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post #11 of 90 Old 06-13-2014
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

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Originally Posted by Ilenart View Post
My yacht, a UFO 34 is very similar to a S&S 34 and here in Perth they used to race in the same fleet. However on Sail Calculator the numbers look pretty different. The two diagrams below show the similarities.








When I was looking for my yacht, three boats that were very similar were the S&S 34, UFO 34 and Van De Stadt 34. Biggest issue with the S&S 34 was the lack of room midship around the galley. The UFO 34 was better (mainly as they are about a foot wider) and the Van De Stadt had the most room.

Ilenart
love the ufo 34 however its a spade rudder...

I thought the op wanted as close a design as possible to the s and s 34...

if all you are looking for is a fin and spade there are a gazillion boats out there that match the boat...

however as has been stated NUMBERS CAN BE DECIEVING...look for sailing qualities...similar ballast to displacement ratios, and sail area design...to get comparable boats

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post #12 of 90 Old 06-13-2014
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

Some quick thoughts off of the top of my head:
One of my favorite boats of that size and era is the Halsey Herreshoff designed Bristol 33/34.

Holman and Pye were some of my favorite designers during the era of the S&S 34. One of their nicer designs of that size is the Wauquiez Pretorien 35.

Garry Mull designed a wonderful 30 footer called the Chico 30. I had only heard of these boats since most of them were built in NZ and Aus. but got to see one half way through making a circumnav a few years ago and the owner sang its praises very highly.

A slightly older design, the Tartan 34 is a great all around boat from that era. I am also a big fan of the Tartan 30 which I like better than the the Tartan 34.

Both are newer designs that I like; the Farr 9.2 (keel version) which is a good all around boat, and the Farr 1020 is a spectacularly nice 34 footer.

Jeff
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post #13 of 90 Old 06-13-2014
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

A few things, if you look at that drawing of the S&S I don't think that skeg would give any protection to the rudder, so it is essentially a spade with a touch of skeg in front of it. I think you are giving way too much credence to the "numbers" as they really don't say much. Even the creator of the "motion comfort" number has said it is really meaningless only capable of comparing very similar boats. The Olson is not in the same category as the S&S so that shows how the numbers don't in themselves tell you much.

I would not have any "must haves" like skeg hung rudder as there are thousands of boats out there actually sailing that have spade rudders. A well made spade will be stronger than a weak skeg hung rudder. There was a recent thread that showed how most skegs are not at all structural. They may give a touch directional stability, not not necessarily any strength. I would concentrate on finding boats that fit your budget then look into if they will fit your needs.

Of the "numbers" the main one I look at is sail area to displacement as that will give you an idea to light wind performance. Remember 90% of all cruising is going to be in light winds so that one is important most of the time.
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Last edited by miatapaul; 06-13-2014 at 06:19 PM.
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post #14 of 90 Old 06-13-2014
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

yup the one I always like is sail area and ballast to displacement ratio in general terms...

but like I said before know the designs, what you are looking for and the characterstics in REAL life versus what the numbers "say"

cheers

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post #15 of 90 Old 06-14-2014 Thread Starter
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

i like the notion of giving more weight to sail area to displacement. sweet.

all this is still a little confusing though. and, a lot of what is being said is subjective.

lets remove budget as a criteria for now and that might narrow us to the top 3 fast under 40 foot sail boats that can handle very heavy weather.
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

@JeffH. Sounds like your vote is clearly for the Farr 1020. What are your top 3 picks (removing all constraints including cost). Under 40. Fast. Can handle heavy weather.
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post #17 of 90 Old 06-14-2014
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

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love the ufo 34 however its a spade rudder...

I thought the op wanted as close a design as possible to the s and s 34...

if all you are looking for is a fin and spade there are a gazillion boats out there that match the boat...

however as has been stated NUMBERS CAN BE DECIEVING...look for sailing qualities...similar ballast to displacement ratios, and sail area design...to get comparable boats
The S&S 34 was built in West Australia in a number of versions. Mark 1 had the skeg. Mark II was built with a spade rudder (also a taller twin spreader rig and a "Mk 2" keel). I changed my old "barn door" spade rudder for a more modern shape a couple of years ago and the mould was the same one used on the latest S&S 34s. Picture below.

As Christian saids, I don't think you can get too specific with the numbers. The S&S 34 actual built displacements ranged from 11,000 to 13,000lbs, sail areas depends on whether you are talking about the short or tall rig, etc.

Ilenart



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Re: Boats like S&S 34

how does the Cal 2-30 compare?
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

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Originally Posted by andyselzn View Post
i like the notion of giving more weight to sail area to displacement. sweet.

all this is still a little confusing though. and, a lot of what is being said is subjective.

lets remove budget as a criteria for now and that might narrow us to the top 3 fast under 40 foot sail boats that can handle very heavy weather.
Well, so are concepts such as "fast", or "can handle very heavy weather"... :-)

You're asking questions for which there are no simple answers, and starting from a very ambiguous point. The S & S 34 is a wonderful boat, but hardly fits into the category of what most sailors would consider a "fast" boat under 40 feet...
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post #20 of 90 Old 06-14-2014
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Re: Boats like S&S 34

without being too repetitive you are looking at this from a wrong angle andy...

if you look at numbers you can come up with wildly different looking boats yet the numbers are similar as you have already seen.

you can search by decade design say ior, cca, etc or

you can look at the physical attributes and aspects of the boats

you can class them by displacements

you can class them by sail area or phrf

you can class them by sail design

or spade and fin
spade and full keel
skeg and fin
skeg and full keel
3/4, cutaway full keel, barndoor ad nauseum

the point is SIMILAR to me means similiar looking and performing...

so take your s and s 34 to me close very close is a contessa 32...however the contessa 32 is definitely more iorish because it has a very very small main...

other than that and the fact that they were built in different continents they have very similiar underwater features and performance

while this is subjective in the sense we are judging by looks and certain aspects to me its the best way to compare boats

real life versus say just NUMBERS...

it would be a fools errand to shop for boats on numbers alone...to me at least

you are confusing yourself now more because you have peoples likes and dislikes....added to the "numbers"

best way to search for boats is to hear real life stories about their sailing characteristics in racing, cruising, offshore scenarios, club racing etc...and compare

cheers

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