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post #11 of 27 Old 01-15-2013
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

Just a thought but that seems pretty aggressive for a fresh water boat? Was it not always a fresh water boat? Has anyone ever used bleach or other strong chemicals to treat or clean the bilge? Those bolts are quite eroded for the age of the boat which seems almost like a chemical like bleach helped them along..?

While the keel is of I'd love to see a camera shot, with a tape measure, showing the thickness of the keel stub up in the bolt holes....... Just curious to know how thick? I have a number of Sabre customers who've hit rocks and done zero damage to the hull other than to the lead....

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post #12 of 27 Old 01-15-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

Maine,

The boat's first owners were in Maine, then it went to the Delaware Bay. It lived three of its first years in the saltwater, then moved to Chicago and fresh water heaven. Not much time for that damage to occur, but could be done I guess. I never used bleach, but never know what the PO did before me.

I wasn't sure if that was bad corrosion or on the lower end of the spectrum. The yard didn't think it was bad, and wanted to stick it back together the next day, but I'm sure they just want us out of here (we have been living on the hard for 6 weeks now!)

The keel stub is 1.25" thick and the bolts themselves are 3". I attached a few photos, but it is starting to get dark here and the Iphone doesn't like the dark. What is the typical stub depth?




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post #13 of 27 Old 01-15-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

Sorry, I forgot to answer one of your questions. We had no damage at all to the hull or keel stub. The insurance surveyor wanted the keel dropped to check for damage that we couldn't see from the outside or within, but there was no evidence of any issue before we dropped it. No water coming in at all and just the typical smile in the fairing.

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post #14 of 27 Old 01-15-2013
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

I'm wondering, since the bolts look good for an inch or so up from the keel, about using bolt couplers to do the repair without having to put new j bolts in the keel.

And I do mean wondering-I had thought about using them on my fin keel before finding that all my bolts look good-

Maybe cut the present bolts off at 1/2 the length of the bolt coupler, thread the bolt coupler onto that, and then thread all thread into the coupler?

I really don't want to sink you! (But I am wondering...)

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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

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Originally Posted by donlofland View Post
I'm wondering, since the bolts look good for an inch or so up from the keel, about using bolt couplers to do the repair without having to put new j bolts in the keel.

And I do mean wondering-I had thought about using them on my fin keel before finding that all my bolts look good-

Maybe cut the present bolts off at 1/2 the length of the bolt coupler, thread the bolt coupler onto that, and then thread all thread into the coupler?

I really don't want to sink you! (But I am wondering...)

Invite feedback, (but be kind, please!)
I wondered the same thing on the one really bad bolt. The yard wanted to sister in another bolt by this one, but for resale purposes, I don't want to screw around.

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post #16 of 27 Old 01-15-2013
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

Just thinking with my finger tips here... can you not burn them out yourself? or better yet use a hole saw from the side until you hit the bolt and saw that with the hole saw too?
Then put in new J bolt, melt the lead that came out, flux and pour it in? Lead does work like wood somewhat. but then.. how does one justify a DIY non certified repair....
Catalina sells lag bolts for repairs I hear it works

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post #17 of 27 Old 01-15-2013
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

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Originally Posted by funjohnson View Post
I wondered the same thing on the one really bad bolt. The yard wanted to sister in another bolt by this one, but for resale purposes, I don't want to screw around.
Sorry to hear of your troubles, we proactively tackled this project last off season and it was a pretty anxious time. Our motivation was not in response to a grounding event but rather a keel smile that existed when we bought the boat. We were seeking peace of mind after Mainsail's posts and eherlihy's experience. I think you're making the right decision in doing the repair correctly. The advice you've been given was the best we found and we were ready to do it if the situation warranted.

In preparing for the worse, I called both Mars and Broomfield and Sons before dropping the keel. Both were very professional and spent as much time as we needed in discussing the project. What you may run into at this stage of the season is timing. We started calling in the Fall and were told to get the work booked now as the longer into the off season we waited, the less likely we'd have it ready by Spring. Their workload may be different this year, but it's worth looking into.

In the end we got lucky as our bolts looked great, but it was an anxious day waiting for the yard to drop the keel. We had a couple strong references for Broomfield, but after speaking to both operations I was comfortable with working with whichever one could get the job done sooner. The difference in cost was negligible, but I would think that working with a US based company might be easier logistically.

Best of luck to both of you
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post #18 of 27 Old 01-15-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

Do you remember the estimated cost for either Mars or Broomfield? Neither of them have gotten back to me yet.

Thanks,

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post #19 of 27 Old 01-15-2013
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

I would suggest that you have done the hard part; dropping the keel. If I were you, I would now send it off and have any of the questionable bolts replaced.

If, however, you wanted to cheap out, you could simply drop the boat back on the keel, and put another nut on top of the existing nut (the current one on the really bad bolt would act as a spacer) and you'd be good to go. To be clear; I am not advocating this, but it is a solution for your consideration.
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post #20 of 27 Old 01-15-2013
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Re: Keel J bolt replacement in lead keel

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Do you remember the estimated cost for either Mars or Broomfield? Neither of them have gotten back to me yet.

Thanks,

Matt
Broomfield charged $450 per bolt in 2010. This is detailed in the post that I linked to above.


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