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How big a holding tank vs. camping

14K views 114 replies 40 participants last post by  newhaul 
#1 ·
MikeOReilly started about a thread what amenities are required to make being on a boat a step above camping.

I commented that a good, reliable head is high on my list. This comes from my experience actually camping (cabin without a toilet = camping, cabin with a toilet = condo), and from a charter I was on two years ago.

There were seven of us on a beautiful 39' 3-cabin Jeanneau. That's a bit tight, but I don't think it's an unreasonable number of people for a 3-cabin boat.

Except… for the 22-gallon holding tank! We were only out for three days and we were taking conservation measures like running a couple dinghy trips over in the morning so people could poop in the outhouses on shore, and when we were on shore for hikes or bonfires reminding everyone to pee before we went back to the boat, but we still filled that tank.

So my question is: What's the rule-of-thumb for holding tank size? I know it will vary from person to person and situation to situation, but assuming moderate beer consumption and a minimum of three days between pumpouts, how many gallons per person should a holding tank be?
 
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#8 ·
1-3 gallons pp/per day, with 2 being a fair average depending on the head and the water/beer consumption. You can get one by dry bowling and conservation flushes, and three after Mexican Food night.

There is a rule amongst cruisers:

If its yellow, let it mellow. If its brown, flush it down.

Brian
 
#10 ·
1-3 gallons pp/per day, with 2 being a fair average depending on the head and the water/beer consumption. You can get one by dry bowling and conservation flushes, and three after Mexican Food night.

There is a rule amongst cruisers:

If its yellow, let it mellow. If its brown, flush it down.
Since that makes for a stinky boat we have a different rule. If you are a boy and aren't in a marina then you pee over the side (legal, even though bucket and chuck it is not).

A 20 gallon tank lasts 5-7 days of cruising for us, a sample size of one couple.
 
#11 · (Edited)
Widely available online, couple of links below. If you think about it, the gross factor of sealing a bag of your own waste is way less (or should be) than dealing with hoses and tanks filled with a group of people's waste that sits for days or weeks at a time. But, gross factor aside, we mainly do it because of the efficiency and ease of not having to maintain and empty the marine system/tank.

Cleanwaste WAG BAG Waste Bags - Package of 12 at REI.com

 
#15 ·
Boy you guys are good. I ve a lot to learn. Have choice of fresh or salt. Use fresh always except when offshore and need to conserve potable water. Much less stink and I think easier on the system. Wife insisted on electric so have one electric one manual both with macerators. Down side is even with three settings on electric use way more water then you folks are posting. Upside is have two holding tanks. The one for electric fills first. Have tank monitors. When other gets near usually time for fuel or pump out or a great excuse to go outside the limit. Conclusion is if tank size is a concern don't put in electric head. Have had guests push button repetitively fascinated by the flush until told to stop.
 
#16 ·
Funny, the discussions between the ladies at the yacht club somehow always get around to poo and holding tanks. Something that was an eye opener for us was the 18 gal tank in our specifications only measured out to a paltry 13 gallons! The two of us are very comfortable for a weekend but really have to practice conservation when we are off the grid for a week or more. We installed a tank watch system for obvious reasons. When you are using the 1-3 gallons per day metric is that assuming a one gallon flush per use? My friend who has a boat by a European builder also discovered his tank was less than advertised.
 
#17 ·
I'm surprised this isn't a bigger thread. A lot of us "day sailors" struggle with this problem. We don't "cruise" in the real sense. But, we do spend several days at a time on our boats. And, we have female crew, which is all I'm going to say about that. It's a three day weekend for me, and my one goal is to tear out my 70's era head, and then decide which way I'm going to go in regards to "solid waste". I'm looking forward to reading the responses in this thread. So far, I'm leaning towards a composting head. Although, the aforementioned poop bags look like a contender as well.
 
#19 ·
Our 15 gal tank lasts the two of us a week. We wash down solids and let liquids flow on their own. We don't use the salt intake unless we are out and going directly overboard. Inland the thru-hull is closed and we use the shower head to rinse the solids. I would prefer a bigger tank, but that's we have.
 
#21 ·
The 8 gallon holding tank I had in my Norsea was the biggest I could get into the space available. Filled up way too fast and was waa-a-y too much trouble. It was the "controlling" system on the boat when in inland waters. When poop - not potable water/not fuel/not food/not beer and rum and coffee - becomes controlling then a solution is needed.

