SailNet Community banner
  • SailNet is a forum community dedicated to Sailing enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about sailing, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, repairs, reviews, maintenance, and more!

Topsides going from 'White' to flag blue

11K views 47 replies 19 participants last post by  Haffro 
#1 ·
I am going to paint my topsides this spring (if it ever gets warm enough). I am going to use flag blue Interlux brightsides. I used Interlux Perfection on the deck, and had trouble if the conditions were not perfect. Anyway, my question is, how perfect does the prep need to be? My Bristol 27 has very fair sides due to the thick hull. There are some scratches I will repair. O/w, am I crazy to go to a dark color in a DIY (roll and tip) paint job?
 
#32 ·
Beautiful.... how about detailing your prep time & efforts..
 
#33 ·
As politely as i can what big thing besides a house have you painted before ?

I can design you a completely custom one off frame and fabricate it and paint it perfectly in my garage with and hours help from my mitering machine

And when i say paint i am talking as close to flawless as a one off can be













Now as good as i am at that painting a mast with Perfection was a humbling experience ;) at the i never painted anything before in my life

The paint and methods and project scale SO DIFFERENT



You just went from a 6 x 6 work area to a 6 x 40 foot work area





Now you have to work OUTDOORS with the bugs and dirt and humidity and temperature changes and about 37 other ands i cant think of right now

And not the least of which is now your work area is a about 14 x 35 feet or about 10 longer than your boat and BUGS LOVE THE PAINT









There is more time in that paint then the complete refit

Absolutely every step now goes from hours to weeks except for the few hours it takes to roll & tip the paint
 
#34 · (Edited)
For Tiger Lily. The hull took on-and-off from end of February to May. I wiped (hand buffed is more accurate) the entire boat in MEK. Then I palm sanded not quite to the primer (although the primer showed in some places). Then I put on a layer of gray primer. Sanded that ... twice. Then the first layer of Awlgrip Carinthia Blue; Sanded again (400 grit). A second layer of Awlgrip within a few days; Sanded again. Then the final layer. There are drips and runs here and there. But only I see them. And to see them, you need to put your face at least two feet from the surface. The cove striping is masked gold Awlgrip ... as is the warm white boot stripe. The vinyl lettering is from BoatUS. Prep time (sanding etc) = 85%, Painting 10%, Vinyls 5%
 
#36 ·
Yeah, your right. That picture looks darker than in person, but it really depends on the light. This picture (below) is probably a little more accurate ... if not exaggerated in the other direction. The one drawback that I found with the Carinthia blue ... is that Awlgrip doesn't offer a touch-up kit for it. The closest is Flag Blue.

 
#37 ·
As politely as i can what big thing besides a house have you painted before ?
I painted the deck and topsides of my Catalina 22, and the deck of our Bristol 27. Took a really long time. I used Brightsides for the C22 and Perfection for the deck of the B27. However, all of this has been in white, or light colors. I really don't care about making it perfect. I am confident that the B27 will not have much waviness because it is a thick hull. I just want to get rid of most of the scratches.

Oh, and I spray painted a beater bike day-glow orange. It was awsome.
 
#38 · (Edited)
I am a former Awlgripper, Awlgrip teacher both spray and roll and tip. You can get spectacular results rolling and tipping. If you know what you are doing. You can get acceptable results as a novice, too.

There is very good advice in this thread.

Dark colors require as near perfect a surface as possible. Long boards are the way to fair the hull. I make a couple from plywood that will fit the available abrasive strips. Kirfing the backsides of the plywood will make them as flexible as you need. Not too flexible, they need to stay flat against the hull. Having handles that are comfortable is possible, too. They will show you the imperfections and they will take time and effort. How close to perfect do you need? Follow with at least 320, preferably 400 to "polish" the prime coat. Good technique with a dual action orbital sander using a soft pad will give you a tacked surface that has a shine to it. Over do the tack off cleaning before you apply the top coat. Invest in a couple of gallons of alcohol and some lint free material to wipe with after you have washed the hull with mild soap and water and let it dry. When you think it is dust free do it again. White wipes for a dark color primer so you can see how much dust you are still moving around on the surface.

I am finally going to paint my flaking gelcoat this year. My boat was re gelcoated white over its original flag blue by a po. I kind of like the comfort we enjoy when a mishap has the potential of marking the hull. O-well! The Admiral will help and it will be fun having a "new" boat.

We are going from white / blue to red. Since my gelcoat is flaking off it will have to be removed or most of it will. I used to be able to hold onto a wildcat for an hour at a time. We will see if that strength is at least partially still here. I will grind the gelcoat down and keep it as fair as i can. I have done a lot of this. Good scaffolding is essential. If you can, get enough scaffold to go the length of the boat. It not only makes the job easier but safer and results in a better job.

I have a free source of excellent two part high build epoxy in red so my primer will be the same color as my topcoat. This is a huge help in both topside coverage and future scratches. If you do use an epoxy primer tint it so the contrast between your topcoat and the primer is minimal. Long boards! Yes!

We will roll and tip the top coat. I haven't decided which paint yet. Brightside is a possibility. If I get a fair /polished red prime surface I could just clear it! Ha!

A tip on tipping. You need to keep the wet edge. A helper is important if you can find one (The Admiral)? It isn't a disaster if your first coat is a training / practice opportunity. Don't roll a lot at a time 12 to 14 inches of rolling then tip then roll then tip. Try to keep the paint film thickness constant. You can apply a little pressure with the roller to spread it out uniformly. Roll up and down the hull and tip horizontally. The eye is more forgiving of horizontal marks than vertical ones.

