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  #31  
Old 09-13-2006
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Well…… Thanks for taking time to post. There are lot good comments.

One thing that I walked away from this thread is preparation and sailor skills are most important. I also agree that you cannot make a chevy into a Sherman tank. I just leave it at that.

Thanks Sailingfool’s link for the Panda story. I enjoyed reading it and I will take heart when I am ready to sail the blue pond. Hellosailer mentioned the Fastnet book. I read the book more than 10 years ago, when I was learning to sail from Annapolis Sailing School. Knowing that I will be sailing more and more, I recently purchased my very own copy along with “A voyage for Mad Men” which I haven’t find time reading it yet. It is easy to learn from others.

There are a number of blue water boats were mentioned, ie. Valiant, Caliber, and Mason. I have looked into their constructions, I can see the difference. One thing that is clear all have full keel instead of fin keel. Are there other builders in this caliber? I am sure most of them are beyond my reach, but just want to learn more about it. I think an older Valiant or Caliber is workable. I still have a few years to make my decision and it will not be easy.

Thanks again for the well thought comments.

LS
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  #32  
Old 09-13-2006
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I thought “simplex” was the use of one frequency for the receiver and transmitter where a “duplex” will use one frequency for reception and another for the transmission. A duplex lends itself the use of repeaters.

Jerry
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  #33  
Old 09-13-2006
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" Valiant, Caliber, and Mason........... One thing that is clear all have full keel instead of fin keel."

That is not true at all, both the Caliber and the Valiant are fin keels with skeg hung rudders, as are most designs being promoted today primarily for offshore use. The exception to that might be the Island Packets, which have something between a long fin and a full keel, but oddly enough use a post hung rudder like any modern race boat, except that the bottom of the rudder on an IP is almost at the same depth as the keel making it more vulnerable.

Jeff
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  #34  
Old 09-13-2006
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I stand corrected. Thanks Jeff...... and Paul too
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Old 09-13-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerryrlitton
I thought “simplex” was the use of one frequency for the receiver and transmitter where a “duplex” will use one frequency for reception and another for the transmission. A duplex lends itself the use of repeaters.

Jerry
Full-duplex operation of a radio, whether ham, VHF, or SSB, requires that you have two frequencies assigned, one for transmit and one for receive. that way, you don't step on the other person's transmission with yours. Half-duplex operation uses a single simplex frequency—where you can either listen or transmit—but not both.
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  #36  
Old 09-13-2006
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A little interesting research on the web turned up that there are two definitions of "simplex". ANSI (and the US Navy where I learned it) define it as I did earlier which is one way ONLY i.e., broadcast radio and television or the fire alarm box. ITU defines simplex as one way at a time which is the definition I used for half-duplex. No wonder some of us seem way off base.
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Old 09-13-2006
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Steve, I think the difference is that the ANSI/USN definitions date back to the days when devices were simply DEVICES without any intelligence. Like an old TV or fire alarm box, which isn't and can't be "programmed".

Now, you come into the computer age and add intelligence into telephones and modems and things...and the difference between simplex and half-duplex can be in the equipment--or in the control programing. If I had to rewrite the definition I'd say a half-duplex device was a simplex device with enough brains and ambition to fake being full duplex, one way at a time. (And then if I wanted to confuse things further, I'd say half-duplex meant a timesharing emulation of full duplex.)

Telegraph line: Simplex.
Telegraph line with two trained operators: Duplex.
Telegraph line with two drunk operators: Half-duplex?
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When you started putting intelligence into the devices and software programming they became multiplex devices. I was trying to keep it simple. and the ITU definition evidently goes all the way back to Western Unions description of the capability of the trans Atlantic cable.
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Old 09-13-2006
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Jeff H is of course right that the trend in bluewater boats is towards fin keels. I sailed my 37 foot Cutter which had a fin keel across the Atlantic and found it to be quite comfortable. My "nused" boat is a Hardin Sea Wolf which at one time was thought to be a very good blue water boat. It is a very heavy full keel Ketch. I am looking forward to sailing it to Bermuda in the Spring and comparing my own experiences with the two designs.
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Old 09-14-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff_H
" Valiant, Caliber, and Mason........... One thing that is clear all have full keel instead of fin keel."

That is not true at all, both the Caliber and the Valiant are fin keels with skeg hung rudders, as are most designs being promoted today primarily for offshore use. The exception to that might be the Island Packets, which have something between a long fin and a full keel, but oddly enough use a post hung rudder like any modern race boat, except that the bottom of the rudder on an IP is almost at the same depth as the keel making it more vulnerable.

Jeff
I have a 70s era Swan with a fin keel that, properly prepared, is suitable for bluewater use, IMO. Most coastal cruisers have fin keels but that does not mean that fin keels are not suitable for offshore use.
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