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  #71  
Old 11-25-2013
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Thumbs up Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

Quote:
Originally Posted by deniseO30 View Post
Thank you Sean from oday sailboats on Facebook.
It's a long vid, the young man doing the narration is really good too! Enjoy! It gives me hope in the younger generation.
the guy making the video is not right. No guy in his right mind would leave three young women to fend for themselves sailing the islands while he explores garbage in the fields of Haiti.
Great video thanks for sharing
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  #72  
Old 11-25-2013
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

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Originally Posted by bfloyd4445 View Post
the guy making the video is not right. No guy in his right mind would leave three young women to fend for themselves sailing the islands while he explores garbage in the fields of Haiti.
Great video thanks for sharing
lol. yeah right. he said he was tired of sailing. i guess when you're tired of sailing with three young women, walking through fields of garbage, alone, is attractive. good observation.
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  #73  
Old 11-25-2013
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

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Originally Posted by unimacs View Post
Understood. I don't really have anything more to add (of value) anyway. Plus I have a respect for Captain Jack and his world view even if we aren't in complete agreement.
the respect is mutual, sir
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  #74  
Old 11-25-2013
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

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Originally Posted by unimacs View Post
Since I really don't know what Moxie's background is, it is also tempting for me to bring in a lot of my own history and the people I've know in an attempt to draw parallels.
very true. it is all guess work on my part, especially since the video is purposely deceptive about some facts. i hadn't considered that. one thing i will bet on: even if moxie and his crew are just acting the part, it's that group of kids which he is aiming at.

i agree with everyone here that has said about the questionable things they were supposed to have done. wrong action is never excused by situation. however, i also think, as has been suggested, that those things might not be what they were depicted to be.

already, i suspected the nature of their 'stolen 'materials to have been taken from the construction site dumpster. for one thing, new materials are usually in 8 foot lengths, or better. i can't see them sneaking away with a 4X8 sheet of plywood. of course, that's another issue. real plywood isn't usually used on a jobsite anymore. those days are past. most often, sheathing is OSB or a structural foam insulating material. neither of which would really work for a boat. OSB is really crap, as far as structural use. anyhow, flooring is usually Advantech or another, similar, composite wood product. very heavy, although structurally sound for interior use. i wouldn't use it for too many things on a boat.

as some of you may know, i am presently fixing up an old cal27. i guess i joined the anarchist yacht club. lol. recently, i made a call to the super of the jobsite next to the one i was previously working on. i needed a few materials to replace a couple of missing access panels and to make companionway steps. he told me i could have whatever i needed. i did find a new composite sheathing material that was very rigid. good for access panels. they don't have to take a ton of weight but it was much better than OSB, anyway. i did get a small piece of advantech, for the step treads, and some 2X6 material for the risers. anyhow, i wouldn't use advantech for anything else, in a boat, just because of weight. but my point was that you don't have to steal scrap material from a jobsite. it helps to have connections but, usually, if you ask, a super will let you have some, especially if you let him know what your project is. it's going to be trashed, anyway. but, again, there isn't a lot of stuff, on a site, that is really good for a boat. i didn't see anything, on the interior of their boat, that looked as if it was made of readily available construction materials, either.

then there is that bit about the dinghy hoist. there is a boat where, my cal is berthed, that has that exact dinghy crane. i saw the video before i saw that boat, so this did not occur to me at the time i saw the video. but, that crane would, in no way, be capable of lifting a few hundred pounds of mast. steel tubing only has so much strength and the harware on it would only be strong enough to fulfill it's intended purpose. hand made things are sometimes over engineered but never production goods.

so, i agree with others who have posted. i don't think those illegal elements really did happen. i think it was for effect. street cred, as one poster said.

