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post #11 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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You know, I lost a lot of respect for Bob in his recent refit and subsequent "purchase" of a new Shannon.

I mean he did a full rebuild of his last hole in the water, almost free of charge due to product reviews, articles, "DIY" installs (with mucho help from the manufacturers) of all sorts of equipment.

Less than 6 months later he sells that tub, and is looking for a new boat. In speaking with Walter (of Shannon), he says...

"Theres nothing I want more on earth, but I can't afford it" he says in his latest article.
AHA, but it seems he can with his "connections in the industry and my advertisers"

I'm not jealous that I can't afford the over 650k for a Shannon, not many people can (without putting the wife back on the corner) but c'mon folks If Morgan Freeman can afford one, why can't Bob?

Will the product reviews be based on independence, or because he got equipment and installation for free?

Hey, look, I'm all for getting free stuff too, but being a shill isn't what I'm into.

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post #12 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardiacpaul View Post
Will the product reviews be based on independence, or because he got equipment and installation for free?

Hey, look, I'm all for getting free stuff too, but being a shill isn't what I'm into.
It does seem as though all the reviews are glowing. I mean really, are there any products out there that suck? Not if it's free! L&A also has an ungodly amount of space dedicated to advertising. Like anything else though we have to objective with what we read. That's why I look at (not read) L&A, for the chicks. By the way, did I mention the hot chick climbing the boarding ladder on page 70.....NICE! Am I a dirtbag? Yeah, but at least I'm honest with myself about it.

Dictated, but not read.
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post #13 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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I'd have to agree with CP... the fact that he sold Lost Soul, after doing a huge refit and getting most of the products and such for free or for little cost... he sells her, saying "he can't afford such an expensive boat". The boat's rebuild was a huge tax write off.. Yeah, right.

The magazine also seems to be slowly upping the size of the boats that are "required" to cruise....

Sailingdog

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post #14 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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A few years ago, L&A used to have a pretty good following at my marina. But now, nobody buys that rag anymore, nor would they get caught dead with the flag on their halyard.

What started as a small cult group of rebellious cruisers at L&A led by Bob Bitchin, evolved into a greedy bunch of capitalists - mascarading as pirates, who shamelessly promote any company willing to pay the big bucks for their endorsement.

BB's laughing all the way to the bank.

True Blue . . .
sold the Nauticat
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post #15 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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Yes - Bob is going to continue the free online magazine, and we are going to continue the free TV channel. We are very excited about it and know we'll have a lot of happy readers/viewers out there.

BUT... The image that Bob has of having a ton of money is so far from the truth, you guys that believe "he's laughing all the way to the bank" will never believe anything else. By selling the Lost Soul, he is no longer deep in debt to the "vulture capitalists" from starting the magazine in the first place, and subsequently building it up. If you're not a business owner yourself, you can't appreciate what it takes - especially on a national scale. He's an independent publisher in a world dominated by huge media conglomerates who have tried unsuccesfully for 10 years to put him out of business. The people that own the "big" sailing magazines don't even really sail. They bought those mags as "profit centers" - and that's all it is to them. THEY are the greedy bunch of capitalists. You like supporting them more, be my guest. That's why I always go to my local chandlery first before the big national corporate chains. The people who own and have put their lives into Good Old Boat, Bluewater Sailing, and Lats & Atts (and SailNet), they do it because they are passionate about sailing, the people, and the lifestyle. Oh, and by the way, they do have to make money at it - OR THE MAGAZINES WOULDN'T EXIST. Duh.

And as far as selling the Lost Soul. Again, here's the reality. He sunk over $150,000 of his own money into it. He didn't get everything for free. He did get almost everything at manufacturers cost. You think Forespar is going to give him $35K in Leisurefurl booms for free? They don't even spend that much in advertising with him over 3 years! You think the guys from the local marina that rebuilt the entire teak deck and subdeck over a period of many months did it for free? Do you know how much that costs for a 56 foot boat? Anderson power winches, free? All new stainless hatches, free? Come on people, get real... Yeah, he got some things for free. A $300 item here, $450 item there - in trade for ads. I'm sure none of you skeptics would do the same thing. Oh, and this was Bob and Jody's home - so he only wanted either the best or top quality items. When he recommends or endorses a product from that (or future projects), it's because he either uses the product or he believes in it.

