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  #11  
Old 05-03-2013
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Re: Bobstay condition

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainemandean View Post
If anyone wants to see the cracks I found, go to:
Photographs © Dean Abramson
as the pix have been updated.

I will replace the turnbuckle.

I only want/need to replace the lower turnbuckle. The rod seems fine. I have taken it all apart; it was simple. From top to bottom it's a toggle, turnbuckle with eye, rod, turnbuckle with eye. You loosen it all by turning the rod which has flat spots for a wrench. I was amazed how easy it all came apart.

I would be happy to replace with a bronze turnbuckle, but am yet to find anyone who makes bronze ones of that type and size. ??

Dean
Dean, I understand that you want to keep the costs down. But, please keep in mind that the rod is just as old as that turnbuckle and is made of the same material. Rod is nothing more than single strand wire. When it goes, it doesn't give you any warning. Did you carefully inspect the cold heads? You do realize that the part of the turnbuckle that you have photographed is only one half of the turnbuckle right? The other part, which you didn't photograph is attached to the rod.
Keep in mind also that the bobstay is one of the most heaviliy loaded stays on the boat due to it's shallow angle.
I would strongly advise you to bite the bullet and replace the bobstay entirely. FWIW



Also, If you have a Navtec turnbuckle on the bobstay, I would not be surprized if you have them on the rest of the rig as well. If you do, it's likely that they are of the same vintage. I hope you've inspected everything carefully.
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  #12  
Old 05-04-2013
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Re: Bobstay condition

Quote:
Originally Posted by knothead View Post
But, please keep in mind that the rod is just as old as that turnbuckle and is made of the same material. Rod is nothing more than single strand wire. When it goes, it doesn't give you any warning.



Also, If you have a Navtec turnbuckle on the bobstay, I would not be surprized if you have them on the rest of the rig as well. If you do, it's likely that they are of the same vintage. I hope you've inspected everything carefully.
The rod is not the same material as the fittings. the fittings are made of 316L stainless steel and the rod is cold drawn Nitronic 50. Nitronic 50 has twice strength and much greater corrosion resistance then the 316 stainless steels. it is also engineered to be cold headed
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Re: Bobstay condition

Replace the whole bobstay. Although the wire might be in good condition, it will fail sooner than you think.
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Re: Bobstay condition

Thanks for all the input, gang.

There seems to be some confusion about how my bobstay is made up. I found an old photo, which you can see at:
http://www.mainephoto.com/folios/Bobstay-011.jpg
which shows the whole thing.

Top to bottom: bronze fitting on sprit, toggle, turnbuckle w/ eye, rod, turnbuckle w/ eye, bronze fitting on boat's bow. You can just make out, near the top, one of the two flat spots on the rod for use with a wrench. You turn the rod to loosen the rig, then pull the clevis pins to disassemble. The top turnbuckle is identical to the bottom one, but in great shape.

Everything looks in good shape except for that cracked bottom turnbuckle, which is all I will replace. I agree that the rod is a different material, and it looks fine.

Dean
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Re: Bobstay condition

Quote:
Originally Posted by overbored View Post
The rod is not the same material as the fittings. the fittings are made of 316L stainless steel and the rod is cold drawn Nitronic 50. Nitronic 50 has twice strength and much greater corrosion resistance then the 316 stainless steels. it is also engineered to be cold headed
Yes, I know that they are different types of stainless, but I meant that they are both stainless steel.
Anyway, my point is that for the cost of four or five feet of material, Dean could enjoy the peace of mind that would come knowing that the bobstay rod which is at least as old as the rather severely cracked turnbuckle that it has been attached to has been replaced. It seems to me to be a no-brainer.
At the very least, the rod should be removed, inspected and possibly re-coldheaded. And both terminals should be replaced.
Look again at that turnbuckle and tell me that you disagree with this.

A couple of useful links.

Rigging service Guidelines - Navtec - Page n° 10 - PDF Catalogues | Documentation | Boating Brochures

Nitronic 50 Stainless Steel | Specialty Steel Supply
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Re: Bobstay condition

Is there any way on this forum that I can set it up so I get an email when there has been a new post in a thread I am active in?

