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post #21 of 44 Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Backing up (or not)

Make sure your A4 reversing gear is adjusted to give you enough thrust.

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post #22 of 44 Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Backing up (or not)

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Originally Posted by chucklesR View Post
I have a Maxprop so in theory I have no prop wash - in practice I have minimal prop wash.
I have a Maxprop on our Hunter 40. But I'm new to the boat and the prop and don't really understand exactly what a Maxprop does.

What I DO know is that the boat does incredibly well in reverse - with very, very little prop walk. I had to move it to our new slip a few weeks ago (my first time really handling the boat in close quarters). I was extremely nervous - as the boat felt like an aircraft carrier compared to my previous C27.

To make things more difficult, I had to back it in for my shorepower cords to reach the cockpit. And to make things even more difficult, I had wind blowing directly into the slip.

I asked the broker who sold me the boat - a seriously good guy and veteran sailor in the area named Pat - to help me as I didn't want to try it with just the boys aboard. I did just fine backing it out of the slip at the boat yard that re-did my rigging. Piece of cake.

When we got to the new slip, he walked me through what I needed to do - which was come into the fairway pretty tight to our dock (leeward), then right at our slip, turn hard to port to get the bow through the wind and swing the stern to align with the slip - then back down quickly.

I tried this 5-6 times (Pat's a very patient guy) and finally got the stern going into the slip, but I was always too timid with the initial turn which allowed the bow to blow off to starboard. So even though I got good initial alignment with the stern, I always got a little too sideways to reverse in cleanly. Pat made me keep trying. I was able to control the boat in the fairway and keep us away from the hard bits as we kept at it.

Long story short...at my request, Pat finally showed me how. But he warned me that he was already a couple of Manhattans into the evening. Regardless, he did a great job - still getting us a bit sideways as the bow blew off, and crunching my life ring a bit - but we got her in.

It made me feel good to see that it's NEVER that easy - even with tons of experience. And it made me feel REALLY good when he complimented me on my boat handling. I'm feeling a bit more confident for the next try.
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post #23 of 44 Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Backing up (or not)

To the OP, You cant surf when there are no waves and you cant sail when there is no wind so why would your try and make your boat do something it physically cant. Learn the characteristics of your boat and always be one step ahead. Tip, forget about your rudder in reverse, the prop has more effect that the rudder, use the prop walk to your advantage.
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post #24 of 44 Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Backing up (or not)

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucklesR View Post
.............................. I have a Maxprop so in theory I have no prop wash - in practice I have minimal prop wash.
I appreciate your wisdom with this statement. It's a benefit of the Maxprop to use the same leading edge of the blade in forward and reverse. So, in theory you would have the same prop walk in reverse as forward. I think that is only the license of salesmanship that promotes the statement of "No prop walk". Of course the prop walk in reverse is accentuated by not having the prop wash over the rudder and that still stands true with the Maxprop in reverse. The Maxprop only has no prop walk in reverse to the degree that there is no prop walk in forward, but, of course, there is prop walk in forward. Final answer, the Maxprop has far less prop walk, but not with "no" prop walk.

I haven't addressed the fact that you used the terrm prop wash. I just figured that was intended to be prop walk for you would never move without prop wash!


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post #25 of 44 Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Backing up (or not)

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Originally Posted by CaptainForce View Post
I appreciate your wisdom with this statement. It's a benefit of the Maxprop to use the same leading edge of the blade in forward and reverse. So, in theory you would have the same prop walk in reverse as forward. I think that is only the license of salesmanship that promotes the statement of "No prop walk". Of course the prop walk in reverse is accentuated by not having the prop wash over the rudder and that still stands true with the Maxprop in reverse. The Maxprop only has no prop walk in reverse to the degree that there is no prop walk in forward, but, of course, there is prop walk in forward. Final answer, the Maxprop has far less prop walk, but not with "no" prop walk.

I haven't addressed the fact that you used the terrm prop wash. I just figured that was intended to be prop walk for you would never move without prop wash!
Thanks for the explanation Force. After my last post, I looked it up and saw the explanation you just gave for how it works. Pretty cool.

When I'm at the boat this weekend, I'll do the prop-walk test in the slip to see how much push we're getting in reverse.


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Last edited by smackdaddy; 07-16-2013 at 06:24 PM.
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post #26 of 44 Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Backing up (or not)

On my Edel 22' I turn the outboard when in reverse and keep the tiller str8.

I think something disconnects the tiller whenever the Honda is in "R"....I cannot see that connection but I will find it one day.

or perhaps my brain's RAM is overloaded unless it is in "F"
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post #27 of 44 Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Backing up (or not)

Smack, I had a Maxprop on my last boat, a Niagara 35 with longish fin keel and big spade rudder. In general there was very little prop walk but I learned that if you wanted some, eg to pull the stern into a dock you could goose it in reverse for just a second or two and you would get a quick jump in the desired direction - you did choose the dock to allow this of course?

Back home on Lake Ontario after something over 36,000 nm circumnavigator. Not surprisingly there is a lot of stuff I want to get done on Ainia both cosmetically and functionally. Getting an early start so it will be ready to go for next summer (Lake Superior?).
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post #28 of 44 Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Backing up (or not)

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Originally Posted by killarney_sailor View Post
Smack, I had a Maxprop on my last boat, a Niagara 35 with longish fin keel and big spade rudder. In general there was very little prop walk but I learned that if you wanted some, eg to pull the stern into a dock you could goose it in reverse for just a second or two and you would get a quick jump in the desired direction - you did choose the dock to allow this of course?
Of course not. I have no idea what I'm doing!

I chose my slip purely based on it being among the ones that survived Ike - and was only $260/mo for a 40 footer. BAM!


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post #29 of 44 Old 07-16-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Backing up (or not)

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Originally Posted by barefootnavigator View Post
To the OP, You cant surf when there are no waves and you cant sail when there is no wind so why would your try and make your boat do something it physically cant. Learn the characteristics of your boat and always be one step ahead. Tip, forget about your rudder in reverse, the prop has more effect that the rudder, use the prop walk to your advantage.
I'm trying to figure out what the boat will do because it is so different from other boats.
In all other boats I have operated I could count on the the prop walk at low speed before the the speed was sufficient to make the rudder work.

This boat has surprised me on some occasions. Instead of prop-walking to port in reverse as would be expected it has moved starboard.
Sometime port sometimes starboard.

It obviously has a cause it it not magic. I'm thinking that the reason is that the prop-walk effect is overwhelmed by the currents effect on the keel and in one case topside windage.

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post #30 of 44 Old 07-16-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Backing up (or not)

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Originally Posted by Barquito View Post
Make sure your A4 reversing gear is adjusted to give you enough thrust.
What adjustment are you referring to?

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It is a lesson about the limitations of wax as an adhesive.
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