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Old 05-14-2014
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Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

Hi All,

My Allmand 31 came with this "monster" spinnaker pole that I took home cause I said "I'll never use this thing". But after some light air sailing this past weekend and fighting to keep "wing and wing" flying, I'm having second thoughts about taking it back to the boat.

I've watched several You Tube videos and see every combination possible for rigging. I can surmise that I need an uphaul, a downhaul and a pole guy. Is that enough? Too much? I watched a video where the guy had yet another line from the clew of the genoa back to a winch.

Suggestions for this novice pole user? Thanks.

Dave
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Old 05-14-2014
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

Sail a reach and gybe instead of going W-o-W
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Old 05-14-2014
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

Easiest way is to just attach one end to the mast and the other to the clew - no topping lift or guys needed.
This will get you 95% there.

Next best way is to attach one end to the sheet rather than the clew. Here's where a topping lift will help if the pole weighs too much relative to the wind pressure on the sails and is dipping towards the water. It also helps you to position the clew (and hence trim the genoa) to be where you want it to be.

Last edited by weinie; 05-14-2014 at 04:57 PM.
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Old 05-14-2014
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

Typically spinnaker poles are too short to pole out a '150' genoa.. it will 'work' but won't be ideal. An extendable whisker pole is a better idea. Spinn poles tend to be heavier too. I wouldn't expect you need the downhaul/uphaul rigged to use as a whisker pole - unless the pole is simply to heavy to be supported by the sail itself.
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Old 05-14-2014
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

loads on reaching pole much less then spin pole. Spin pole may be over kill. Unless its carbon fiber also heavy and a PIA. May want to jury rig a light pole just for the function you want. Then just need some way to attach to boat ( some just clip them to toe rail) and a way to keep it near clew of sail. I have full blown set up with telescoping CF spin pole. Takes a while to set up - lower pole off mast before starting- topping lift first-then fore guy- then after guy- then roll up genny- then clip pole around sheet- then deploy pole and set lines so its where it needs to be- then unroll genny and set sheet to correct length. Can do with the boat on AP by myself with trepidation but takes awhile. Generally don't bother unless its a long board. Still if going down wind wing and wing with the solent in big wind very much worth doing. Other wise not so much. Just knocking around may just drop the main if wind abaft the mast.

On small boats have even seen boat hooks used for this purpose. Did this myself when I had a small Cape Dory. Clove hitch to secure bottom end to mid ship cleat. pointy end through clew sheet grommet. Pole clicked out to right length. Worked fine and cheap and cheerful.
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

Quote:
Originally Posted by Faster View Post
Typically spinnaker poles are too short to pole out a '150' genoa.. it will 'work' but won't be ideal. An extendable whisker pole is a better idea. Spinn poles tend to be heavier too. I wouldn't expect you need the downhaul/uphaul rigged to use as a whisker pole - unless the pole is simply to heavy to be supported by the sail itself.
What's your guess for a pole length flying a 150 (on a 31' boat). Rascals are pricey!
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

You've got about a 12 ft J measurement.. so a pole extending to 15 feet or so should do. the second on on this page looks like a fit, as an example..

FORESPAR Heavy-Duty Telescoping Twist-Lock Poles | West Marine
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

Forespar's site is a good place to start...

Whisker Poles

I like going with the whole 9 yards - pole lift, foreguy, and afterguy... sounds more complicated, but it actually makes the use of a pole with a furling headsail simpler, and far safer... The advantage of being able to leave the pole deployed, while perhaps furling the jib for a brief course change or jibe, or to douse in a squall, can pay huge dividends when cruising...

Sailing wing & wing can be extremely pleasant, I'm always amazed how infrequently I see it being done... On this particular day running the long, arrow-straight channel on the Indian River, I was passed by 5 or 6 larger boats, all motoring DDW...

Presumably, their full enclosures prevented their diesel exhaust from wafting back into the cockpit :-)



Last edited by JonEisberg; 05-14-2014 at 05:40 PM.
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Old 05-14-2014
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

The folks who want to sell marine things to you try to make this more complicated and expensive on their YouTube videos than it needs to be.

I carry a Forespar extendable whisker pole (bought used for $100 on Craigslist) and a fully rigged spinnaker pole (bought used for $200) for the spinnaker. The whisker pole is good for running dead down wind and for broad reaching. It is fast and easy to set up when needed. The 10'-18' model would be right for your boat.

I question whether you need all the goodies for a whisker pole, particularly for close coastal or inland cruising, where you rarely hold the same course in the same conditions for any extended period of time. On the other hand, you really should learn how to fly a symmetrical spinnaker on your boat if you do any kind of cruising, because you will spend less time motoring and more time sailing with one.

(If you divide the compass into quadrants of 90 degrees each, you will discover that you should spend 50% of your time either beating into the wind (25%) or running downwind (25%); it actually seems more like 90% of the time. I think that is why so many cruisers end up motoring.)

It is easy enough to put a spare halyard at the top of the mast and/or lash a block for a topping lift at the spreaders. It is also easy to install a pad eye in the middle of the foredeck for a foreguy and extra blocks for the sheets back to the cockpit. You probably don't need it however for the whisker pole:

Broad reach:


Dead downwind:


Last edited by jameswilson29; 05-14-2014 at 06:13 PM.
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Old 05-14-2014
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Re: Spinnaker Pole for Genoa Downwind

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_E View Post
What's your guess for a pole length flying a 150 (on a 31' boat). Rascals are pricey!
Do you have a 150%, or something smaller? A popular size for a roller furling genoa is 130-135%, and a J length pole works reasonably well for that.

A topping lift is helpful to prevent the pole from weighing down the sail too much, but a downhaul isn't really necessary.

A whisker pole will be lighter and can be adjusted to fit and takes up less deck space, but since you already have the spinnaker pole I'd try that first.
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