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-   -   Hardware Store Epoxy? (http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/94249-hardware-store-epoxy.html)

Rusty123 11-19-2012 07:39 PM

Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
I need to make a couple minor repairs to my boat, one to patch a small hole in the side of my cockpit locker exactly the size of a 1/8" drill bit (not sure where that come from :rolleyes:).

Anyway, can I get away with using the two part epoxy that the hardware store or wally world sells? I know that if I was doing major work, the West Systems product woudl be cheaper, but I just need a tiny amount.

In other words, is all epoxy basically the same thing?

Stumble 11-19-2012 08:18 PM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
Rusty,

No all epoxy isn't the same, and every formulation will have different properties, work differently, and cost differences.

The real question is if hardware store epoxy is suitable for your needs. Without knowing what product you are talking about I couldn't begin to give you an answer. Other than generally for this you would want a thickened epoxy, where the thickening agent does not absorb water. Silica of some sort is ideal, but there are a lot of other options.

deniseO30 11-19-2012 08:21 PM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
it's ok, it just won't hold up to sunlight like gel coat.

Brent Swain 11-19-2012 09:20 PM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
Been using it for decades and never had a problem with it. No epoxy is all that good for UV
resistance.

jameswilson29 11-20-2012 08:53 AM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty123 (Post 950655)
In other words, is all epoxy basically the same thing?

No, the West Marine epoxy costs twice as much because it is marine-grade quality. Plus you get a high-quality, genuine plastic pump with it.

Marine grade describes the willingness to spend twice as much due to the fear of sinking many miles from shore. They have perfected a magical formula, as secret and unique as the special sauce on a Big Mac, which resists salt water, ultraviolet rays, and common sense.

Ordinary manufacturers of products are incapable of fully understanding the marine environment and prefer to design fragile, weak, inferior products in mass quantities which will then unravel, fall apart and disintegrate in the presence of motion, salt water and sunlight.

Stumble 11-20-2012 12:31 PM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jameswilson29 (Post 950883)
No, the West Marine epoxy costs twice as much because it is marine-grade quality. Plus you get a high-quality, genuine plastic pump with it.

Marine grade describes the willingness to spend twice as much due to the fear of sinking many miles from shore. They have perfected a magical formula, as secret and unique as the special sauce on a Big Mac, which resists salt water, ultraviolet rays, and common sense.

Ordinary manufacturers of products are incapable of fully understanding the marine environment and prefer to design fragile, weak, inferior products in mass quantities which will then unravel, fall apart and disintegrate in the presence of motion, salt water and sunlight.

This is a huge misconception that a lot of people have. Most of the manufacturers that I deal with don't take any markup at all because something is going into the marine world (heck we try to shave costs for marine use). There are often real and fundamental differences between a marine part and a standard part, but these differences are not often immediately aparent unless you know exacally what to look for.

One of the best examples is in light fixtures btw. Lowes sells tons of low cost brass light fixtures, so why should anyone buy one from West Marine for double (or more) the money? Simply because West requires their products to be admiralty brass which is an alloy specifically designed to resist de-zincification. It is harder to work with, has a more expensive metal mix, and is used in small quantities than 'common brass' that is about 40% zinc. For most applications having a high zinc content isn't a problem, but put that part on a boat in salt water, and you can almost watch it disolve.



Standard hardware store epoxy like the Devcon sold by Ace has a tensile strength of 1,500psi. Which is pretty strong. But compare it to West System with a tensile strength of 7,900psi, or roughly 5 times stronger. You may it need that strength in every application, but that isn't the same thing as the two are the same.

And those pumps are awsome. Until you have spend days cutting uncored epoxy out of a keel trunk with a chisel, because someone mis-measured the hardner, you can't know how nice it is to know that so long as they use the pumps they can't get it wrong.

jameswilson29 11-20-2012 02:06 PM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Stumble (Post 950957)
This is a huge misconception ...

Standard hardware store epoxy like the Devcon sold by Ace has a tensile strength of 1,500psi. Which is pretty strong. But compare it to West System with a tensile strength of 7,900psi, or roughly 5 times stronger.

Do you have any objective, third-party test results that prove that?

I am not so gullible to accept what a salesman or a manufacturer claims to be true.:)

overbored 11-20-2012 02:33 PM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
is it a locker drain hole or it had a bracket mounted on the inside of the locker at one time. most any thickened epoxy can be used to fill the hole, the issue with epoxy is the UV exposure. it will turn color and degrade in time. it will not match the gelcoat if that is what you have on the surface. if it is gelcoat then you could use a gelcoat repair kit and fill the hole with the matching color.

Stumble 11-20-2012 02:52 PM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jameswilson29 (Post 951011)
Do you have any objective, third-party test results that prove that?

I am not so gullible to accept what a salesman or a manufacturer claims to be true.:)

Those are the physical properties that the manufacturers claim. I don't know about the hardware store stuff, but lets assume it is accurate. The West Systems is ASTM certified to those numbers, so yes there is third party verification of their claims.

jameswilson29 11-20-2012 03:00 PM

Re: Hardware Store Epoxy?
 
Your argument is specious because the ASTM cert (if it exists) does not compare it to the brands available at hardware stores.

Why would I assume your figures are accurate? (I already told you I don't trust what salesmen tell me, unless verified by independent objective third-party proof.)

I bought 3M epoxy resin and hardener at Lowes. It appears the same product is rebranded by West Marine as their epoxy.

I don't believe there is any difference, other than the price and the pump, unless you prove otherwise.


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