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new anchor feedback

5K views 26 replies 15 participants last post by  MondayNever 
#1 · (Edited)
Just got back from 3 weeks away.
Had replaced our cqr w/ a rocna this past spring.
We had a thunder storm come thru Block Island early in the am a few weeks back. It blew 40 sustained for 1/2 hour. Every boat around us dragged into the recreation area.
We were on 100' of 3/8" chain in 25' of water. Not enough.
When I retrieved the anchor the next day after coming up tight on the chain, I had to slowly pull the anchor up 3' to free it. The anchor came up w/ a massive clump of mud.
Never going back.
Jim
 
#2 ·
With the depth, plus your freeboard height, 5 to 1 scope would be closer to 140ft. Admittedly, that can be hard to find room for in Great Salt Pond at the height of the season. Even if you had held, most around you are highly suspect. It's also an uneven bottom. You may have dropped in 25 feet on a downslope that dragged to a deeper set. I totally avoid the anchorage in July and Aug.

We had our hook down there on May 2 this year! We and our buddy next to us were the only two boats in the entire harbor.
 
#3 ·
We did hold.
That's the whole point. I also knew we didn't have enough chain out for storm conditions.
Tow Boat had a field day.
I personally can't stand Block in the summer. We hadn't been there in years because of the crowds in the anchorage but my wife insisted on stopping there this year. She is terminally ill and this will most likely be her last sailing season.
I was amazed the number of boats that dragged past us w/ no one on deck.
Jim
 
#4 ·
We have a Rocna, used it first on our 6000 pound B-24, and now will be in use on our new to us B-29.9, it has set on the first try every time thus far, they seem to be very good anchors. We will be getting a heavier Rocna for our primary, and keeping the 22 pounder as our 2nd anchor.
 
#5 ·
We have a 20.
We anchor period. No moorings and no docks. Have been doing so since I was a kid w/ my parents in the 60's.
I was stunned how much more effort this anchor took to free up over our cqr. It always came up packed w/ mud.
I'm completely convinced. Never going back. Spent way to many nights dealing w/ dragging.
Jim
 
#7 ·
I was stunned how much more effort this anchor took to free up over our cqr. It always came up packed w/ mud.
I use a tripline EVERY TIME. Otherwise, the two-arm windlass couldn't get the anchor up.

However, I use the tripline a little differently from most. The tripline is connected to the shackle where the chain joins the nylon rode. This way it is never in the way, but it has been a little difficult lately, as I believe that the tripline is a little too long.

Here is a pic;
 
#6 ·
Our biggest problem with our Rocna is getting it up. Even straight up and down on the chain that anchor seems to want to stay down there doing it's job. Over the last 3+ years of being on it every night, I've found that 3:1 is more than sufficient with the Rocna (though our chain certainly doesn't do any good in the chain locker). After it's well set (we NEVER back down on our anchor unless Med mooring), I'd even be comfortable on 2:1, if needs be. What an amazing anchor this is.
 
#8 ·
The Rocna is a serious anchor. I still debate using my Fortress in Great Salt Pond. I have had my Rocna ever so slowly drag in some of the thick slimy stuff. I tend to back down hard and this can make it tough to get it up.

...I'll get my coat...
 
#9 ·
The Rocna is a serious anchor. I still debate using my Fortress in Great Salt Pond. I have had my Rocna ever so slowly drag in some of the thick slimy stuff. I tend to back down hard and this can make it tough to get it up.
We all seem to like what works for us, resulting in a lot of anecdotal evidence in these anchor posts. Unfortunately, there isn't a lot of objective qualification on technique and specific bottom conditions.

I've been going to the Great Salt Pond for over 30 years and have used Danforth high tensile, Fortress, and (primarily) CQR anchors. There I have anchored in various bottom conditions: sand, mixed sand/weed, and gooey mud/weed.

The only time I had a problem with dragging (once in all those years) was when I couldn't get a good set in an area of gooey mud/weed. This was on a busy weekend (first mistake!) when the only area available had such bad holding--otherwise, why was it available? I was up at 1 or 2 AM when my CQR started dragging slowly. There were plenty of other boats dragging at that time and in that vicinity. I was able to move a short distance and get a shaky set in the same area and held for the rest of the night in maybe 20 kts. Based on experience over the years, my Danforth and Fortress backup anchors would likely not have penetrated the weeds, so I never deployed them that night.
For what it's worth that questionable area in the Great Salt Pond in along the north central area of the anchorage and it hasn't gotten any better over the years (I've checked.)

The worst conditions I've encountered many years ago in the Salt Pond was when the winds picked up to 50 mph (per NOAA). My 2500 lb catboat was held by a 6 or 7# danforth high tensile in a sandy patch in shallow water NW of the Sullivan House. Lots of boats dragged that night. The shallow water prevented bigger boats from coming down on our catboat fleet, thankfully, with one grounding to a stop 20 ft upwind of one of our 2' draft boats.

