Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22? - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Gear & Maintenance
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree2Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 03-16-2013
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 15
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Mor22 is on a distinguished road
Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

We were very surprised to find how much differently our friends Tanzer 22 turns compared with our Morgan 22 which is rated equally for racing, being similar displacement, rig size etc. Their boat is very light and nimble, especially tacking, while our Morgan is quite staid through the turns but fast once she gets going. What makes such a difference between the two boats, given the same helmsperson? Could it be a difference in the rudder? Theirs is more of a foil design while ours is the original Morgan pop up type. I know there are super duper rudder designs out there but would be disinclined to cough up $800 unless I see a huge difference.

But right now, I am helming an SUV and my friends have a sports car and it is driving me crazy!

Any thoughts?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 03-16-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 656
Thanks: 3
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 8
Siamese is on a distinguished road
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

According to Professor Irwin Corey, that's actually a two-part question. Why is the Morgan faster?

Why?
Of course.
Is the Morgan faster?
Yes, it is.

Which might be about as useful answer as you're likely to get.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 03-16-2013
fallard's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Mystic
Posts: 901
Thanks: 0
Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts
Rep Power: 6
fallard is on a distinguished road
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

Looking at the underbody of both boats, it would appear that the Morgan has a partial full keel housing a centerboard, whereas the Tanzer has a fin keel. The Tanzer foil should be more hydrodynamically efficient in a turn and therefore more responsive, given that the rudder arrangements are similar.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 03-16-2013
SchockT's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: North Vancouver, BC
Posts: 1,426
Thanks: 1
Thanked 27 Times in 25 Posts
Rep Power: 3
SchockT is on a distinguished road
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

Yeah I would have to agree with Fallard. It looks like there would be alot more resistance to rotation on the Morgan. The Tanzer probably also has a more powerful rudder.

Keep in mind that turning fast is not necessarily the fastest way to turn! (except perhaps in the prestart!)

__________________
1979 Santana 30 Tall Rig
Hull#101
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 03-16-2013
bljones's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Coast Ontario
Posts: 8,212
Thanks: 33
Thanked 74 Times in 67 Posts
Rep Power: 8
bljones has a spectacular aura about bljones has a spectacular aura about
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

The keel's the deal, and the hull swell as well.
The Tanzer is fatter aft of the fin, while the Morgan has more keel and is fatter at the center of the boat.
The only obvious solution is to sell your Morgan and buy a Tanzer. You can buy a good Tanzer for less than $3k and sell your Morgan for about the same money.
__________________
It's 5 o'clock somewhere:


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 03-17-2013
Melrna's Avatar
Crazy Woman Boat Driver
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: New Bern NC
Posts: 783
Thanks: 16
Thanked 13 Times in 10 Posts
Rep Power: 11
Melrna will become famous soon enough
Send a message via AIM to Melrna Send a message via Yahoo to Melrna
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

My first boat was a Tanzer 22. I loved that boat. I raced her for 3 years before selling her due to overseas rotation. I would out sail every boat on the lake except a J22/24. I always thought the racing authorities had the PRF wrong on the boat. I didn't complain because they had me in the same league as the Catalina 22 at the time (1978-1981). I could do circles around a Catalina 22.
__________________
Melissa Renee
Moondance
Catalina 445, Hull #90
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 03-17-2013
rugosa's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: In a strange land
Posts: 517
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts
Rep Power: 4
rugosa is on a distinguished road
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

It's French Canadian mon amis, say no more, oui! Those French, they are so fast, no?
blutoyz likes this.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 03-17-2013
blutoyz's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 640
Thanks: 10
Thanked 11 Times in 10 Posts
Rep Power: 3
blutoyz is on a distinguished road
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rugosa View Post
It's French Canadian mon amis, say no more, oui! Those French, they are so fast, no?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #9  
Old 03-17-2013
chucklesR's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Pasadena Md - Magothy side
Posts: 5,979
Thanks: 10
Thanked 31 Times in 31 Posts
Rep Power: 10
chucklesR is a jewel in the rough chucklesR is a jewel in the rough chucklesR is a jewel in the rough
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

Full keels just don't turn like a fin keel.

Here's the deal, take him into shallow water and see how fast he can turn

All boats are compromises.
__________________
Lessons learned are opportunities earned.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #10  
Old 03-18-2013
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 15
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Mor22 is on a distinguished road
Re: Why does Tanzer 22 turn faster than Morgan 22?

Well thanks for the input so far. Most interesting. I should have clarified that our friends Tanzer actually is the centreboard version and they have been sailing it without the board down, so they have a "stubby" keel, which is a little more than we have without our board down.

Having put new sails and rigging on our Morgan, we won't be parting with her any time soon to buy a Tanzer, though I can see the attraction of that boat. With bad knees it is easier to walk around the side of our boat than step up onto the cabin roof of the Tanzer.

SchocktT- could you explain the "turning faster is not necessarily the fastest way to turn"

I am looking at making the rudder more of a foil shape to improve handling. If anyone has any favorite web information links for a project like this, please share.

Thanks
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Faster than a Cal 20 rlltrash Boat Review and Purchase Forum 11 03-17-2013 03:38 PM
How to fly spinnaker faster mikehoyt Racing 21 06-28-2007 03:17 AM
Which tack is faster? RayMetz100 Learning to Sail 5 12-11-2006 06:22 PM
Faster than the Wind Dan Dickison Seamanship Articles 0 10-20-2000 09:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:32 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.