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MacGregor 26 X/M Impressions

35K views 113 replies 37 participants last post by  snuginn 
#1 ·
Greetings!

I'm looking for people's impressions on the above. These would be considered, own, owned, sailed (especially) and compared to other boats. It seems like a lot of boat for the money (interior notwithstanding).

Please, no flames - bad experiences OK.

I've read the "capsize" related threads. Bottom line is, capsizing was due to no ballast in tank and crew inexperience. That can happen on ANY boat.

Thanks!

Sincerely,

/s/ Jon C. Munson II
 
#4 ·
Macgregor performance

Macgregor is an affordable boat, and is largely for beginners. My concern with Macgregor is that may new sailors may be turned off by the lack of stability. Heel is an unnatural experience and can be unnerving. Also, a new sailor may carry too much sail inadvertantly. It doesn't take long to out grow a Macgregor in terms of sailing performance.

There is no substitue for draft and ballast for monohull sailing.
Kevin.
 
#6 ·
If you want a sailboat that can go fast under power yet sail well—get a multihull, or a really big boat. If you want a power boat, get one...but the MacGregor is really a very basic boat with little going for it, and probably going to be outgrown fairly quickly. Assuming you want to get a MacGregor for its trailerability, you may want to look at the Catalina 22 or 25, preferably the non-water ballasted models, which are very nice little sailboats.
 
#7 ·
Also, they don't really represent a lot of value for the money, not in terms of performance and comfort - A new one with trailer and 50HP engine goes for around $30-40K around here - with that kind of budget it's quite possible to get a decent all-around used sailboat with many more amenities and good sailing performance.

And as for the "15 knots under power" - there's a significant cost to that in fuel consumption.
 
#8 ·
Faster's got a really good point too.

If you consider that you can get a pretty nice Grampian 26, a Cape Dory 25 or a Pearson Ariel, for less than $10,000, then you have $20-30,000+ left over, which will pay for many seasons of docking or mooring the boat and winter storage. :D

You get a much better sailing boat and no hassles of trailering it....more time spent sailing, less time spent trying to setup the boat. A win all around IMHO.

The Cape Dory, Grampian and Pearson Ariel or Triton are all very good solid little boats, and capable of the occasional bluewater passage IMHO, as well as being fun to daysail or weekend on.
 
#9 ·
All very good points to consider.

I am not actively looking to purchase a boat at this time. A small problem of not having found that money tree or even a bush as yet. :D And, if I did find that magic money tree, I'd be after a 35-50' cat, or a 50'+ monohull for a liveaboard at this point.

I am, however, researching for that day when I can get a boat (assuming my brother does something else with his boat that precludes my use of it).

So, all opinons are welcomed.

And yes, I had considered all those things about the Mac.

Also, the MacGregor thread would not have sufficed in returning the opinions I seek as it might have pidgeon-holed the responses.

Every boat represents some sort of compromise in some respect. You simply cannot have everything in one boat.

In having looked around at used Mac's, I didn't really see a plethora of them - so they must not be all that bad. And, with the production as high as it is, they must sell quite a number of them. So, the product can't be all that bad either - it does sell after all.

Owning any boat has its cost - "Break Out Another Thousand" after all. Generally, the bigger the boat, the more costs one has to bear.

Obviously, this type of boat has its plusses as well as its detractors.

I personally see no issues with trailering a boat that is meant to be trailored (you can go from lake to lake or sea to sea, etc., rather easily/handily). Neither do I see issues with a boat that requires a slip. What matters is the intended use of the boat and the budget, current and future, of the prospective owner.

As for performance - yes, anytime fuel, especially gas, is used to go fast, you are going to pay for it. Part of the territory. If one doesn't get that, then one shouldn't be boating.

As for set up, a good bit of time is spent readying our slip-docked boat for our day's outing, and, honestly, I don't see how the Mac would be that much more really. What's a few minutes? If you are that pressed for time, why are you sailing? Not trying to be a Mac advocate here, but simply making a point.

A used boat can indeed be a good value. My brother's Bayfield was $10,500. It only lacks a shower to be a really good boat (needs a few more feet for that accomodation). I personally think for the price he paid he got a good value. I think we've spent about a grand on little things to make it sailable and there will be more in order to recondition a bit of her. Depending upon what he wants to spend, that could be a little (some is mandatory) or quite a bit (feathering prop anyone? Dacron cruising sails? Spectra line? New lifelines? It goes on...).