So, if you are trying to anchor in the Great Salt Pond, I'd stay with my CQR as primary, backing down hard to assure a good set. If I can locate a sandy patch in some of the shallower areas, I'd be comfortable with the Danforth high tensile or Fortress if you are expecting high winds. BTW, expect 20 kts in the Great Salt Pond on a good day!

I don't have anything against the "modern" plow style anchors (Rocna, Manson, etc.), but I haven't seen a convincing argument to switch from something that works for me. The recent Fortress-managed test with a muddy bottom reported in Practical Sailor certainly didn't convince me, so I'll stick with my mix of CQR and Danforth styles.
 
#11 · (Edited)
I have a 45 CQR now and replacing as the primary anchor with the Rocna55 using 200' 3/8 BB with 200' double braid. So 400' total. The CQR is being regulated as a standby on the other bow roller. Danforth 20 ready to deploy on the stern. Great input. Thank you.
Jim, very sorry to hear about your better half. Condolences.
 
#12 ·
Not implying everyone should do things my way. But I do think disparaging a CQR anchor is not consistent with my experience over the past 20 years using one as my primary. No, it isn't perfect for all conditions, but I simply have not had the dragging experience described by the OP. I have had my CQR bury deeply as others have described their Rocnas and to do that means you are dragging initially to some extent.

When it comes to checking on position, I use a laser rangefinder, which is a lot more accurate than GPS when you have a good visual reference. A laser rangefinder is also good for determining when someone upwind is dragging down on you.
 
#14 ·
+1

Very similar setup, 40' sailboat, Rocna 20, recently switched from a 35lb CQR. We get such an unambiguous set now, the bow just snaps around as that baby grabs. Very different from the CQR. Not that the CQR ever gave us too much trouble.

Spent last week in that same spot on BI with the same (insufficient) rode, it was funny reading this post. Held fine.

Few weeks earlier on Cuttyhunk the wind shifted 180 degrees and all of a sudden engines were starting and folks were yelling. We held, and held onto our new friends as we tied their drifting boat alongside and woke them up.

So far so good - but no anchor is perfect, set those drag alarms!!!!!!

Hope you are having fun despite the hardships. Life is too short.
 
#16 ·
We changed from a 35 Cqr to a 20kg Rocna 7 years ago. The CQR was/ is very reliable. The Rocna.....has been the best though in most varied bottom conditions. Those who have the Rocna/ Mason experience of almost getting bucked of the boat when it sets know the difference.

Geist I like most is that in reversing current it does turn and reset immediately where our CQR would occasionally plow or skip some.

Rocna allows me to get a good nights sleep
 
#17 ·
Full disclosure, I should say from the start that I am on old CQR hand but used a Manson for our RTW trip. If you notice most anchor discussions have two groups of participants - those who are happy with their traditional anchors (CQRs, Danforths, etc). and those who are proponents of the new guys on the block, Rocna, Manson Supreme, etc. What is sometimes forgotten is that most of the latter group have considerable personal experience with older anchors, while the former group have no personal experience with the new anchors. When i used a CQR primarily I was pleased with it - it worked pretty well. Now that I have hundreds of night (actually make that more than a thousand nights) with the Manson, in all sorts of conditions in water to 65 feet, including in places like Easter island where you are anchoring in the open ocean, there is no comparison.

Spent a few days with Peter Smith, the inventor of the Rocna, in Namibia. Interesting guy and interesting sailor. He hates warm weather and spends his winters in places like Patagonia and the Falklands. Wanted to know what kind of anchor we used. Used to be friends with the guy who owns Mansor. Not anymore after the introduction of the Supreme. He had the prototype of the Vulcan on board - something like a 7 pounder. He had it made by a university engineering department in Cape Town.
 
#19 ·
If you notice most anchor discussions have two groups of participants - those who are happy with their traditional anchors (CQRs, Danforths, etc). and those who are proponents of the new guys on the block, Rocna, Manson Supreme, etc. What is sometimes forgotten is that most of the latter group have considerable personal experience with older anchors, while the former group have no personal experience with the new anchors.

Exactly!
Jim
 
#21 · (Edited)
We had a cqr on the 36 and our 40 also came w/ a cqr.
The difference isn't the fluke tip. It's the width and height at the hoop. The mantus is much larger which I'm sure plays into holding power but it would have interfered w/ my Selden bow sprit.
Also the rocna is almost self launching and way easier to get back on the roller than the cqr was.
Jim
 
#23 ·
i have a 33lb bruce on my 32 foot keeler its a great anchor have dived on it often and have only seen chain coming out of the sand,it also usually sets hard within 2 metres of hitting the bottom.I back it in hard when I anchor and it snaps the bow around am very happy with it.I also have a manson supreme as a spare was going to change to it to my main anchor but cant bring myself to do it,it was my primary on my last yacht and worked very well as well.Had a CQR before that and got tired of dragging all over the ocean.
 
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