Great Minds Choose Smaller Boats?

[sailingdog]

Labatt-

I thought every one knew I sail a trimaran... As far as I can tell, you're only sailing a third of a boat... She does fit into a standard slip, since the amas retract, but out sailing she's got a 18' beam. And I can generally run a 40' boat down without much trouble...

Right now, she's in storage, just waiting for the season to start. She's next to a Cape Dory 25, and absolutely dwarfs her... But she is 3' longer LOA than the CD25.

[sailingdog]

Originally Posted by Giulietta

SD...that is a point but it only applies based on what you want to do with the boat...

Never said otherwise.. if you want a fast racing boat that can cruise with a family of four... I wouldn't suggest anything smaller than what you've got...

Where does that leave me??? mine is 42...

But she has no boom...so she's not going anywhere anytime soon... when's the new boom supposed to come in.

There are those that have sailed almost all sizes of boats in a life time, that have gone from optimists to 420, to 470, to Star to dragon 25, 28, 32, and now chose a 42 for racing purposes..in my opinion...size depends on what you want to do, and HOW....

I went from Sunfish, to Cape Cod Mercuries, to J/24s, to OPBs, and finally decided to stop mooching rides on OPBs, and got her...

I single hand my boat, no problem here, I could cross the Atlantic solo on her...I can cruise with the family also, I can strip her and race...to me my boat is the best size for me now...and the important word is "good for now"...I believe.

A family of four would go crazy on a boat as small as mine.

All this to say that small may be good for one purpose, but larger will fit more purposes...hope I explained..terrible headach now...something I ate here

Must be the morcella... Nasty stuff...

[pmoyer]

I just noticed the reference to Sanderson on ABN AMRO ONE, and RKJ on Saga Insurance, and I'd like to point out some things about the Volvo Open (VO) designs.

These boats are designed to be planing or semi-planing hulls. The materials engineering and designs are at least at the edge of safety (or over the edge of safety). There's no way comparing a cruising or even a crusing/racing sailor's needs to these gents, or the other VO racers, is even reasonable. There are three reasons for sailing big in racing: long waterlines sail faster (e.g., Wild Oats, the super-maxi that won the Sydney to Hobart), longer boats take bigger breaking waves to roll, and (most importantly) the notice of race includes the class specification. When you're entering the Volvo Ocean Race, you either sail a VO70 or you don't sail. Because of the speed requirements, they're super-uncomfortable boats to sail, particularly to weather when they pound horribly.

These designs are incredibly fast. "The Black Pearl" (Paul Cayard's VO70 from the last VOR) hit 48.something knots surfing in the Southern Ocean. Kojiro Shiraishi in the VO60 "Spriti of Yukoh" hit 52 knots rounding Cape Horn in a Force 9 - just a month ago in the Velux 5 Oceans (singlehanded).

These designs are also very dangerous, IMO, from a seaworthiness perspective. Alex Thompson abandoned his VO60 "Hugo Boss" in the first leg of the Velux 5 Oceans because (I think) the keel failed. He was rescued by Mike Golding in Ecover (another Open 60), which was partially dismasted two hours later. In the VOR, Movistar (an Open 70) broke her keel and had to be abandoned in the North Atlantic during a storm - the crew was rescued by ABN AMRO TWO. (An aside: somewhere on my drive at home is a picture I took, which is probably the last photograph of Movistar's ill-fated keel, taken in the slings in Baltimore.) Graham Dalton, in a VO50, broke two fingers in the Southern Ocean when the boat tripped on her keel. These designs require constant helm attention by very experienced helmsmen. Paul Cayard has actually said that he probably won't sail a VO design again because they're just too dangerous. In the quest for extra speed, some feel they go too far in design compromises.

That said, these are very sexy boats, and I really love them. If I had a chance to race on one, I would. But I wouldn't even think of using them as an argument for a particular boat design (other than one that wins races)....


(this is one of my shots from the VOR)

[skrap1r0n]

Originally Posted by sailingdog

I don't see any point in carrying a DVD player, when my laptop is perfectly capable of doing all that.

If I were you, I'd be looking at the Elizabethan 33, Southern Cross 35, Hallberg Rassy Rasmus 35, or the Alberg 37 (which came in yawl and sloop rigs IIRC). These are boats that are probably in your price range, and fairly seaworthy.

Not wanting a big screen plasma, but one of those little flip down things like they mount in auto's would be really cool.

Also, thanks for those models. I am not really sure of all the manufaturers out there, I like those a lot. I am mainly looking for something that will be a good blue water home for a while and that is mostly affordable.

Originally Posted by tenuki

skrap1r0n, You can learn a lot on a that catalina 25, but I know what you mean about the headroom, heck I'm 5' 9" and they seem small to me. My boat is even worse but I don't plan on spending much time below. I know people who are still stuck on their big boats 'getting ready' to take off, but there is always some maintenance or upgrade that needs to get paid for first.

I am on a lake, and don't get me wrong, I love the 25, and honestly, the only changes I would like to see would be for it to have an inboard rather than an outboard and a marine head rather than a portalet. I would then feel better about maybe putting it in the gulf and do some costal hopping. The size isn't really bad for now, but I am not sure I would want to spend more than a few days at a time in it.

[sailingdog]

Skrap-

Here are a few more boats that might make your list to look at:

Bristol 32
Westsail 32
Allied Luders 33
Contest 33
Allied Seabreeze 34
Bristol 33 or 34

PMoyer-

That was my point about comparing apples to apples.. The Volvo Open racing designs aren't owned by a person, they're owned by a corporation... and they're not cruising boats... comparing a VO boat to a cruising boat is like comparing an Formula 1 car to a soccer mom's mini-van. I am willing to bet if you asked any one of the VO sailors what boats they would pick to cruise on, the VO boats wouldn't be in the top ten of their list...

[ianhlnd]

SD, got into this late, but, you really know how to push the right buttons. I'm even thinking how I can defend me owning a 45 ft. heavy displacement boat. I just know, that I get caught out in some pretty heavy muck sometimes, that happens when you're out more than 150 days a year, and when it's blowing 45+ with 12-15 ft breaking seas, I don't want to be in a 27 footer. Could a 27'er make it, sure it could and have, but, while I'm having a hot coco in the center cockpit and I pass a 30'er with the sails blown out and the crew with that 1000 yard stare, I'm glad I have what I have.

In the middle of the ocean, all boats are small.

[Giulietta]

Originally Posted by pmoyer

(this is one of my shots from the VOR)

Wow....look at those wheels!!!! where have I seen them???

[pmoyer]

Originally Posted by sailingdog

I am willing to bet if you asked any one of the VO sailors what boats they would pick to cruise on, the VO boats wouldn't be in the top ten of their list...

No way. But it would be an interesting poll. I wonder what they would choose. I was planning on talking to a few, coincidentally, in a couple of weeks; I'll ask, just for grins.

Cheers!

[pmoyer]

Originally Posted by Giulietta

Wow....look at those wheels!!!! where have I seen them???

Some of us without them are envious of those that have them....

I'll just go sit in the corner and play with my tiller.

Cheers!

[conrat66]

Wouldnt it be a shame if we were all the same. I know an excellant family that traveled for ten years or so on a 28 bristol channel cutter with three children and an adult couple form Baja to Maine. They had an excellant time and fine folks. I know a friend singlehands a Grampyteau 36 and would like a fifty foot freedom ................ Whatever we can afford and handle, I would like a little bigger but can realistically afford a little smaller So just sail as much and as often as possible and have a great time. Seems to be the best plan.