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  #11  
Old 03-29-2007
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Have you checked to see if the distance between the port chainplates and the masthead is the same as that between the starboard chainplates and the masthead? If not, then the mast may be tilted in to one side, even if the tension on the port and starboard shrouds is the same.
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  #12  
Old 03-30-2007
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SD,
Yes Thats how I centered It. I used The main halyard to measure with though not a tape or a micrometer so it could be a little different.

Matt
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  #13  
Old 03-30-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soul searcher
the way I set it up is as follows.
Cap shrouds 12%
forward lowers 12%
Aft lowers 10%
Runnig backs 10%
back stays 15%
I set these with a loos guage they are equal side to side.
Ive been thinking and maybe the increas in backstay tension is where the over all reduction in helm came from I pulled alot of the forstay sag out so I
moved the genoa forward a bit. I may need to let off on that a little. I like to feel the rudder and Im not getting that on the starboard tack. I point better though.
So if the mast head is to far to port I would reduce helm on the starboard tack. I think its pretty close. how far off would it have to be to loose five degrees of helm?
While sailing I was carefull to sheet in the main and genoa and keep the same apperent wind angle (also thought maybe my windex is off).
every thing was the same boat speeds and angles. or as near as I could make them.
what Im really looking for is just a good all round setting that will give the best performance but not overstress the rig I would prefer reduced performance to be in the light air side than in the heavy air side.
Matt, I admit the wind indicator has also crossed my mind..but somehow never mentioned it...I thought it would be obvious.

5º is not that much, I wouldn't worry too much, really..could be that the mast has some sag (right word??) or really the weight is off to one side...most likely cause, since you have done such a good job at setting the rig. By the way, keels sometimes have differences in center of gravity, that are aquired over time, due to hull deformations, and when the boat is on the hard...its very common..if the boat is getting old...deformations are normal..

You also said you want a setting that is medium and are willing to sacrifice performance at low winds, and at same time not overstress, but to do this and have a better performance at higher winds, the tension has to increase.. so stress may occur, and the rig will allow it...don't think its bad...it is not, and also, high tension is sometimes good, as the tension keeps the rig tight avoiding "impact" when you tack.

The values you have seem right, and without sailing it I can't really tell..I am glad you understand the concept, and the interaction of the backstay in stay tension..

Maybe, the only thing I would do, is probably increase the stay tension to 20to 25% and give it a try...but if you are happy, leave it.

As foir the 5º.. drink a beer, they'll go away... I normally don't get worried over 8º. That is my limit, and that's where my wheels are marked...with tape

If you need more help, please let me know..
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  #14  
Old 03-30-2007
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Thanks for the advice Gui.
I have to make a trip up the mast soon anyway so I've added checking the windex to the list. Also need to re calibrate the electric one (close hauled /vmg) I know its Off.
Its blowing about 25 out Right now and I have a bunch of paper work to do this morning maybe we can go this after noon and see what She does.
The boat performs way better than when I started this according to the model 3a seat of the pants. I just don't want to get into a lee helm condition.


Thanks Again
Matt
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  #15  
Old 03-31-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soul searcher
SD,
Yes Thats how I centered It. I used The main halyard to measure with though not a tape or a micrometer so it could be a little different.

Matt
It is probably off just a little, since the main halyard is biased to one side or the other, since there are usually both port and starboard halyard on the mast... and it will be a tiny bit shorter on one side, as it travels two inches more...but I don't think that's really going to affect the balance all that much.

The electronic wind instruments can be reset fairly easily. The one on my boat was off by 165 degrees... which was a royal pain until I figured out how to reset it.
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  #16  
Old 04-01-2007
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SD mine is not that far off maybe 5 to 8 degrees.
I have two lists, one is a blowing twenty list, the other is a dead calm list.
now if I can just get the weather to cooperate
My calm day list includes calibrating the vmg and swinging the auto pilot compass. after I move the compass. and go up the mast and check every thing out and lube the transducer for the wind gauges.
and in between sailing days.

Gui your right on the cap shrouds I think Ill go up on them.
I got out yesterday and made it a couple miles on the starboard tack in 15 knts and gusting to 20. There was a very slight bow In the leeward shroud.
I was just getting to where i could tack and the wind let up steering groove is a little to narrow so I think ill let off the backstays a little also.
This stuff is fun
thanks again all
Matt
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  #17  
Old 04-01-2007
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You guys are weird, I leave my standing rigging alone and use the more easily adjustable controls (main sheet, jib sheet, traveler, vang, cunningham, outhaul, reef, jib rollerfurler) in my cockpit to balance my boat's helm....

Last edited by tenuki; 04-01-2007 at 02:50 AM.
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  #18  
Old 04-01-2007
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tenuki,
I think we're treating that as a given, for purposes of this discussion. Getting the rig tuned properly is the first step in being able to maximize the effectiveness of those things you mentioned. Unfortunately, for some of us, we just get it tuned to a fair thee well, and that fourth season rolls in and we have to take it all apart again!
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  #19  
Old 04-01-2007
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uh, I was joking....
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  #20  
Old 04-01-2007
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Tenuki...it may sound dumb, but I do change rig tension when sailing, and change them a lot..

There are primary "general" changes, achieved by a hydraulic jack at mast foot, (from 0 to 6000lb press) that is used to tension and de-tension mast. This is done and used just like adjusting back stay tension...you just need to go to the mast foot inside

Then there is the "detailed" changes, that are done usually when racing, as those need a guy to go up to adjust the intermediate shrouds..

I do the general changes even when sailing alone..the others..we need crew...
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