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  #21  
Old 01-13-2013
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Re: Ceramic Knife

There's a Zen experience to sharpening knives and it only needs to be done infrequently. If I had a choice between doing it in a garage somewhere or while drinking a happy-hour Carib beer while on the boat in the warm Caribbean I know what I'd choose (and since I posted the pictures, so do you ).
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  #22  
Old 01-13-2013
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Re: Ceramic Knife

"There's a Zen experience to sharpening knives and it only needs to be done infrequently."
Espcially if you have a steel and use it regularly.

Serrated knives can be honed, kinda like a chain saw blade you need the rods so you can sharpen in each "tooth". RFPITA that would be. I hate serrated knives, they hack instead of cutting, but that's why they are good bread knives, breaking through a hard crust and 'fluffing up" the bread as they slice down. I accidentally made a bread with a rock-hard crust last week and had to reach for the bread knife, for the first time in years and years.

But for carving, especially something like turkey, I prefer a real carving knife (Dave, what is it properly called?) where the blade is like a long whippy hacksaw blade, very thin and flexible so it can follow contours and cut clean thin slides. That might have come from Grandma, no brand name in sight on it. Way thinner than what they call a "rare roast beef" knife these days.
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Old 01-13-2013
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Re: Ceramic Knife

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
"There's a Zen experience to sharpening knives and it only needs to be done infrequently."
Espcially if you have a steel and use it regularly.

Serrated knives can be honed, kinda like a chain saw blade you need the rods so you can sharpen in each "tooth". RFPITA that would be. I hate serrated knives, they hack instead of cutting, but that's why they are good bread knives, breaking through a hard crust and 'fluffing up" the bread as they slice down. I accidentally made a bread with a rock-hard crust last week and had to reach for the bread knife, for the first time in years and years.

But for carving, especially something like turkey, I prefer a real carving knife (Dave, what is it properly called?) where the blade is like a long whippy hacksaw blade, very thin and flexible so it can follow contours and cut clean thin slides. That might have come from Grandma, no brand name in sight on it. Way thinner than what they call a "rare roast beef" knife these days.
Carning knife or slicer is what I have used as a term.

This is the one I use
Wusthof Gourmet 9-inch Carving Knife 4502/23

I have my nanas old whip thin blade ( steel isnt high quality) about 1 inch wide,,,very felxible when I want super thin roast beef. For london broil, turkey I use the Wustaff.

Honing a knife on a diamond tipped steel is the best way to keep it continually sharp. Using the stone only takes place one every 6 months or so with me. I only use serated knifes for bread and for steak knives at the table.
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  #24  
Old 01-13-2013
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Re: Ceramic Knife

A nine-inch carving knife? And what do we carve with that, individual roasts or Cornish Game Hens? (VBG)

The words "London Broil" frankly scare me more than "Swiss Steak". The USDA used to allow the name to be attached to nine very different pieces of meat making "London Broil" into a totally meaningless phrase that perhaps only serves to reinforce the myth that "Brits can't cook".
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Old 01-13-2013
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Re: Ceramic Knife

Yes Londron broil is not a cut of meat, but is a fine name for the procedure for cooking meat which does not come from the loin area and is not ready for instant grilling or broiling. The marinade also imparts flavor into other wise non marbled meats. London broiling is one of the most common ways the average family cooks and serves beef so the phrase is neither meaningless not an indication of the inability to serve fine cooked meats.

London broil can be from top round, bottom round, eye round, flank , tri tip, even shoulder areas.

London broil is usually marinated at least a counple of hours with some type of acidic base to break down conective tissue, it can even be pinned. London broil is than quicky grilled/ broiled and slice across the grain with the knife held at a 30 degree angles in thin strips, perfect for a 8-9 inch carving or slicing knife.

Swissing a pice of meat is a production technigue for taking meat with high degree of connective tissue from exercised muscles and eith pounfing ith a cuber mallet or pinning ( running it through a machine with many short needles) to break down the connective tissue to make it mmore tender. The meat is usually the braised. To itilize the many cuts of meat a steer offers different techniques need to be employed to make the meat tender enough to eat.

BTW Boiling is not a correct way of cooking meat as the tendons/ connective tissue shortens up and actaully makes it toucher.

Roasted meats like turkey and most roasts are fine for these smaller carving/ slicer knives also. Same with briskets and corned beef.

One of the most important things about using any tool is to match it to the job, This is also true with knives. With a knife the ability to control it is of prime importance. The use of a knife larger than necessary in the same category can lead to decreased control and not as exact a cut. It is for this reason I have a 7" chefs knife, a 9" ches knife and a heavy 11" chefs knife. I have two types of boning knives one fexible on for fish and a stiffer one for meats. Carving I have three, a 8 inch on for London Broil, small roasts, turkey, chicken, salmon sides, and 10 inch for larger roasts, and finally a 12 in wustaff
The long carving knives are generally pulled for use with whole roasts like 22 lbs bottom rounds, 15 lb tops, prime rib etc. Most family homes do not serve these usually , however restaurants do.

Wusthof Classic Ikon Hollow Edge Flexible Salmon Slicing Knife, 12-inch | cutleryandmore.com
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Old 01-13-2013
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Re: Ceramic Knife

Dave, the USDA thinks "London broil" is a physical cut of meat, not just a style of cooking. http://www.ams.usda.gov/mnreports/lswbfrtl.pdf among other citations, they track how much of it is sold, just like chuck steak.

Lobel's, the arguably reputable butcher shop, also sells it as a product--not a style of cooking.