Sometimes reconditioning a used boat can cost quite a bit - in which case, if a Mac was being considered but forgotten on account of price, the Mac may have been the smarter choice.

Again, it goes back to intent and use coupled with budget.

That aside, the main question is, really, how *is* the boat itself?

Sincerely,

/s/ Jon C. Munson II
 
#10 · (Edited)
jmunson2 said:
As for set up, a good bit of time is spent readying our slip-docked boat for our day's outing, and, honestly, I don't see how the Mac would be that much more really. What's a few minutes? If you are that pressed for time, why are you sailing? .....
That aside, the main question is, really, how *is* the boat itself?
Jon

I would suggest that the dockside prep time you speak of would be required with the Mac AFTER you've spent 40 minutes or so getting the rig up. Another aspect of trailering time is the occasional wait for the busy ramp areas to be clear for your turn.

And to turn you're own question back at you, if you're in a hurry, why are you sailing? If you're not in a hurry, why go for a boat that does 15 knots under power - go sailing instead.

Your brother's boat, while not the spriteliest performer out there is an honest character sailboat with loads of charm and a comfortable weekender.

Having sailed a large number of different boats from 8 feet to 40 feet, one hull to three, including a Mac 26X, I can say that boat certainly stood out as one with very weird sailing characteristics. Add to that the poor righting moment of the high-in-the-boat water ballast and the rather poor helm position given the tiny wheel I have to say it was a less-than memorable experience (except in a bad way)

I'm probably hurting someone's feelings, but my impression is that most Mac buyers are new to boating, or non sailors that don't really know enough to tell whether the boat sails particularily well or not.

That said, there is definitely a niche market that they have filled, the moorage-free trailerable advantage, the perception that they can "fly" home at the end of the day and an effective marketing program have sold lots of them. I'm just saying if it's sailing you're after, you can do much better for the same money.

We met a couple this summer who dove in with a Mac 26, used it one year, sold it and bought a nice well-found 28' sailboat and had money left over even after taking the initial depreciation hit. They were much happier with this boat.
 
#11 ·
We looked at Catalina, Hunter, Precision, Seaward and MacGregor. We ended up with a Precision 23 (which is for sale right now - only one year old - we planned on only having it for one year). It represented the best compromise for a trailer sailor - classic lines, comfortable interior, decent speed, build quality, dealer support. It didn't have the motor power of the MacGregor, nor the enclosed head of the Catalina and Hunter, or the inboard diesel of the Seaward. It looked like a sailboat, acted like a sailboat and moved like a sailboat. I could heave to (which I'm not sure you can do in a MacGregor) and has a traditional keel/centerboard combo. I also wasn't in love with the looks of the newer Mac's - the double windows hiding the tremendous freeboard of the boat.

One other note - we were in Maine this past summer and moored in Camden (outer harbor) one night. There were two MacGregor's moored in the field. It wasn't overly choppy, yet the amount these two boats were canting side to side was incredible! There is absolutely no way I would ever want to be on one in anything but calm water.

When you get closer to the time when you are going to make a decision, I encourage you to set aside your knowledge of the MacGregor and equally evaluate all boats of similar size on the market.

I will also mention, being the former owner (well, former once I sell our P23) of a trailerable boat - it would take us 1.5 hours from pulling up to the ramp to motoring away. Then we would pull into a slip at a marina and finish organizing. This was with two people. On one occasion we "timbered" the mast when we forgot to anchor it when releasing the genoa furler. We moved up to a 40' boat this year and we're excited to get away from having to put a boat together. On the other hand, we could drive anywhere with it and sail in any lake we wanted to. We weren't restricted to keeping it on one waterway.

Good luck with your future decision!
 
#12 ·
While I've never sailed on MacGregor 26xx, I would have to say that there are plenty of them on the used boat market, and probably for a reason.

I would also say that you would be surprised how much more you will use a boat that is sitting ready at the dock, rather than on a trailer. Faster is probably right that you'll be doing at least the same amount of prep after spending 40-60 minutes getting the boat launched and on the water.
 
