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  #71  
Old 01-29-2014
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Re: why so long?

Quote:
Originally Posted by captain jack View Post
hmmmmmmmmmmm now i believe i have heard that before
I just googled "Sailor's Principle™"

I just coined a phrase...

To shrink to the size of comfort
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  #72  
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Re: why so long?

Quote:
Originally Posted by manatee View Post
As long as you don't do anything you can't undo, you should be OK.

''The Peter Principle is a management theory which suggests that organizations risk filling management roles with people who are incompetent if they promote those who are performing well at their current role, rather than those who have proven abilities at the intended role. It is named after Laurence J. Peter who co-authored the 1969 humorous book 'The Peter Principle: Why Things Always Go Wrong' with Raymond Hull. They suggest that people will tend to be promoted until they reach their 'position of incompetence'."

< snip >

I've heard it both ways... now that you mention it. But mostly as a person keeps getting promoted until he gets to one position above his best position..

In the other use... I heard that it is the reasons why manuals are not very good. When they want someone to put together a manual how to assemble a bbq grill... they don't pick the guy/gal out of the assembly line who is the best worker, thus losing production, they take the slacker --- who probably doesn't understand much to begin with
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Last edited by titustiger27; 01-29-2014 at 11:21 PM.
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  #73  
Old 01-29-2014
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Re: why so long?

Lower pic is of a more usual type Wheel on a 26 ft Seafarer on ebay now. Other type is on 35 ft Mariner.
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Last edited by sidney777; 01-29-2014 at 11:58 PM.
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  #74  
Old 01-30-2014
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Re: why so long?

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Originally Posted by sidney777 View Post
Lower pic is of a more usual type Wheel on a 26 ft Seafarer on ebay now. Other type is on 35 ft Mariner.
the top one is something like i was looking to do. i bet that one uses a worm gear. i can't enlarge the lower one to see it.
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  #75  
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Re: why so long?

i found the seafarer on ebay. that wheel is set up to have the helmsman sit behind the wheel.
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  #76  
Old 02-01-2014
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Re: why so long?

Only been half following the steering wheel converstation, but what if you stationed the wheel forward (more like a motor boat) like next to the hatchway, so it wouldn't interfere with the cockpit?
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  #77  
Old 02-02-2014
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Re: why so long?

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Originally Posted by titustiger27 View Post
Only been half following the steering wheel converstation, but what if you stationed the wheel forward (more like a motor boat) like next to the hatchway, so it wouldn't interfere with the cockpit?
manatee suggested that in post#67 and i responded in post#69.

in an of itself, the suggestion holds merit. in this particular case, the design of the boat would make such a suggestion unworkable. the wheels ( in the original forward helm suggestion, tandem wheels would be used: one to port and one to starboard ) would be in the way of anyone trying to walk forward of the cockpit.

it would be fairly easy to do. the quardrant could be above the cockpit sole. there would be plenty of access for an emergency tiller. the cables could go through the cockpit, at the bottom of the benches, and run forwards on the inner walls of each quarter berth, to blocks at the rear of the cabin. then up to wheels on either side. probably to chain over a sprocket. one behind each wheel. then down to blocks below the level of the companionway. the cable would run below the companionway, between these blocks.

it could be done easier with only one wheel, like a power boat, but then you wouldn't be able to shift your body weight to wind on both tacks. you could do it with a center wheel, if the companionway was offset....but it's not.
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Last edited by captain jack; 02-02-2014 at 05:50 AM.
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  #78  
Old 02-02-2014
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Re: why so long?

due to the cockpit layout, if i were to ever opt for a wheel, the best way would be to extend the stern post to the desired height of the center of the wheel. use bevel gears to transition the rotation to the horizontal plane to attach to the wheel, and simply build a pedestal to contain the two shafts. it would be direct. no cables or chains. just as bullet proof as rack and pinion or worm gear.

the bevel gear on the wheel shaft side could be larger than the bevel gear of the rudder shaft; enough to grant you proper mechanical advantage in comparison to the diameter of the wheel. figuring out the sizes of the gears would be fairly simple, really.

if you had a 3' diameter wheel, and your wheel shaft bevel gear was three times the size of the rudder shaft bevel gear, it would give you the leverage of a 4.5' tiller.

you'd just have to grease the gears regularly to keep the whole thing working smoothly.

the wheel would be on the forward side of the pedestal. i could steer from the side. there would be plenty of cockpit space. the wheel could be fairly low to the cockpit sole, since i would not be standing to use it.


thinking about it, it might be best to have the console forwards of the wheel. still easily achieved. just mount the rudder shaft gear at the height that the tiller fitting presently is. you could use a chain drive set up to go from the 90 degree shaft, with the bigger bevel gear, to the wheel shaft. you could always get your gear reduction in the chain sprockets. in which case, i'd use mitre gears instead of bevel gears.

not quite as derect but a high quality motorcycle chain would last nearly forever, under those circumstances. proper chain tension could be achieved by a simple chain tensioner. for something like this, that could be spring loaded. self adjusting.
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Last edited by captain jack; 02-02-2014 at 06:46 AM.
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  #79  
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Re: why so long?

Quote:
Originally Posted by captain jack View Post
manatee suggested that in post#67 and i responded in post#69.

in an of itself, the suggestion holds merit. in this particular case, the design of the boat would make such a suggestion unworkable. the wheels ( in the original forward helm suggestion, tandem wheels would be used: one to port and one to starboard ) would be in the way of anyone trying to walk forward of the cockpit.

it would be fairly easy to do. the quardrant could be above the cockpit sole. there would be plenty of access for an emergency tiller. the cables could go through the cockpit, at the bottom of the benches, and run forwards on the inner walls of each quarter berth, to blocks at the rear of the cabin. then up to wheels on either side. probably to chain over a sprocket. one behind each wheel. then down to blocks below the level of the companionway. the cable would run below the companionway, between these blocks.

it could be done easier with only one wheel, like a power boat, but then you wouldn't be able to shift your body weight to wind on both tacks. you could do it with a center wheel, if the companionway was offset....but it's not.
TWIN WHEELS on a Cal 27 ???

I'd say this thread has officially 'Jumped the Shark'... :-)
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  #80  
Old 02-02-2014
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Re: why so long?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
TWIN WHEELS on a Cal 27 ???

I'd say this thread has officially 'Jumped the Shark'... :-)
it had been suggested. i wasn't planning on it, though. too many components to go wrong. as i mentioned, deck access would be an issue. but the biggest thing is that, as the original suggestion noted, the wheels would be small; requiring a lot of gear reduction. really big gears on back of the wheels and small grear at the rudder. and it would, most definately, be overkill, here.

besides, i don't want to stand and steer. and it wouldn't be comfortable to sit and steer with that set up.

but the whole thing of far (a) forward wheel(s) got brought up twice so i figured it wouldn't hurt to address it.

i am going to try to shorten the tiller and stick with that. but i have a plan for if i decide i want to go a wheel. it's a plan that won't cost me a fortune and one that i can fabricate, myself.
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