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post #11 of 38 Old 07-18-2006
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comments please

I would appreciate your comments with respect to this crew agreement.
fair winds,
eric
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post #12 of 38 Old 07-18-2006
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I expect that surfesq should weigh in on this.

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post #13 of 38 Old 07-18-2006
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Eric, if I were going to crew on your boat then I would read all that but...
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post #14 of 38 Old 07-18-2006
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Kimberlite: I will read your agreement and give you my legal opinion. But with all due respect, you sound like a pain in the ass. Your sons won't even come with you! (And I am not being a contrarian here).
It sounds like a long hot nightmare of a trip. They sound like kids. You sound like a grumpy old man. Kids don't have a clue. You know that going in because you have kids. Next time if you don't want them smoking tell them. They forgot to bring drinks...its not the end of the world. Think of it like this...you come uprepared, you float, motor and bake for 25 days while Grandpa keeps the tension high.....I don't know if I would have quietly slipped off! lol.
If you get involved in this kind of business it seems to me like you pretty much have to go with the flow. If you can't don't do it. Sorry...just the truth. (I have no doubt that you are a good guy and that these kids were slackers but this is how it appears to me).
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post #15 of 38 Old 07-18-2006
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And my wife thought my crew questionaire was "hard-nosed" ;-)

I would concur that a more formal agreement such as Eric's may well be appropriate for international voyages and voyages of long duration, particularly with crew who you may have never met before, and probably as well with people you do know but have not sailed with before. As I understand it, the legal situation between captain and crew in foreign ports can be pretty tricky sometimes.

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Tim
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post #16 of 38 Old 07-18-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surfesq
Kimberlite: I will read your agreement and give you my legal opinion. But with all due respect, you sound like a pain in the ass. Your sons won't even come with you! (And I am not being a contrarian here).
Surfesq is confusing Kimberlite with sailnaway, who started this thread.
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post #17 of 38 Old 07-18-2006
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Thanks Tim...I meant those comments for sailinaway.

I actually have a problem with Kimberlite's agreement if he is not a USCG certified Captain. You see the problem is that you are opening yourself up to all kinds of liability by holding yourself out as a Captain and having the "crew" agree to follow your orders. Worse case scenario, something bad happens and your crews family pulls out this agreement. This agreement would result in an automatic denial of coverage under a standard policy because it represents a commerical venture which is precluded under 100 percent of pleasure craft policies.
Incidentally, hold harmless agreements always seem so great. But you cannot contract away your negligence. So they are for all intensive purposes uneforceable.
Look, I know a bunch of you guys out there fantasize about being boat captain guy. But here is the reality, the USCG has commercial certifications for a reason. If you don't have the certification its a pleasure cruise.
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post #18 of 38 Old 07-19-2006
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Surfesq-

Thanks for the legal perspective on the agreement. Good point. Would there be a difference if they were being paid as crew, as opposed to just being along as crew?

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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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post #19 of 38 Old 07-19-2006
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One of the joys in our over-lawyered era, when suing becomes the first, second and third option. It wasn't that long ago, that a handshake was as good as a signed piece of paper. Now, it's all CYA. Ya gotta love progress.

John
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Free, is the heart, that lives not, in fear.
Full, is the spirit, that thinks not, of falling.
True, is the soul, that hesitates not, to give.
Alive, is the one, that believes, in love.
JCP


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post #20 of 38 Old 07-19-2006
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It more than that PB Its alot like holding yourself out as an expert driver when you don't have a driver's license. I think and without checking you are required to have a USCG license to take on any passengers who pay or who are paid. So yes, if you just bring someone along to help you ferry your boat and its a friendly agreement that would be fine. Its always been CYA. That has never changed and has nothing to do with the US being overlawyered.
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