#13 ·
Working on the water in Newport Beach CA I have the pleasure of watching a huge number and variety of sailboats beat up the harbour and run back down. The Macgregors (built just up the road in costa mesa) stand out as the worst performing boats to weather that I have ever seen. It is really quite extraordinary that a "sailboat" can make so much leeway, and so little headway. The only thing remotely close on the bay is a Roberts Spray cutter, also quite painful to watch.
At the end of the day though, they run back home just the same as all the others.
I really can't imagine anyone who has sailed any other sailboat (even a Bayfield 25-no great shakes upwind either) being remotely happy sailing the M boats.
Yes they produce and sell a large number of them. McDonalds has served billions and billions but that isn't evidence that their food is "good".
 
#14 ·
yotphix said:
Yes they produce and sell a large number of them. McDonalds has served billions and billions but that isn't evidence that their food is "good".
We actually cooked burgers supplied by McDonalds at a charity barbeque, and the burgers were quite good. I don't know what McDonalds does to make them so unpalatable, since the actual burgers, when cooked by a good cook are quite good.
 
#15 ·
I think that the high soy content in McDonalds' "100% Real Beef tm" burgers would make them pretty tasty but you're right, they do seem to have a special way of making them taste like wax! Funny though, when I was six I thought they were the best thing in the world.
 
#16 ·
I like the MAC.
If you like the size and it suits you then it is fine.
It is very handy if you are on the great lakes like me and have friends scattered at many different Marina's. You crank up the engine and race off to meet them, then flood the tanks and go sailing together. I don't see anything wrong with it, as long as you understand what it is.

It is a great boat for getting to your chossen cruising grounds quickly and and then sailing around and then comming home.

Look at it this way...
My berth is just outside of Toronto...
If I had a Mac I could be in the Thousand Islands in one day and then spend a day or two sailing there and then come home all in one weekend or one long weekend. I think that is great...

Now, for me, I do find the boat a tad small...

Most people are going to react negatively to this boat because it is unconventional... If you like unconventional then you are in the minority (less than 5%). But hey you can't fly mach 3 or go to the moon with conventional... And you can't go 15 knots in a conventional 26 foot sailboat.

Todd
 
#18 ·
again, great input.

Faster, that's more the response I was looking for. Thank you for sharing your experience with the boat.

Also, thanks to everyone else who has shared.

On a personal note, I try to never be in a hurry. Sailing is a "sport" that is relaxing to me - while being fun and exhilerating.

Right now, if I were able to purchase a boat, I'd be looking in the 28-35' classes (big range I know), with a heavy lean toward J/Boats - I really like them a great deal. That range would be able to provide the basics of what I'm looking for in accomodations, and to prep for the day when we can afford a liveaboard (which means a bigger boat). At this point in my research, a cat may be the boat type we end up with later, but not necessarily. But it's all in the beginning stages of research that I fully expect to continue for some time.

I like my brother's Bayfield. True, it is a bit of a pig on speed, and a little heavy to handle, but it is fun and a good boat to learn on (which is one reason he bought that one). There are some performance improvements that can be made to help the speed issue, but the question is whether 'tis worth the cost. Speed always come at a price in any vehicle.

I am intrigued by the Mac - it is a compromise craft. As with all compromises, some things are left behind. A true power boat is better than the Mac, as is a true sailboat. But it has its niche. And thus I'd thought to gather opinions on it.

Sincerely,

/s/ Jon C. Munson II
 
#19 ·
If you like J/boats, I would strongly urge you to go in that direction. While I acknowledge the old saw that every boat is a compromise, there comes a point where too much compromise makes for a boat that is sub-par in all important categories. I know that I will offend someone here, but if you want a sailboat, why not get a sailboat? And if you want a powerboat, why not get a powerboat?
 
#20 ·
CBinRI said:
I know that I will offend someone here, but if you want a sailboat, why not get a sailboat? And if you want a powerboat, why not get a powerboat?
In respect to anything "in between", if you want a motorsailer, get one that is designed to do just that - only with the highest build quality and seakeeping abilities you can afford. Pride of ownership is based upon these attributes.
 
#21 ·
I'd have to agree with CBinRI, there is such a thing as being too much of a compromise. If you really want to sail, you would probably be much happier in a boat that has better sailing performance. If you want speed and sailing performance, go with a multihull.. there are alot of them that are "trailerable". Unfortunately, they're a bit less common and often more expensive than monohulls. Here is a link to a few that are in about the same price range as a new MacGregor.

While I'd also agree with Trueblue, the MacGregor is definitely not designed to be a motorsailer, and one with questionable seakeeping abilities.
 