Selling the Lost Soul? It wasn't even for sale. This guy calls Bob up in Mexico, wants to come see the boat. Bob says come on over. The guy looks the boat over and says "How much?" Bob says it's not for sale. The guys says, "Come on, every boat is for sale". Bob says not this one, then proceeds to explain what's he's put into it over the last two years in blood, sweat, and tears. The guy says, "I know, Ive been reading about it." So Bob says then you understand why it's not for sale. So the guy says "I'll give you $XXX,XXX." Bob says he literally looked at the guy for about three seconds and impulsively said, "OK..." Someone offers you twice what your boat is worth, go ahead and say no.

The new boat? He's getting a finished hull and deck with a roughed in interior. It's up to him to finish it. Yes, companies came out of the woodwork to be part of the project. When Olaf Harken (another man of integrity along with Bob, Walter Schultz, and many others he's working with) says we'll work with you on this project, why do you think he said that? Oh yeah, I guess he's just greedy too. It's not that he thinks Bob and his magazine have honestly touched more lives in a good way and wants to be part of it. No, that would be too good to be true, so it must not be. And if Joe Blow Furling Systems came to him and said "I'll give you my cheaply made products for free in exchange for you saying it's great stuff", he would not do it.

All right, my rant is over. Sorry. I have to get back to work. It's just that I get my dander up when it comes to completely incorrect assumptions and perceptions about my friend and partner. That's because I know him, and many of you only buy into the "image". I don't even know why I try to tell some of you the truth, because I know you'll still think the same way you did before...


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post #16 of 34 Old 12-21-2007 Thread Starter
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Moon...thanks for the WHOLE story! Great news that it will continue to be free on line!!
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post #17 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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Moon - Thank You. Maaayybeeee.... even some of the people with the pre-conceived notions will appreaciate a little insight.

Stan
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post #18 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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"By selling the Lost Soul, he is no longer deep in debt to the "vulture capitalists" from starting the magazine in the first place, and subsequently building it up. If you're not a business owner yourself, you can't appreciate what it takes - especially on a national scale. "


My heart is bleeding for him. and yes, I am a business owner, multiple times.

I've read his whole story, from the biker days backwards too, and say what you will, no man gets into bed with "vulture capitalists" unless he knows exactly what the bottom line is.
And he and jody both did. If they didn't know they were fools of the first order.

As far as the refits to lost soul and the new boats are concerned..
Any accountant that not a dolt will or has used these items as operating expense, not capital expenditures and business tax write downs along with the cruises, and every nut bolt and washer ever purchased. Every show that he attends can and should be taken for a business deduction.

Just by the addition of the Shannon in the magazine warrants the purchase of ANY equipment, hull included as an operating expense.

You think Forespar is going to give him $35K in Leisurefurl booms for free?

I'm also not an idiot. The pieces that were written were worth far more than any series of full page ads.

"And if Joe Blow Furling Systems came to him and said "I'll give you my cheaply made products for free in exchange for you saying it's great stuff", he would not do it."

Why would he? Not when Harkin, Shaeffer, and whoever else says, here lets put this on your frogbobber 41. handshake, done deal. Even if its at "cost". (see operating expense) I wonder why he didn't put a solar stik on Lost Soul?

"Oh, and by the way, they do have to make money at it - OR THE MAGAZINES WOULDN'T EXIST. Duh"

Sarcasm isn't your strong suit. A CFO of a fortune 100 company told me... "If your CPA finds a profit for your company at the end off the fiscal, fire him on the spot and find one that doesn't."

Do you think Ellison has title to the BMW/Oracle boat? hell no, its in the marketing department.

And please, try not to tell me what I think, I know what I think, and I've got no problem at all telling anyone what I think, just what I think.

If it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck....

We are not primarily on earth to see through one another, but to see one another through

Some people are like slinkies: not really good for anything... but you can't help laughing when you push them down the stairs

Last edited by cardiacpaul; 12-21-2007 at 03:00 PM.
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post #19 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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Cardiac,
You know, I would love to find a way to write my boat off, as would most people I bet. I see nothing wrong with that if you're in a position to do so. I'm just not in that position. Give the man a break.
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post #20 of 34 Old 12-21-2007
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I'm with Cardiac on this. In fact Bob B isn't talking here, Moonfish is and if you have a look, I would venture a guess that over 80% of his post have Lat & Att in them one way of another. So we are just getting a second point of view. Maybe a little less bias.

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