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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
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  #11  
Old 12-31-2006
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wildcard is an unknown quantity at this point
OK, having been a comm fisherman for five years, I just don't get it? 10C water and no survival suits? The boat is hard aground and they died 50 yards from the beach? Even without PFDs it would seem that some would have tried to swim through the surf? Why was the anchor not deployed prior to grounding???????
There is a lot of information missing here. Tragic loss.
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  #12  
Old 12-31-2006
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sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice
Sounds like they might have entered the water trying to clear a trawl from the screw. Probably will have to wait for more details from Giu. Exposure suits-you betcha. Although it does look like they could have sat on top of the pilot house, waited for low tide, and walked ashore.

Giu,
One of the points in the earlier thread was about hypothermia. Survival time is 50 minutes at 50 degrees F without a gumby suit. The water does not have to be freezing and the symptoms of death from hypothermia appear as exhaustion. Often times even getting the person out of the water and into a warm environment is not enough to save them. Once the body's core temperature begins to drop death is not far off and there is little that can be done to raise it back up by artificial means. Anyone who doubts this I would encourage to fill your bathtub with cold tap water, probably 60-65F, and see how long you can sit in it.
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  #13  
Old 12-31-2006
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Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice
The boat run aground in very very heavy surf, and was being hammered pretty bad by waves. There were nets all over, and diesel.

The people (civilians) that tried to go from shore couldn't get there because the boat would hit them. If they jumped they would get trap in the nets, and the waves would kill them. (these photos are taken after the bad weather, and at low tide). If they had suits, which I doubt, they were not wearing them obviously, they were told to stay on the boat and wait for rescue that came too late.

The problem here is these guys waited in a sideways boat, being hit by gigantic waves >15' until they let go one by one. The heli was late by almost 3 hours.
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  #14  
Old 12-31-2006
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wildcard is an unknown quantity at this point
Are life rafts required there, or are they normal gear on a boat like that there?
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Old 12-31-2006
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Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice
Of course they are. Any vessel from basic Coastal navigation (7 mile radius from port) here, have to have a life raft. From Unlimited Coastal, they need EPIRB self deployed raft, etc. and as the boat sails further away from Port, Oceanic ceritification, they need BY LAW all safety equipment.
We are required all the gear, but if you have no time to get to it..

Specially fishing vessels, but the violence of the surf was so great they couldn't do anything other than climb onto the side of the vessel and hold on for dear life.

Try to do anything on a boat that is grounded sideways, with the deck facing the waves (reported 15' and higher), at 7 am in the dark, no power!!

Its easy to say where are the vests, the suits, the raft, they were all there, they just had no time. It looks like that some crew were sleeping and they were doing the final "turn" before heading back. They say they don't know what happened. All they know is they were outside holding on, the water was not cold in oreder to kill, but the surf was very very violent. I know I went sailing that day, too, further south, and it was blowing over 20kts with masive waves.
On that region, in the east coast, the beaches are very very dangerous, as the sea has no mercy there.

Poor guys...what pisses me off is all the money my governement spends in stupid submarines (bought 3, but they are French, probably only dive once!!!), and other useless crap, like Soccer fields for the Euro Cup (that we lost to the Greek in 2004, not even good at that), and Expo this Expo that, and in the mean time, it takes 3 hours for a heli to get to a place less than 50 miles from this....

Ahhhh, am I mad now....
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Old 01-01-2007
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sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice
In less than a week now we've seen two incidents where the vessel is on shore and the crew lost. The indictment of the seamen involved seems to be either not securing themselves to the vessel or leaving it precipitously for a less safe alternative. Since we hear about this year after year, what can one surmise about the level of training in this area? Ironicly, having acquired a few books on sailing this year, I'd have to say they give it short shrift. The manual of my wife's blow dryer spends the first two pages discussing what not to do with it, up to and including use in the shower. In fact, I don't think I've read one that mentions the efficacy of a certain amount of swimming ability or emphasizes not leaving the ship enough.
Just a few stray thoughts on an inherently risky activity.

Last edited by sailaway21; 01-01-2007 at 05:53 AM.
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  #17  
Old 01-01-2007
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"The manual of my wife's blow dryer ... I don't think I've read one that mentions the efficacy of a certain amount of swimming ability or emphasizes not leaving the ship enough."

What, you think the blow dryer manual should explain why swimming ability won't affect the issues of swimming while blow drying?

To some extent, I think a quiet acceptance of deaths at sea might be better than getting the general public involved in marine safety. What's the saying, that an elephant is just a mouse designed by a committee? After the general public got done installing headlights and hardline communications and spare dinghies and dual lifepod launchers, I'm not sure any of use would want to get on the water again.
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