So we starting using Wag Bags. Better...but still a PITA.

My C-head was the solution and I will never go back to a holding tank. Not much greater effort than the toilet on the farm. Still have to clean it. Don't have to use Rid-x for the septic. Never have to wiggle the flush lever when the valve starts to leak. Never have to adjust the lever-to-chain connection when the throw is too small or too great for efficient flushing. Never have to replace the "guts" of the tank because of leaks or corrosion of internal parts. Never have to worry about the wax seal leaking.

Doesn't feel like camping to me. YMMV.
 
#22 ·
Camping is, if you take it in, you take it out, including the POO! Had to do that on Mr Rainer. Ther joke up there is about blue bags. Blue for the poo, and clear to make sure the blue does not leak into the back pack! With the typical one or two per day......well anyway. Not an issue with the liquid part of the equation.

It would be nice if the holding tank was larger than the water tank........but, none the less, ANY tank is better than the one in my 8' pram I had............

Marty
 
#24 ·
Camping is, if you take it in, you take it out, including the POO! Had to do that on Mr Rainer. Ther joke up there is about blue bags. Blue for the poo, and clear to make sure the blue does not leak into the back pack! With the typical one or two per day......well anyway. Not an issue with the liquid part of the equation.

It would be nice if the holding tank was larger than the water tank........but, none the less, ANY tank is better than the one in my 8' pram I had............

Marty
Are you serious?? You are not allowed to leave a deposit on Mt. Rainer? To me, camping (quite a bit in western PA and Ohio, when I lived there) was dig a hole, do your business, cover it up and be on your way. As natural as the setting sun. My area was all forest though, I guess Mt. Rainer is a lot of rock and glacier, maybe that's why there are special rules. Are you rules for Mt. Rainer for just above the tree line? (Assuming there is a tree line.)

On topic: For Argyle, we currently have a 9 gal. holding tank which is not sufficient. It's location is also not sufficient. A PO placed the tank in a cabinet in the V-berth. So if the tank grows a bit ripe, the V-berth get's the brunt of it. I'm currently working on designing and installing a 25-30 gal. holding tank under the cabin sole, beneath the head and V-berth. It will have much better ventilation and any smell will be confined to the bilge area.
 
#29 ·
Then you have a holding tank problem. My boat doesn't smell like that. And there is no chance in Hades that my wife (and hey, I will throw myself in that category too) would poop in a bucket permanently. If there is a massive head failure, hey, we do what we gotta do. But permanently???? Not thanks.

I am not going to tell you what to do on your boat... but if it had been me, I would have fixed the holding tank and head issues. Frankly, it is not that expensive to do.

Anyways, my opinions.

Brian
 
#25 ·
It really gets me that humans are the only animal not permitted to relieve themselves on a mountain. There is a right and wrong way to do it, so that others don't have to sleep on the fresh. However, do some believe we don't belong on earth?

Back to holding tanks. While I've done it, I do not think its a good idea to leave urine in the bowl, if you have an electric macerating head. I'm trying to picture the setup, but I'm pretty sure the jocker valve is after the metal macerator, which will corrode in time.

Flushing clear water is the primary key to keeping the head and hoses from smelling. Salt water is fine, if it doesn't lie around long enough for organisms to die, as long as its clear and all waste has been flushed to the holding tank. With a vented loop above the water line, it takes a minimum of 1 gallon per flush to do so. More, for some reason, if you have an electric head.
 
#28 ·
It really gets me that humans are the only animal not permitted to relieve themselves on a mountain. There is a right and wrong way to do it, so that others don't have to sleep on the fresh. However, do some believe we don't belong on earth?
ever seen the stuff we eat? Aside from pets, we are the only species that consistently eats stuff that many species would consider poisonous. You may think that your poop is benign, but it is not, it is full of the stuff our bodies could not process.

why do you think it smells so badly?