That salmon knife looks like the one I use on turkeys, except mine doesn't have the nice hollow grindings to lessen friction on the blade. I guess now I know what to use if I ever put up a whole salmon and need to figure out how to slice it!
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Re: Ceramic Knife

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
Dave, the USDA thinks "London broil" is a physical cut of meat, not just a style of cooking. http://www.ams.usda.gov/mnreports/lswbfrtl.pdf among other citations, they track how much of it is sold, just like chuck steak.

Lobel's, the arguably reputable butcher shop, also sells it as a product--not a style of cooking.

That sQUOTE=hellosailor;974954]Dave, the USDA thinks "London broil" is a physical cut of meat, not just a style of cooking. http://www.ams.usda.gov/mnreports/lswbfrtl.pdf among other citations, they track how much of it is sold, just like chuck steak.

Lobel's, the arguably reputable butcher shop, also sells it as a product--not a style of cooking.

That salmon knife looks like the one I use on turkeys, except mine doesn't have the nice hollow grindings to lessen friction on the blade. I guess now I know what to use if I ever put up a whole salmon and need to figure out how to slice it!
Below is the Angus meat chart from NAMP ( North American Meatcutters) showing the primal cuts as well as the subprimals fabricated from them. London Broil is a butchers or retail term which is associated adn in the stroes in our area has been labelsed in the cuts I explained previously. The primals and subprimals are recognized throughout the industry as well as cuilinary fields as the "cuts " of meat and are universal. No where is London Broil used. 35 years ago most London broil was referring to flank steak, but that has changed in the supermarkets now a days. meat cutting is taught to all chefs in culinary schools with regards to primals and submprimals when they are taught to butcher a side of beef.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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[QUOTE]London broil is a North American beef dish made by broiling or grilling marinated flank steak, then cutting it across the grain into thin strips. The origin of the name is obscure; ironically, the dish is unknown in the British city of London.

Many American butchers will label a cut of meat "London broil". This is confusing as the term does not refer to a specific cut of meat, but a method of preparation and cookery. The cut of meat traditionally used is flank steak, but in recent years butchers have labeled top round steak/roast as London Broil.

The preparation of London broil typically involves marinating the meat for several hours followed by high heat searing in an oven broiler or outdoor grill. In both heating methods the meat is placed approximately three inches from a direct heat source and turned several times to promote even cooking and avoid burning. It is then served in thin slices, cut on a horizontal diagonal across the grain. Because the muscle fibers run the entire length of this cut, the meat can be tough if not tenderized via pounding or massaging. Scoring, stabbing, cutting, penetrating, or otherwise mutilating the cut before sending it into the broiler results in a tougher finished product as it allows desirable juices to run out of the meat into the pan. Cooking the flank steak Sous-vide for 48 hours before a quick broil will tenderize the meat and retain juiceness.

In Canada, a ground meat patty wrapped in flank or round steak is known as a London broil. Some butchers will wrap the flank steak around a concoction of seasoned and ground or tenderized flank steak.[1] Others sell a pork sausage patty wrapped in flank or top round steak labeled as London broil.[2] Another variant, popular in Ontario, is a London broil "loaf", wherein the tenderized flank steak exterior is wrapped around minced and spiced veal as the filler. In some regions, bacon will be added between the flank steak and the veal grind[/QUOTE
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Re: Ceramic Knife

Hmmm.. Wusthof, Shun, ceramic??.....Gime my Gramma's Old Hickory , wide blade, blunt nose 12 inch Chef's knife! Old time carbon steel and thick-to-thin, one angle blade profile... except for the very edge, of course
She got it from HER momma, IIRC and it will go to MY daughter. Come ta think hard onnit.. it *coulda* been one the OM snitched from Cooky out in the Pacific Theater, before he left for Stateside
I go out of my way ta buy the odd OH kitchen utensil. I'm not a current or former anykinda Chef; nor do I play one on TV. While I have an appreciation of good steel and have hadda hand on such fine blades as mentioned, for my tasteses and purposes, OH will do

I *do* try ta treat 'em right, tho Guess I'm not too much a Troglodite!! LOL
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Old 01-14-2013
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Re: Ceramic Knife

Hey great I found another worthy subject.
I was just getting bored with out regular subjects: guns, anchors, blue water boats.
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Old 01-14-2013
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Re: Ceramic Knife

Quote:
Originally Posted by deltaten View Post
Hmmm.. Wusthof, Shun, ceramic??.....Gime my Gramma's Old Hickory , wide blade, blunt nose 12 inch Chef's knife! Old time carbon steel and thick-to-thin, one angle blade profile... except for the very edge, of course
She got it from HER momma, IIRC and it will go to MY daughter. Come ta think hard onnit.. it *coulda* been one the OM snitched from Cooky out in the Pacific Theater, before he left for Stateside
I go out of my way ta buy the odd OH kitchen utensil. I'm not a current or former anykinda Chef; nor do I play one on TV. While I have an appreciation of good steel and have hadda hand on such fine blades as mentioned, for my tasteses and purposes, OH will do

I *do* try ta treat 'em right, tho Guess I'm not too much a Troglodite!! LOL
Hey what ever works for you.

Professional chefs and people who work in restuarants want a high quality weighted blanaced knife as thier job depends on it, It is a tool of the trade so to speak. Something which is sharp and holds an edge is safer, and less shock to the hand with repetitive motions will cause less imjuries such as carpal tunnel, etc.

Rarely do you find this in normal house use, but some want quality also. My 8" Henckles 4 star Fench knife has lasted over 32 years and holds an edge like the day it was new, and it was used for years as my weapon of choice. It has saved my hand.

A good knife is a safe knife and a safe knife is a razor sharp knife.

Dave
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