Pointing Trouble - Page 2 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #11  
Old 10-09-2007
chucklesR's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Pasadena Md - Magothy side
Posts: 5,978
Thanks: 10
Thanked 30 Times in 30 Posts
Rep Power: 10
chucklesR is a jewel in the rough chucklesR is a jewel in the rough chucklesR is a jewel in the rough
If the rigging checks out/plays out and you still can't get here to point evenly on port/starboard tacks check out the hull shape/weight balance - it can factor significantly if it is off kilter.
I had that problem the first couple of times out on my brand new - knew the rigging was fine catamaran. Then I shifted all the alcohol and mixers (plus other toy's and stuff) from the port side aft to the stbd side aft - the weight of the liquid's plus the weight of the 480 amp hours of post production batteries was enough to matter. I suspect it would not affect a keel boat as much, but it might...
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #12  
Old 10-09-2007
Here .. Pull this
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,031
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 8
Sailormann will become famous soon enough
Quote:
most people on the P30 mailing list, the PO, and everybody we've talked to at the club, incl. our sponsor, says "You don't need it."
The Loos gauge is the first thing you should do. I will guarantee you that the people who are telling you that you don't need it are NOT experienced in rig tuning, and I don't care how long they have been sailing, they do not know what they are talking about.

If the things were not worth several times their cost in added performance and enhanced rig durability people would not have been buying them for the last several decades.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #13  
Old 10-09-2007
Owner, Green Bay Packers
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: SW Michigan
Posts: 10,318
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 12
sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice
I concur with Sailormann.
__________________
“Scientists are people who build the Brooklyn Bridge and then buy it.”
Wm. F. Buckley, Jr.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #14  
Old 10-09-2007
soul searcher's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ft. Walton Beach FL.
Posts: 488
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
soul searcher is on a distinguished road
Jim,
Sounds like you weren't that far out(count your blessings). I still would want to have it perfectly even side to side. and to know what the actual tension is. If for instance the rig is equal but only tightened to 8 or 10 percent, you wiill still be putting a shock load on it when you jibe or tack in 20+.
Get the loos, get it equal and start racing that boat. with speeds like that you would whoop every boat at our wed. race hands down.
__________________
Matt
s\v Soul Searcher
Caliber 40LRC

All boats are sinking it's just a matter of how fast.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #15  
Old 10-10-2007
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,710
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
SEMIJim will become famous soon enough SEMIJim will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by soul searcher View Post
Jim,
Sounds like you weren't that far out(count your blessings).
Actually, we were. Embarrassing admission: All I'd have had to have done was sight up the mast track, as every article ever written on the subject says to do, and I'd have seen the significant mast bend to starboard right off! Talk about a major "Doh!" And I knew this. Why didn't I do it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by soul searcher View Post
I still would want to have it perfectly even side to side.
The main issues are that the mast is in column (it is now), has the optimum amount of pre-bend (which the guy that helped us put in), and that it's tensioned properly for the sailing conditions. Apparently it's not uncommon to re-tune the entire rig, depending on expected conditions. (Looser for cruising and in lighter air, tighter for racing and in heavy air.) It's also not uncommon for racers to re-tune the aft lower shrouds depending on air and tack.

Quote:
Originally Posted by soul searcher View Post
and to know what the actual tension is. If for instance the rig is equal but only tightened to 8 or 10 percent, you wiill still be putting a shock load on it when you jibe or tack in 20+.
Understood.

Quote:
Originally Posted by soul searcher View Post
Get the loos, get it equal
Like I said: Everything I've been told and read about our rig says that what's most important is that the mast is in column, and that it stays in column under moderate load. (I'll be checking that latter as we sail her.) According to Bill Shaw (Pearson designer): That's all that's necessary.

That being said (take note, Sailormann and sailaway21): I'm a guy who likes to be able to measure things. I'd like to have a Loos gauge even if only to record the tensions resulting from the tuning she got last Sunday. So maybe I'll just break my personal piggy bank and get one. Haven't decided yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by soul searcher View Post
and start racing that boat. with speeds like that you would whoop every boat at our wed. race hands down.
When I related to the PO some of the speeds we were seeing (and the knotmeter isn't broken--the GPS [approximately] confirms what the knotmeter tells us), he said she's above-average fast for a P30 and a boat of her design and class. He said it sometimes happens in manufacturing that, for whatever reason, a particular boat just comes together "just so," and ends-up being faster than she's supposed to be. Plus he did some work, such as fairing the keel.

Jim
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #16  
Old 10-10-2007
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
SEMIJim-

Don't bother getting the inexpensive Loos guages... get the more expensive ones, as they're easier to use and a good deal more accurate. The price difference isn't all that much, especially if you consider how long you'll have them.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #17  
Old 10-10-2007
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,710
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
SEMIJim will become famous soon enough SEMIJim will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog View Post
SEMIJim-

Don't bother getting the inexpensive Loos guages... get the more expensive ones, as they're easier to use and a good deal more accurate.
Wasn't going to. (If I do it.) Was going to go for the "Pro" version. For my rigging (the diameters of which are yet to be determined), they look to be running around $85 or so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog View Post
The price difference isn't all that much, especially if you consider how long you'll have them.
About $15 to $20 more, or so. I agree.

Jim
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #18  
Old 10-10-2007
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Michigan
Posts: 555
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
tommyt is on a distinguished road
OK, now who has found the best resourse for Loos Guages? I have continued to put off buying one, but my as well put it on my Christmas lists and order it for my lovely wife to surprise me with.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #19  
Old 10-10-2007
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Michigan
Posts: 555
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
tommyt is on a distinguished road
Should mention that my wire is 1/4" and 5/16". The prices I am seeing are about double for the pro version.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #20  
Old 10-10-2007
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Rigging Only has them for a pretty good price.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Trouble Starting my Yanmar 1GM bullrunner Hunter 2 11-14-2007 03:06 PM
Coast Guard says sailboats in trouble off NC coast - Wilmington Morning Star NewsReader News Feeds 0 05-07-2007 11:15 AM
Coast Guard says sailboats in trouble off NC coast - WCNC (subscription) NewsReader News Feeds 0 05-07-2007 11:15 AM
Trouble Starting my Yanmar 1GM bullrunner Gear & Maintenance 3 04-25-2007 04:16 AM
Pointing Performance Dan Dickison Racing Articles 0 11-27-2000 07:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:17 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.