And before anybody goes on about direct discharge, I can remember when marinas smelled like cesspools. there -is- a reason they make us have some way to store our **** on board
 
#30 ·
Ive been a yacht broker on and off for 25 years and of the thousands of boats I have been on they all smell like do do you are just used to it or don't have a sensitive nose :)
I will say though where you think pooping in a bucket is a nasty affair I think sucking 25 gallons of poop out of a boat to be a deal breaker :) You say potato I say potato??? something like that
 
#32 ·
Our boat does NOT smell like it. Likely what you are smelling is the anaerobic bacteria and sulfur smell common with flushing as they grow in the fresh water line and populate. THat has nothing to do with poo. A fix for that is simple: put in a inline strainer with a CL tab. I have done this for years and it has left my boat smelling 'boat-show new'. Before that, my boat had a smell which I traced to that. It wipes out that bacteria and what is often associated with poop smell. Just so you know, that sulfur smell will hang around the inside of a boat for a while. I wonder if it may be heavier than air? Anyways, a well built and maintained holding tank system should not stink. It should be a fully closed system that vents to the outside. If it does you may have hose problems, aeration problems, maintenance problems, or a small leak somewhere.

As far as preferring to bag your poop versus pumping it out, I won't argue that point as it is a personal decision. I guess you do know when your tank is full though! (smile)

BTW, I have been cruising since 2000, raised kids aboard basically since birth, and owned fixed keels since the mid 90s or so. I am not new to this either.

Brian
 
#33 ·
Been doing this near on 35y and have been pooping longer than that. Boats can have boat smell but never poop smell. Poop smell means something is wrong. May be as simple as clogged vent line or as bad as need for a rebuild. Knock on wood never had a failed leaking holding tank. Right now need to shorten sani pipe from head discharge to holding tank as it's too long giving a small amount of back flow. Once done no reason for smell. On prior boats have had to add enzyme but now with fresh H2O flush additives not needed. If you have smell or are needing to add things constantly may want some advise as to what's going on. Could be the piping- common with old boats or production boats the best piping was not used.
Also found the tea tree stuff really works to get rid of boat smell. That and good ventilation with a full wash down of all surfaces with vinegar once a blue moon.
 
#35 ·
I'm a member of a very small minority of people who prefer a porta potti to any other system. People are reluctant to consider a porta over a holding tank system, but why anyone would prefer a bucket to a porta potti is beyond me, unless you think carrying a bucket of poo past your friends in the cockpit is a good conversation starter. Don't trip! And really, you'd rather sit on a bucket than a toilet seat?!?

Our porta never smells, unless it's left fairly full for a long time. A quick dump and clean and the smell is GONE. Easy to dump it...our Thetford has a spout that swings out and allows easy draining into a shoreside toilet. You just carry it there like a briefcase. You can label it "affordable healthcare act".

No worries if someone wants to use too much TP or drops a feminine product or two in there. Try that with a holding tank.

I, too, am on the great lakes where discharge in the water is not legal, but I've found myself out on the lake with no other boats in sight and with a full porta potti. You'll never guess what happened next!

A good porta potti is 75 bucks, and they tend not to break. Obviously, no repair can ever cost you more than 75 bucks.
 
#40 · (Edited)
I'm a member of a very small minority of people who prefer a porta potti to any other system. People are reluctant to consider a porta over a holding tank system, but why anyone would prefer a bucket to a porta potti is beyond me, unless you think carrying a bucket of poo past your friends in the cockpit is a good conversation starter. Don't trip! And really, you'd rather sit on a bucket than a toilet seat?!?

Our porta never smells, unless it's left fairly full for a long time. A quick dump and clean and the smell is GONE. Easy to dump it...our Thetford has a spout that swings out and allows easy draining into a shoreside toilet. You just carry it there like a briefcase. You can label it "affordable healthcare act".

No worries if someone wants to use too much TP or drops a feminine product or two in there. Try that with a holding tank.

I, too, am on the great lakes where discharge in the water is not legal, but I've found myself out on the lake with no other boats in sight and with a full porta potti. You'll never guess what happened next!

A good porta potti is 75 bucks, and they tend not to break. Obviously, no repair can ever cost you more than 75 bucks.
And how many days or weeks can you stay out without a dump? I have owned porta-potties. You are even more restricted than us.
 
#47 ·
For those wondering about the Rainer part, that is ON the glaiciers etc. Not too many other animals besides us humans. Well, a few birds, not many........

along with, one can see the trailer if one looks hard enough from teh paper/poo etc along the side of the main trailer if you can call it that, going up the main route on the glaciers one goes up.

At muir, they have a really expensive outhouse, that literally has the ability to dehydrate the poo etc. Now it is one helicopter trip to remover the wast a year vs one a month.

BUT, as one says, we are all donuts, goes in one end, out the other!

Marty
 
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