I keep having to just come here and look. Seriously, this is the 21st century! ;-)

By the way, all the rest of my standing rig was replaced two years ago; the turnbuckles are all bronze.

If someone can point me to a bronze version of that bowsprit turnbuckle, please do. I keep hearing references to it, but where's the beef? ;-)

Let's all go sailing! (Oops, can't; got no bobstay.)

Dean
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Re: Bobstay condition

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainemandean View Post
Is there any way on this forum that I can set it up so I get an email when there has been a new post in a thread I am active in?

I keep having to just come here and look. Seriously, this is the 21st century! ;-)

By the way, all the rest of my standing rig was replaced two years ago; the turnbuckles are all bronze.

If someone can point me to a bronze version of that bowsprit turnbuckle, please do. I keep hearing references to it, but where's the beef? ;-)

Let's all go sailing! (Oops, can't; got no bobstay.)

Dean
Dean, I am certain that you can go to your CP page and set it up to recieve emails.

I have pointed out that you can get turnbuckles from a variety of sources. West Marine, SailNet store, Sailing Services, Defender, Rigging Only, etc, etc.
I don't understand what the problem is.
If you are bound and determined to reuse your old rod, then you need to get it to a rigging shop capable of coldheading and have a stud terminal attached in order to use a standard open body turnbuckle.
If you don't want to do that, and you still want to reuse the rod, then your only option is to buy the lower turnbuckle part that is cracked and then just screw it onto the old stuff and take your chances.

My recommendation is to simply have a new bobstay fabricated out of 5/16" 1x19 wire, (the largest diameter that uses a 1/2" clevis pin size).
Any rigging shop can do that for you. Or, you can purchase all the material and using mechanical fittings, do it yourself.
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Re: Bobstay condition

I am just finishing a complete refit of a Cape Dory 30c. All standing rigging was replaced. The Bobstay was inspected by the rigger and found in good shape. But being a perfectionist I can't stand all new rigging and old Bobstay. So I will swap it out. That way I know the condition of the rigging and have a valid reference date in the logbook.
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Re: Bobstay condition

QUOTE: I have pointed out that you can get turnbuckles from a variety of sources. West Marine, SailNet store, Sailing Services, Defender, Rigging Only, etc, etc.
I don't understand what the problem is.


I have looked at many of those sources, and so far I have no found a bronze version of what I already have. Maybe I have missed it. I dunno. Don't mean to be contrary. But if someone can point me to one, that would be great.

Whether I ought to be going that route is another question. I understand that and appreciate the feedback. I now have one of Maine's best riggers on this case, and I'll let you folks know what we do.

Dean
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Re: Bobstay condition

Thanks for posting this picture. I didn't see it before my last post.
What you have there, essentially, is a long navtec turnbuckle for a bobstay. You have no coldheaded ends. Just a double jaw toggle, and an eye/eye Navtec turnbuckle with a very long center stud. The stud may be made of a piece of rod, ie Nitronic 50, but is likely not. It probably is simply a long piece of some other stainless material threaded on the ends.
Any good machine shop could make up another and you can order the ends online and you will have a new bobstay.
It is obvious that the bobstay was not replaced two years ago when the rest of the rigging was. It should have been.
I urge you to get rid of it!
I reiterate;
Quote:
My recommendation is to simply have a new bobstay fabricated out of 5/16" 1x19 wire, (the largest diameter that uses a 1/2" clevis pin size).
Any rigging shop can do that for you. Or, you can purchase all the material and using mechanical fittings, do it yourself.
You would need;
One 1/2" open body turnbuckle with t-bolt and toggle. (I would orient the backstay so that the turnbuckle is at the top)



One 1/2" Sta-Loc stud for 5/16" wire.



One 1/2" Sta-Loc eye for 5/16" wire. (for the bottom)



And four or five feet of 5/16" 1x19 wire.

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