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  #11  
Old 08-07-2013
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Re: Document or register my vessel?

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Originally Posted by capta View Post
From what I understand getting a non-previously documented vessel documented is not something for the faint of heart. You must get every previous owner to sign an affidavit that there are no liens against the vessel and they have no claim to it.
Not in my case and I don't think this is correct. I documented a 1980 vessel in 2007 and had the document a week after I started the process. All I had to show was the title from Michigan where I bought the boat and the subsequent Maine registrations. This was all done online with scans of the documents.

Since I could not produce an original builder's certificate, the year of construction is left blank on the documents and I do not have the option changing the recreational endorsement so I could do something like six pack tours.

The vessel documentation center is probably the most user friendly and responsive government agency you will ever deal with.
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  #12  
Old 08-07-2013
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Document or register my vessel?

I hope that I am not co-opting this thread but how about this scenario, please:

I am a resident of Arizona. I am buying a boat that's registered in Florida but stays in the Bahamas where the POs have kept it for years with an annual Cruising Permit. I plan to keep it there too for the next couple of years, at least, spending six to eight months a year living aboard and sailing the Bahamas, progressing deeper into the Caribbean as confidence grows, only visiting Florida occasionally and briefly to equip and provision.

The boat is CG documented and I plan to renew that. It'll be insured. Given my plans to use it, should it be state registered? Would that be Arizona? What advantages or disadvantages should I consider? Am I obligated to pay someone sales or use tax?

Thanks.
Scott
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  #13  
Old 08-08-2013
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Re: Document or register my vessel?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Long View Post
Not in my case and I don't think this is correct. I documented a 1980 vessel in 2007 and had the document a week after I started the process. All I had to show was the title from Michigan where I bought the boat and the subsequent Maine registrations. This was all done online with scans of the documents.

Since I could not produce an original builder's certificate, the year of construction is left blank on the documents and I do not have the option changing the recreational endorsement so I could do something like six pack tours.

The vessel documentation center is probably the most user friendly and responsive government agency you will ever deal with.
It seems things have changed, sorry to mislead.
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Old 08-08-2013
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Re: Document or register my vessel?

In Florida, at least, it is not a choice between documenting or registering. It is a choice between documenting with the USCG or getting a title issued by the state. You have to have one or the other. Regardless, you have to register the boat (though if it is documented you do not have to display state registration numbers).

Again, this is for Florida. Not sure about the rules in California. My point is that you have three different issues to deal with here--documentation, titling, and registration. How they work together, and what your choices are, varies from state to state.

Good luck.
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Old 08-08-2013
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Re: Document or register my vessel?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AKA44 View Post
I hope that I am not co-opting this thread but how about this scenario, please:

I am a resident of Arizona. I am buying a boat that's registered in Florida but stays in the Bahamas where the POs have kept it for years with an annual Cruising Permit. I plan to keep it there too for the next couple of years, at least, spending six to eight months a year living aboard and sailing the Bahamas, progressing deeper into the Caribbean as confidence grows, only visiting Florida occasionally and briefly to equip and provision.

The boat is CG documented and I plan to renew that. It'll be insured. Given my plans to use it, should it be state registered? Would that be Arizona? What advantages or disadvantages should I consider? Am I obligated to pay someone sales or use tax?

Thanks.
Scott
The reason I registered in FL was because FL actively tickets vessels that stay there >90 days if not FL registered. They also ticket documented boats with no state registration. In NY and FL, you get to prove you've paid sales tax or pay sales tax when registering. For Florida, I had to show a receipt from NY, (where I was registered previously), to prove tax had been paid. If the amount paid is < the FL amount, you get to cheerfully pay the difference. In Florida, you need to be state registered somewhere regardless of whether U.S. documented. There was a lot of controversy about the ticketing of documented vessels a while back but I think the FL policy is still the same.

+1 on praise for the USCG documentation staff for being very efficient.
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Old 08-08-2013
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Re: Document or register my vessel?

I've owned boats in California, some state registered and some documented. As long as you are not planning on going out of the country, it doesn't make much difference. California will reach out and get its taxes regardless.

The one good thing about documenting is you don't have to deal with the DMV. It took me over two hours to register a dinghy there, as the employees don't deal with boats very often and so they get confused. So if you go the State route for registration, try to pick a DMV that is closest to a marina, bring your bill of sale, and be ready to pay sales tax unless you have proof that you already paid the tax.
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Old 08-08-2013
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Re: Document or register my vessel?

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Originally Posted by Roger Long View Post
Not in my case and I don't think this is correct. I documented a 1980 vessel in 2007 and had the document a week after I started the process.
I wish that was the case now. I filed my paperwork back in the middle of April. The NVDC is JUST NOW getting to papers filed in April. NJ DMV (where I'll register the boat) was insistent that the boat HAD to be documented at the USCG (it was previously documented) before they would register it. I know that isn't right, but since my plan was to document it anyway, I didn't put up a fight. Once I get the USCG documentation, I'll head back to NJ.
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Re: Document or register my vessel?

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Originally Posted by jimgo View Post
I wish that was the case now. I filed my paperwork back in the middle of April. The NVDC is JUST NOW getting to papers filed in April. NJ DMV (where I'll register the boat) was insistent that the boat HAD to be documented at the USCG (it was previously documented) before they would register it. I know that isn't right, but since my plan was to document it anyway, I didn't put up a fight. Once I get the USCG documentation, I'll head back to NJ.
Ugh. At least you didn't have to deal with this one: My boat was built in the UK in 1971. This was before boats had standardized HINs, so my hull number is a simple 4 digit number. This just blew the minds of the good folks at the NY DMV. Took me multiple trips and arguments with the supervisor before they would let me pay sales tax and register the boat. It didn't help that my CG documentation says "Year unknown". This is because the NVDC refused to accept a copy of the Lloyd's build certificate for my boat, showing the keel being laid in 1971, as evidence of the year of build because it did not also indicate that an engine was installed at the time! They didn't seem to care that said engine was at that time listed on ebay and a nice new shiny one was in the boat ...
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  #19  
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Re: Document or register my vessel?

I think you're giving the NJDMV too much credit; I don't have my registration in hand yet! My boat was a bankruptcy asset and I have a bill of sale from a bank (which isn't the owner of record, but which had a lien). I hope the DMV will accept the argument that the USCG, which is federally authorized to maintain ownership/title records for documented vessels, thinks the evidence I presented is OK so the DMV should too. But, again, I may be giving the NJDMV too much credit.

To the OP, sorry, didn't mean to hijack the thread. Hopefully you've figured out that documenting the vessel with the USCG can help streamline things a bit, but that the documentation process is slow.
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