When you roll there should be small bubbles. They shouldn't sag. They may dance a bit. You knock them down tipping. Getting the paint's viscosity correct is the key. Each paint is a little different and weather conditions (temp and humidity) make a difference. There is a device you can buy at a paint store called a viscosity cup. It allows you to reproduce the "perfect" mix of paint and reducer every time. Remember paint is a mixture of several solvents. They "boil off" just standing in the pot so pay attention to viscosity changes. A Zahn #2 viscosity cup or its equivalent measuring 17 seconds is my ideal for white Brightside enamel here in July in Maine! Ha!

Don't be intimidated. Resist the urge to remove the bugs. Let the paint dry first. Enjoy!

Down
 
#40 ·
Down - Could you expand on the long boarding a little. What kind of imperfections is this stage aimed at? Is is the small stuff like what would look like scratches or a rough texture, or is it to beat down long waviness, like what would be produced from a hard spot at a stringer or bulkhead?
 
#44 ·
The long boards are for fairing. DA sanders are for smoothing. Fairing would be taking any dips or gouges out. If your rotator cuffs are in good shape it will speed up sanding when you prime the entire topsides. Technique again and for me an adjustable height platform to work from. The truth is a 30' boat's topsides amount to about the surface area of 4 sheets of plywood placed end to end. Not such a big area. An 80' Swan is a little bigger;)

I do it this way:

A working platform that can be adjusted to keep my shoulders at the level of the section I am boarding. LITTLE REACHING UP OR DOWN. Chest high so you can "lean into it comfortably". Back and forth with the two handed board around 30 degrees to horizontal. The distance between the handles matters too. I make my own simple boards. Their length and the handle locations are adjusted to my comfort. They are usually about 3' long. That can vary depending on abrasive availability and the surface condition. You can make a 2 man board, too. The other "guy" should be about your size!:D

A day of this is plenty! My arms are folded in front of my chest for part of the stroke. My hands are shoulder width apart. Extending as far as comfortable on each stroke. Rocking back and forth front foot to back foot establishes a rhythm and adds to the momentum. Switch direction, hands and feet. 30 degree scratches intersecting the previous ones in the opposite direction. Intersecting scratch patterns cut material much faster. KEEP THE BOARD FLAT AGAINST THE HULL FOR ITS ENTIRE LENGTH. Adjust the platform height and make another pass. Repeat as necessary. Remember it is a labor of love!:)

You can gain, boarding down to 220. Stepping down your abrasive grits is a judgment call. Depending on how much fairing is required starting with fairly coarse grits will shorten the time. It is a lot of work trying to remove the scratches from 50 grit with anything finer than 80 grit. Don't move to, too fine a next grit in the hope it will save time.

When the eye tells you things are right and your hand feels things are right, you are ready for the dual action sander. Same working platform. A figure 8 overlapping pattern as you work over the surface from one end to the other. This should involve no more pressure than what is required to hold the sander against the surface. Learn to look at the surface.

Depending on how bad things were or how good things are, alternation the primer colors slightly will give you a visual gauge of the surface condition as you sand. This can be a very subtle change in color that you create by having a small amount of the same primer with a different color to tint the base of your primary, primer. A job that requires fairing gets a final prime coat after fairing is done. If you get it on nice and smooth (you can roll and tip the primer, too) a DA sander will do the final polishing. If the final primer color is the same as the topcoat it will increase your chances of success. I always try to use a primer that is close to my topcoat color. For a red top coat that is particularly important. Each color covers differently. White is the easiest.

I am at the point where the calories I burn doing this become part of the record! Don't start if you have a heart condition!:laugher Wear dust masks that work and eye protection. I suffer with a full face respirator even for the sanding.

Enjoy,

Down
 
#41 ·
To beat down long waviness, like what would be produced from a hard spot at a stringer or bulkhead
 
#42 ·
Fiberglass resin continue to cure/shrink for years. It does so unevenly on the topsides, as the structure behind it is different where ribs, stingers, etc, are laid. You can hardly tell on white or very light topsides, as the reflected waviness causes it to be light upon light. When you paint the topsides dark, the subtle waviness causes reflection to be light upon dark and becomes very noticeable at certain angle but not others. I don't even believe you can feel it with your hand. Straight lines and right angles do not appear often in nature, so your eye is drawn to them. It's referred to as 'printing'.
 
#43 ·
Barq,
we painted whiskeyjack three seasons ago. Going from robin's egg blue to sapphire blue, I knew that any imperfections were going to be a problem, so I laid two coats of thick primer on, then sanded most of it off.
Whiskeyjack Weekend Makeover






Brightside was the product of choice. Three years later it has held up well, and has been field-fix friendly. scratches and dings are easily covered, in water.
 
#45 ·
I made a mistake in my last post. We used Flag Blue PERFECTION, not brightsides. Anyhow, we finished the boot stripe yesterday and are pretty happy with our results. We painted at Cape Marina in Florida. The yard is full of sand and dirt and the wind is always kickin' so we couldn't be happier with the shine we were able to get!

Here's the pic I promised on our facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...88856469.50607.131035800376118&type=1&theater

Kelley
sailingchance.com
facebook.com/sailingchance
 
#47 ·
That's what I thought - it looks more like Brightside Dark Blue than Flag Blue.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top