ANYONE) you can create a loop that pumps from the lower pump back to the bilge via back flow into the upper pump (although this is not so for positive displacement pumps). A discharge loop will drain your batteries dead -- and could cause water damage, or even possibly sink your boat when it is unattended, if the leak is bad enough. It's a good idea to put a smaller pump as low as possible with a larger pump farther up in your bilge. Some folks attach an alarm so they know when the upper pump goes off. After all, the upper pump should never run unless the lower pump fails or is overwhelmed by water rushing in.

If you put in a second pump that is of the submersible rotary type, be sure to run a loop of the discharge hose up as high as possible. If you don't have one, you can end up with backflow into your boat when heeled over to the point that your discharge through-hull fitting dips below the water line.

A last word on pump choices -- due to their lower capacity, diaphragm pumps are best suited as a lower pump. I recommend using a submersible rotary pump for your upper pump. I don't know what the bilge size and shape of the Landfall is, but I expect you can find a second pump will fit as it is possible to find a size and shape of submersible pump to fit almost anywhere these days. My final piece of advice: measure twice so you only have to buy once.

Regards,

Tom
Faster and Sea Diamond like this.
__________________
T. P. Donnelly
S/V Tranquility Base
1984 Islander 30 Bahama
Pasadena, MD
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 01-09-2012
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Halifax Canada
Posts: 21
Rep Power: 0
Sea Diamond is on a distinguished road
Searching for Threads

Thank you Dacap06 for your answer to Conniede. As a recently retired professional engineer I now have time to replace the head, hoses and holding tank on my the (2nd) love of my life "Sea Diamond" a 1999 Beneteau 381.
After much research I settled on a Raritan Marine Elegance head because it will fit perfectly in the space provided, and promises to be quiet (61 dBA).

I had a few questions for the Sailnet family concerning holding tanks, but posted them in a thread concerning macerator pumps vs manual pumps because as a newbie to sailnet I didn't feel confident to start a new thread on what I was sure must be an old topic. (Old sailors don't want to "Rock the Boat")

Thanks to your instruction regarding googling sailnet.com "keywords" I found some threads relating to holding tanks and top vs. bottom fittings, which is what I really wanted.

Thanks Tom

Les
Halifax, Canada
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2nd bilge pump - C&C LF38 conniede Gear & Maintenance 0 01-08-2012 01:13 PM
cw manual bilge pump, bike pump type b40Ibis Gear & Maintenance 2 04-27-2011 07:26 PM
Installing automatic bilge pump in series with diaphram bilge pump... sweetdreamyamaha Gear & Maintenance 6 11-07-2009 11:36 AM
Shallow Bilge, Bilge Pump Switch labestia Gear & Maintenance 1 07-10-2009 02:40 PM
Brand new bilge pump that doesn't pump.... ugh Lancer28 Gear & Maintenance 6 02-08-2008 08:26 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:48 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012