Last edited by captain jack; 11-25-2013 at 11:16 PM.
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  #75  
Old 11-25-2013
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

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Originally Posted by christian.hess View Post
yup...I had this issue as a trainer down here...we went to schools, malls, shops everything....
we got 1 kid whose dad said it was better to sail than play video games... ONE!


all the other moron parents did not want the kids to be in a dangerous place( a lake), they wanted them to be "close" to town...not far away...etc...all excuses

and they said that sailing basically sucked...whats the point when you can play soccer(main sport down here) or ride motocross etc...

this at very high end private schools...in public schools in poor communities guess what?

parents were as happy as can be to have their kids do something other than be parts of GANGS...which is a huge deadly issue down here

goes to show...reality is different for everyone as is where you live, grow up and work etc...

I miss this job tremendously as I felt I was not just working but spreading the word if you will...
this quote is from the future of sailing thread, but i think it is relevant to this discussion. criminal actions aside, it could be that the future of sailing is in the hands of people like moxie's crew and not in the 'upper crust' of society. the 'upper crust' has wealth and wealth may have moved on to bigger, flashier things...at least in the younger generations.
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  #76  
Old 11-26-2013
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

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the shrinkage of the middleclass, due to the present 'progressive' administration's policies
Right - right after the 'great recession', that started during a 'regressives' tenure by the way, the whole vibrant middle class went poof! That thinking is with the fairies and shows such a lack of understanding that it is pointless in arguing. The middle class has been shrinking for decades since a paradigmatic shift to fresh water economics. In order to maintain a middle class lifestyle people took on higher debt made easy by, you guessed it, de-regulation. Woo Hoo freedum! The catalyst was the risk-taking banks that were bailed out by the tax payer. The kind of socialism those capitalist love. Easy money!

Our goal might be one and the same but the methodology employed in attaining it is diametrically opposite. It appears you prefer more of the same of 'trickled upon' supply side economics that this recession has proven empathically is not tenable while I prefer a demand side paradigm that has led in the past to a shared prosperity. History bears this out.

One last thing, the debt is falling faster then at any time in history but don't let that fact get in your way.
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  #77  
Old 11-26-2013
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

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Originally Posted by ScottUK View Post
One last thing, the debt is falling faster then at any time in history but don't let that fact get in your way.
One minor correction - it's the annual DEFICIT that's been dropping, the national debt, not so much...

Another trend conveniently ignored by some, but may be of considerable interest to many sailors out there whose cruising kitty might be significantly tied to investment income:

Dow Jones index on January 20, 2009: 7,949

Dow Jones index at closing yesterday: 16,072

Now, that's the sort of "Progressivism" Capitalists love to hate... :-)

Last edited by JonEisberg; 11-26-2013 at 08:26 AM.
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  #78  
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

Cheers for the correction Jon.
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  #79  
Old 11-26-2013
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

Can you guys at least have this boring, wonky discussion in rambling, floral prose? What would Kerouac think?

Shameful.
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  #80  
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Re: This is hope! (3 young adults fix P30 and head out to sea)

Quote:
Another trend conveniently ignored by some, but may be of considerable interest to many sailors out there whose cruising kitty might be significantly tied to investment income:

Dow Jones index on January 20, 2009: 7,949

Dow Jones index at closing yesterday: 16,072

Now, that's the sort of "Progressivism" Capitalists love to hate... :-)
Sorry I didn't have the time to comment on your post earlier Jon.

I think rep. and main stream dem. are both wrong in terms of their economic perspectives. About your post pointing out the record levels of the stock markets I would say it is just another case of asset price inflation. This can be an engine for increased demand and economic growth but is short term and as we have seen in the past markets can and will go the other way. Participation in these markets tend to come from the financially advantaged unlike debt driven demand I alluded to earlier.

Neither of these growth models are sustainable in the long term and have decimated the middle class for decades. The only way to achieve a robust middle class is to restore the link between productivity and wages. It is what Keynes deemed the 'virtuous cycle'. More productivity increases wage growth - wage growth leads to more productivity. This cycle leads to full employment and is what built the middle class in the first place.

Sorry Smack that this wasn't in prose but I do find that a well written, model driven economic argument to be a form of poetry. Not that this drivel comes anywhere near achieving this. Though, perhaps, it likely can be considered rambling.
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