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post #61 of 196 Old 01-24-2013
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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

McMaster-Carr, Grainger, or a local pump supply house.

This information Pump Packing Installation is for replacing the packing on a pump. The principles are the same. Just imagine a pump with a shaft as big as your rudder stock. Don't use graphite packing, however.
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post #62 of 196 Old 01-26-2013 Thread Starter
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So today was first day of outright boat ownership. So all the tools are out. After about 6 hours of Blaster, Kroil that has been on frozen stuffing box for a week, torch/heat, grinder to ease the two sides of the stuffing box, some close to shaft dremel work, with lastly some sledge hammer on screwdriver applied to side of box, it it still frozen. No movement at all. Zero.. The stuffing box will now turn I side the lower tie but that is it. Not sure what to try next. I also removed all quadrant bolts including the thru-shaft and tried applying sledge to top of shaft. Same result. So what next? I am not frustrated. This will resolve. And the hours spent today have taught much about the boat from companion way to stern. So all is well. Just need a few ideas and
maybe more time for kroil to work. Is it ever a good idea to think about cutting off and removing the lower tube and start from hull up? For those new to this thread see photos above. Thanks all. I won't do much til next weekend.

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post #63 of 196 Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

Are you still trying to free the stock rotation? or trying to remove the rudder outright? or both?? Just to be clear.. all the cables/etc are disconnected and the bare blade/stock in the tube is what's 'stuck'. Given that the stuffing box is still in place do you have any confidence that the penetrants and solvents have actually made it down inside the lower tube section? Anything dripped out below the boat?

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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

Yes I am till trying to free the rudder shaft rotation. I assume that to be precursor to dropping the rudder Shaft. Assuming the stuffing box will need to be cut off, I anticipate having to drop the rudder in order tonjnsert new stuffing box. In terms of pennants, it does NOT appear they are getting down through box and rudder tube. Whatever stuffing is still there is hard as concrete. Very hard to penetrate. I can move the rudder from below by sandwiching it with 8' 2x4s for leverage. With leverage I can move rudder about 3" either side of straight ahead. The problem is that the shaft is still frozen to the box and the box is spinning inside the rudder tube. I am beginning to wonder what all is inside the rudder tube and how far iinto the tube the box extends. I also wonder about the top of the rudder Shaft. I have not found one but would not be surprised to find it keyed.
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post #65 of 196 Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

Unless the quadrant actually rested on the gland there will be some sort of key/washer/retainer to prevent the rudder from dropping. Usually access to the top of the stock is retained to enable use of an emergency tiller.. Got anything like that?

Btw I'd be willing to bet the boat was originally tiller steered.. Any indication of that? In the 60s wheels were kinda rare under 30 feet or so.

Ron

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Capt G E Ericson (from "The Cruel Sea" by Nicholas Monsarrat)
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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

The quadrant was not on the bladder. It had a key but obviously was not the key holding the rudder shaft up. So yes there must be something else. See the pic of the rudder topside in the cockpit. Yes it was originally tiller steered. The small whole visible on the shaft head does not appears to be a key. I ran wire all the way through and found nothing. See pics.
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post #67 of 196 Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

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Originally Posted by rbyham View Post
The quadrant was not on the bladder. It had a key but obviously was not the key holding the rudder shaft up. So yes there must be something else. See the pic of the rudder topside in the cockpit. Yes it was originally tiller steered. The small whole visible on the shaft head does not appears to be a key. I ran wire all the way through and found nothing. See pics.
That sure looks like a woodruff key on the front side of the shaft. Also, the top of the shaft appears a bit beaten up (pounding on it?) I'd recommend grinding a small chamfer on the top edge of the shaft as well as ensuring that is either not a key or removing it if it is.

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post #68 of 196 Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

I think i can see a set screw hole in the side of the collar below the keypiece.. (don't think that's a woodruff, looks a straight keypiece to me but either way it's gotta come out.) Probably an allen key hex sunk into the collar, and there should be one on each side at least. I don't think that old fibre top 'bushing' will need to come out (with the one loose bolt).

EDIT:

Quote:
small whole visible on the shaft head does not appears to be a key. I ran wire all the way through and found nothing. See pics.
Is the hole you're referring to the one I think I'm seeing? in the shinier collar piece against the deck? There could be a spring pin in there then, if you're getting a wire through it. A spring pin would look like this in the hole: Get a dentists mirror and have a look....


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Capt G E Ericson (from "The Cruel Sea" by Nicholas Monsarrat)

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post #69 of 196 Old 01-27-2013
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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

You could be right - it appears to me that the bottom of it (near the collar) sits "in" more than at the top end - the way woodruffs "rock" sometimes. Either way, it sure looks like a key that has to come out.

You're probably right about the roll pin - that needs a drift of the right size to tap it out. I've never seen a roll pin used on a rudder shaft before.

I, myself, personally intend to continue being outspoken and opinionated, intolerant of all fanatics, fools and ignoramuses, deeply suspicious of all those who have "found the answer" and on my bad days, downright rude.
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post #70 of 196 Old 01-27-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Frozen rudder shaft Hinterhoeller 28

I think you are both correct on the Woodruff. But my guess is the purpose is to serve as connector for emergency tiller which I do have onboard. As far as a spring pin that could be accurate as well. I will explore further on that one. Finding right sized drift may be a challenge but I agree something of a pin sort must be holding the rudder up in addition to the frozen box below. The only other thought I have is that below on the shaft just above stuffing box was a collar type thing held in place by two Allen wrench screws. Still not sure what that is for. You can see it in orig photos.
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