Boatyard transducer installation mistake - Page 3 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree3Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #21  
Old 08-06-2013
overbored's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dana Point, Ca
Posts: 1,004
Thanks: 1
Thanked 41 Times in 41 Posts
Rep Power: 5
overbored is on a distinguished road
Re: Boatyard transducer installation mistake

Quote:
Originally Posted by katsailor View Post
Glueing the transducer inside the hull affects the performance of the depth sounder. This method of installation may be adequate if you only want to find the depth right before you run aground.
maybe you should let Airmar know, the manufacturer of almost all transducers used buy the top instrument builder. they might like to know that what they have been selling for the last 20 years does not work. and I must be the only one that they sold one to that works perfect
__________________
"FULL TILT" SOVEREL 33
"GOLD RUSH" PRINDLE 16
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #22  
Old 08-06-2013
bratzcpa's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Kalispell, MT
Posts: 80
Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 4
bratzcpa is on a distinguished road
Re: Boatyard transducer installation mistake

Warning - - -thread drift ahead.

I mounted my transducer (Lawrence) inside my Catalina 27. I didn't drill any holes, just cleaned up and smoothed a section of the hull and then used a big glob of plumbers putty and squished the transducer into it. It reads extremely accurately. Fish and bottom structure show up nicely. It has enough power to read down to 250 or 300 feet (depending on speed). the temperature sensor also works accurately too, however, it takes a little longer to adjust for temp fluctuations than if it were submersed in water directly.

Best part - - NO holes. And I can remove the transducer in 5 seconds and transfer over to one of my other boats easily.

Perhaps one reason why this works so well is that this is a solid fiberglass hull/bottom (no coring here)???

~markb
__________________
~markb

S/V "New Girl" on the dock

Catalina 27
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #23  
Old 08-07-2013
Learning to sail
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 113
Thanks: 1
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 5
aaronwindward is on a distinguished road
Re: Boatyard transducer installation mistake

Yeah, my temporary solution was the transducer glued with silicone to the inside of the hull at an appropriate place. I had upgraded from an ancient early 1970s neon tube-based Raytheon system to a networked, digital system, that had a fishfinder built into the chartplotter. I don't actually fish, but it seemed at the time that more data can only be good, and I took a gamble on the extra cost. I've decided it was totally worth it; I frequently switch into fishfinder mode in depth-sensitive spots, and now I'd never go back to having just a depth number. (Most of the SF Bay is relatively shallow, and while mostly being full of thick mud, running aground is basically something I'd like to avoid at all costs.)

It worked reasonably well. One challenge is that I don't have an especially good flat spot, so it was glued right at the keel, forward of the fin. I had to experiment quite a lot before I found a good spot, using the bag-of-water trick. One thing that freaked me out unnecessarily is that the silicone did not seem to conduct the pulses until after it had set. So basically, right after putting everything into place, the fishfinder couldn't really track the bottom, but the next day, it worked. I don't have a clear idea of why this was.

The main trouble I had is that there's a lot of noise, all of the time, as well as a good amount of 'surface clutter,' which I assume are sonic reflections within the hull itself. I constantly see things that look like fish or other submerged objects, and I basically ignore them. The depth number works fine the majority of the time. But it doesn't some time, apparently when the bottom is funny or the conditions are a little sketchy. I think it's always been when I thought I was in deeper water, but it's disconcerting to not know for sure, especially when I know my course comes near to a known shoal.

The main thing I'm trying to accomplish upgrading to a through-hull is to get additional display clarity, and eliminate the noise and phantom fish. I'm speculating that the "shoot through" is less shoot-through and more "vibrate large portions of the hull." Certainly a through-hull isolates the sonic element, since it's encased in a fairly heavy bronze fitting, so I think this a reasonable thing to expect, if not especially scientific. But something a little more concrete is that I'm definitely going to get a significant improvement in signal gain, which should add clarity even if the isolation effect isn't as significant as I think.

So I think if you merely wanted the depth number, in-hull is totally OK. But I think anyone installing fresh electronics should strongly consider an integrated fishfinder (if they're going to get a chartplotter anyway), and if so, maybe the through-hull will make a noticeable difference.

Of course I'll update once they get the thing installed correctly, and it gets back into the water. (Who knows when that will be.) I won't be able to make careful comparisons unfortunately, because I didn't have the foresight to capture some of the old soundings, but I'm hoping for a pretty significant objective difference. We'll see if it pans out!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #24  
Old 08-07-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Michigan
Posts: 616
Thanks: 33
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 9
abrahamx is on a distinguished road
Re: Boatyard transducer installation mistake

I'm curious how much it costs/costed you for a transducer install. I'm needing the service if I decide not to do it myself.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #25  
Old 08-07-2013
BubbleheadMd's Avatar
Chastened
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Edgewater/Annapolis
Posts: 3,034
Thanks: 1
Thanked 60 Times in 56 Posts
Rep Power: 6
BubbleheadMd will become famous soon enough
Send a message via Yahoo to BubbleheadMd
Re: Boatyard transducer installation mistake

Quote:
Originally Posted by abrahamx View Post
I'm curious how much it costs/costed you for a transducer install. I'm needing the service if I decide not to do it myself.
What kind of depth finder does the boat have now?
__________________
S/V Old Shoes
1973 Pearson 30 #255
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #26  
Old 08-07-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 675
Thanks: 1
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 6
lancelot9898 is on a distinguished road
Re: Boatyard transducer installation mistake

Several years ago I replaced my depth transducer and had the yard install a new thru hull for the new transducer. The labor cost was 2 hours at $100/hr. I was not too happy about the amount of time taken to install that thru hull, but the removal of the old fitting was difficult due to its location, plus I was there to observe the whole process and the guy was busy the whole time. That time did not include running the wire back to the helm which I did myself and it did take me a full 3 hours in doing that. Not sure if a pro could have done it any faster considering that I had to snake the wire up thru the binnacle.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #27  
Old 08-08-2013
Learning to sail
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 113
Thanks: 1
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 5
aaronwindward is on a distinguished road
Re: Boatyard transducer installation mistake

Here was the original quote:

Install two transducers in old locations (Owner supplied)
Hours 4.50
Rate $107.00/hr
Labor $481.50
Materials $158.90
Total $640.40 (plus tax and environmental fee)

So that would be ~$320 for one.

However, I expected that it would come out to less than that, one of them ended up being a new installation (The old knotmeter location was not ideal, and I decided to leave it plugged for now.), and other I did the work of removing the old transducer and fairing, so it's only slightly more work than a new installation. The materials might also be high, since I don't actually require a fairing or anything other than a backing block and sealant, paint, etc.

Unfortunately this hitch has screwed things, since they basically get to make up 'how long it would have taken them,' and I still haven't heard back from the yard, so we'll see. I'll update the final price when I know it: seeing the yard rates that other people have been getting has been very helpful to me, and I'd like to share the love.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rookie Mistake saltydawg Living Aboard 9 06-29-2009 03:08 PM
Evercoat Gelkote-Was a mistake to use! saurav16 Gear & Maintenance 12 12-17-2008 05:36 PM
In-hull depth transducer installation gbillman Morgan 0 09-07-2008 12:08 PM
1983 Newport 27S-II Hull construction and Sonar Transducer Installation Stenn Newport 2 10-06-2007 04:38 PM
Have I made a mistake? rdstanley Boat Review and Purchase Forum 9 11-25-2006 08:24 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:06 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.