#22 ·
In having looked around at used Mac's, I didn't really see a plethora of them - so they must not be all that bad. And, with the production as high as it is, they must sell quite a number of them. So, the product can't be all that bad either - it does sell after all.
The Mac 26X is designed to appeal to a specific niche of the boat-buying market, i.e., the person who can't decide whether he wants to be a sailor or a power boater. Generally, they aren't very experienced with either type of boat. Most knowledgeable power boaters probably would not want a Mac 26X, and, as you can see from the above responses, most knowledgeable sailors wouldn't want one either.

Sails don't generate much power, so a sailboat's hull has to be designed so that it can be easily driven, with minimal power. For that reason, sailboats generally have displacement hulls. Power boats are driven by much more powerful motors, and their hulls don't have to be so easily driven. They use a planing hull. It takes a lot of power to get them up on a plane, but the planing hull allows them to reach speeds far beyond that which can be attained by a displacement hull.

The Mac 26X tries to "marry" two types of boats which are completely incompatible, and the incompatibility begins with the hull, the most basic structure of the boat. The result is a boat that provides a very unsatisfying experience for power boaters and sailors alike.

Under power, the boat will be painfully slow and sluggish by comparison with other power boats. Likewise, under sail, it will be painfully slow and sluggish by comparison with other sailboats. In strong winds it will be hard to control, and it won't be able to sail efficiently to windward. In light winds, it won't be able to sail at all.

Many sailors enjoy racing, not just for the competition, but also because it's a big part of the social scene. It gives you an opportunity to mix with the other sailors, and something in common to talk about. But, part of the fun of racing is interacting with other boats as you sail around the race course. But a Mac26X won't be able to keep up with the fleet, and it'll be sailing all alone most of the way around, and it'll habitually be the last to cross the finish line.

My advice is to decide first whether you want to be a power boater or a sailor, and get some experience with both. Check a book or two out of the library on sailboat and powerboat design, and read enough to get a general idea of what makes a good boat of either type. Chapman's classic book on Piloting, Seamanship and Small Boat Handling has a good chapter that discusses the various basic hull designs and their characteristics. Discuss different makes and types of boats with other, experienced boaters. During the off-season, take some basic boating or sailing classes from the local Coast Guard Auxiliary, or Power Squadron, or YMCA. You'll develop a better understanding of what makes a boat perform well or poorly. With that knowledge, you can make a more informed decision about the kind of boat that you'll find satisfying.
 
#24 ·
If he really liked J/Boats and the performance you can get out of them sailing, I doubt he's really in the target market of the MacGregors. I would prefer to have a boat that sails very well—so I can actually sail when I'm supposed to be sailing.

The MacGregors try to be both, and end up failing at really being good as a powerboat or a sailboat. The planing hull design of the Mac 26x can't really be suitable for use under sail, even with water ballast.
 
#26 ·
Consider an older Mac

I have stated these comments before on the Mac thread but worth restating here. I have never sailed a Mac 26X. Go fast boats don't interest me. I have, however, owned a 1991 Mac 26 (swing board with water ballast) since it was almost new and I find it to be the best of all worlds for the trailer sailor. And you can find a used one pretty cheap.

I co-owned a 32 Pearson proir to buying the Mac. I bought the Mac because I wanted to sail the Keys, Maine Coast, all of the Great Lakes and more.

It trailers with no ballast so you can pull it with a smaller tow vehicle and you can tow in hilly regions of the country.

The keel dissapears into the hull so launching and retrieving is easy. You don't have to back so far down the ramp like you do with a fixed keel. I'v seen a number of cars stuck in ramp slime because of that. I'v also seen many trailer wheels go off the end of the ramp because a fixed keel boat needs 3 feet of water to float off the trailer. Also, a dissapearing keel makes beaching the boat possible.

The water ballast keeps the boat stable. I've sailed in winds over 30 kts and have never been knocked down. If it takes too much wind, it rounds head to wind, even if you fight it.

I took my kids sailing with me (I'm harnessed, they in life jackets) on inland lakes since they were 3 years old. They tell me now that those were the best memories of their childhood. We swam off the boat,I cooked, I slept in the V berth, they in the aft berth.

In short, I don't believe there is a better family sailboat. If a boat is difficult to tow, launch, retrieve, and sail, you won't go sailing as often.

If you don't have a lot of bucks to get the boat you want now, you could buy an older Mac, sail it for a few years, and sell it for nearly your purchase price.
 
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