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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
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  #21  
Old 05-08-2007
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yotphix is on a distinguished road
People make bad and even foolhardy decisions on boats all the time. Most of the time nothing bad comes of it. Sometimes it goes very badly. That doesn't change the fact though, that only the people on a given boat know what information was available to them, and who was making decisions from that info.
Those of you who condemn people in distress as dummy's would do well to consider that, and to consider that some of the people on a given boat could be innocent victims of a skipper who made bad decision.
Do us all a favour and put your energy into expressing your hope that everyone makes it back to shore safely, or learning something from the misfortune rather than spouting off about situations you know little to nothing about. It really gets tired.
And thanks XTR for further illuminating what went down.
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  #22  
Old 05-09-2007
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camaraderie is a jewel in the rough camaraderie is a jewel in the rough camaraderie is a jewel in the rough
Yot... we all hope for good outcomes for anyone caught out at sea...but second guessing things is lots of fun especially when more facts come out and prove someone right or wrong.
I CAN tell you that no one belongs on diamond shoals on MONDAY when storms were predicted at LEAST 3-4 days earlier. Lots of sailors make bad decisions...hell...Donna Lange made a bad decision a couple of weeks back and she is MOST accommplished yet was lucky to survive.
I don't see anything wrong at all with saying "What WERE they thinking? How could they end up there??"
Here's another thought...XTR explains that they didn't hear till Friday. So what??...the winds and storm track were from the NORTH/West. Chris Parker was on the SSB telling people to head south to get out of the way. Could it be that DELIVERY boats like the 52 footer that is still missing face a choice between safety and a delivery schedule and made the wrong choice because they continue to push on until it is too late to make a choice?
These are things we should talk about here in my opinion. So...if you're tired of it...stop reading!
There are 2 ways to avoid making dumb decisions at sea. MAKE ONE really bad one OR read about decisions others have made and LEARN. Hopefully then we will make only SMALL dumb decisions!
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  #23  
Old 05-09-2007
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I'm not tired at all of discussion where there is some hope of learning something, just of blowhards calling people that they don't know, in situations they know little about, dummies, or stupid. It is good to talk about what went wrong and why. That's how the body of knowledge grows. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
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  #24  
Old 05-09-2007
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Maybe out of turn.
We, all readers of sail net (including me) seem to assume the sailors knew the conditions as we know of now. Jesus Christ, not even the weather men can predict 3 days more that 50/50.
But, given what unknown sailors were thinking and doing at the time of the storm---Kinsabe!
I will assume they were using there best judgement, whether with barometer, compass and chart, or weather radar, chartplotter, and Bill Gatesís davy chest aboard, they would do their best to survive. DumAssís,,, I think not. How about, ďI didnít think it would get this ******* badĒ! hmm, I say that at least 5 times a year. Hopefully, they were a student of Lynn and Larry Pardey.
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  #25  
Old 05-09-2007
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Unfortunately, when the Captain is a dummy, he can take alot of innocent people down with him...case in point, Capt. Edward Smith of the RMS Titanic.
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Old 05-09-2007
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Hearing stories of what happened, and even speculation about what might have happened, allows us to plan for different circumstances. I particularly enjoyed reading all of the blogs by Skip & Lydia and the Flying Pig (Morgan 461) that beached in Marathon in February. Part of what I appreciated in their case was their willingness to admit and talk about their mistakes – and there were a number of them. It helped that they were both good writers. It was helpful to appreciate the range of emotions they felt; fear, despair, anger, hope, and appreciation.

I agree that mistakes were probably made by the boats this week. Or as has been mentioned, mistakes were made by their captains and some of the crew may have just been along for an unfortunate ride. But if we all wait until we are beyond making mistakes to venture out, we will never go. The weather can be a deadly enemy and when we go out we all know we could encounter danger of the highest order. It sounds like the weather was expected to be bad, but it probably exceeded the strength of the initial forecasts, and some might have realized they made a bad call.

I for one am trying to spend time getting to know weather patterns - what's predicted to happen and what could happen. Hopefully by doing that I reduce the chances of heading out into a disaster.
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Old 05-09-2007
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I bet your so good that when you sail,pompusness your boat it doesn't even get wet. Your pompusness, if it's a word, is really getting old.
How about cutting people some slack once in awhile.
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  #28  
Old 05-09-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccam
Hopefully, they were a student of Lynn and Larry Pardey.
cc

Hey, I'm glad you brought them up, after the front that went threw a couple weeks back, I started looking for anything I could find on surviving a storm, a slip neighbor turned me onto to a video call Storm tactics by L & L Pardey.

They discribed the whole Hoove too procedure for heavy seas, but when they showed it in actual use it was in unrelatively calm waters.

So, the question is, has anybody been in a situation where they used this tactic, and if so, what were the sea conditions and how did it fair



and one other question, where would you draw the line at using this tactic

Last edited by poopdeckpappy; 05-09-2007 at 02:58 PM.
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  #29  
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I would think with 40 foot waves I would prefer to sail a few degrees off of the wind with a small amount of sail. With the wind so strong and the waves so large you would run the risk of getting caught beam to the waves and rolled if you heave-to.
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Old 05-09-2007
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I'm in the they-did-the-best-with-the-information-they-had group -- at least until I hear a detailed debrief of what they knew and when they knew it. I'm a little surprised at the tougher minded points of view expressed here. In any case it's all interesting.
Sailhog
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