Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble - SailNet Community

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  #1  
Old 07-05-2012
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Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

I have a Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission, mated to a 2QM20 Yanmar. They are both 35 years old, have ~1800 hrs, and have been babied all their lives (by previous owner and now by me)

About a year ago the transmission started to have trouble shifting into forward first time in the day. It's reproducible at the linkage on the trans body, so I'd think that this is not a linkage adjustment issue.

When it happens, I shift into forward and it does not engage. So far I have been able to resolve it by throttling down, then back up (no need to touch the shift lever). Once engaged, I have no more problems for the rest of the day. there is no noticeable slipping once it engages.

It has never happened in reverse.

It is happening more and more frequently now. Linkage is adjusted, fluid changed regularly (and recently). I use ATF per the label on the trans body (it has had ATF it's whole life). I understand that some folks swear that these transmissions should have 20 or 30W oil. the label says "ATF or SAE 20/30HD".


So I am wondering what are my options. (I do all my own work but I've never rebuilt one of these beasts)

1 - Pull the trans, buy new parts, rebuild it.
2 - Find a used trans
3 - Buy a new one.

In regards to #1, do I need special tools to rebuild it?
In regards to #2 or #3, this transmission is not made anymore, are there recommended "bolt on" newer units?

thanks in advance
bob
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Old 07-06-2012
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

When a hurth gets reluctant to shift into gear, its time to change the fluid. It will look super clean on the dipstick,but will look like mud in a container, when you drain it out.If it's still reluctant, run it a bit, then change it again. That may solve your problem, before taking things apart.
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Old 07-06-2012
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

Thanks Brent, I'll do that in the morning. Do you think I should stick with ATF, or go with 30W?

best,
Bob
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Old 11-11-2014
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

This Transmission uses ATF. Best get it from a Yanmar dealer.
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Old 11-11-2014
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

Buy a good quality ATF from the auto parts store. Penzoil brandd etc. Try flushing out the casing a time or two. Those things can be rebuilt by a quality tranny shop. repalcement parts can be machined...well at least in the third world.
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Old 11-11-2014
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

rinse it a few times with cheap stuff then add really good atf that yanmar specs...do this first like mentioned

always the simple stuff

if it still slips or ois hard to shift a simple rebuild done by YOU is a great way to get another 35 years from said tranny


before you decide to rebuild get a manual for your engine and tranny...some trannies have shift mechanisms(bells) that are adjusteable some dont, some simply need the whole rotating gear assembly replaces etc...I can remember on my 2gm if it was adjusteable or not.

anywho replacing the bearings and output seal will make it last even more

ps. dont get quotes for rebuilding just yet...my advice if you do need to rebuild go to an old automotive rebuilder or motorcycle shop and go to them with a rebuild kit say bearings seals, bushings etc...somewhere around $350-500 including parts would be reasonable to me if having the labor done for you...just you $200 max man.

the simple reason is any marine place is going to quote you at least half what a new tranny costs, which btw on ebay and other places you can get for around $1.5k
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Last edited by christian.hess; 11-11-2014 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 11-11-2014
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

The Kanzakis' have a 'detented' slip-ring gear that is responsible for the shifting. This slip gear (similar in function to a synchronizer gear in an auto manual transmission) works with steel balls being engaged via springs into the R or F section of the trans. This slip gear can easily wear out, simply from long term hard use or improper routine maintenance adjustment of the shift lever on the exterior of the trans. You'll usually hear a 'slight' grinding when the trans. is in F and the engine is in idle if this is the case.

Many of the 'master' Yanmar distributors no longer repair such transmissions .... On the east coast its increasingly and usually: East Coast Marine Transmission ... an excellent and precise marine trans. 'rebuilder'.
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Last edited by RichH; 11-12-2014 at 05:13 AM.
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Old 11-11-2014
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

Quote:
Originally Posted by wnelowet View Post
This Transmission uses ATF. Best get it from a Yanmar dealer.
You can buy quality synthetic ATF just about anywhere.

BTW, Universal recommend changing the oil in my Hurth once a year. I was sceptical about this, and left it two years. The stuff I drained out was dark, and smelled bad. So I am saying it really does need changing frequently - whenever you change the engine oil would not be a bad idea.
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

x2

thank rich for the correct terms regarding the bell and ring assemblies.

and to prove all points here I had my auto tranny on my truck give me error codes and throw me into limp mode(new to me car) issue was slamming shifts and slipping.

first simply adding the correct level atf cured the bad shifting, then a simple drain and new atf cured all the issues including error codes...same applies to any tranny really.

next is a simple filter and gasket change and Im good to go for another oh dont know 60k miles(already has 200k)

back to trannies
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Re: Kanzaki/Hurth KBW10 Transmission trouble

Most Kanzaki's have an INTERNAL 'filter/screen' ... that should be cleaned out EVERY time you change the ATF/oil. This filter/screen guards the small lube oil pump of the trans. If the filter/screen becomes blocked, guess what?
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