When Does Coastal Crusing Become Off Shore - Page 3 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #21  
Old 02-15-2008
Catalina274me's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Vancouver,Wa
Posts: 64
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 7
Catalina274me is on a distinguished road
I just had my boat Coast Guard inspected last weekend and I was told that inland waters inspection is self explaining, but offshore is considered were I am in the Columbia River, Tongue Point and beyond, which is still in the river but more than 2 miles wide, at the Mouth of the river,(Columbia River Bar). The only differance in the 2 inspections now, (new this year) is for offshore you not only need 3 flares, but 3 smoke signals, for daytime use. Like I say this is what I was told by the Coasties.
__________________
Catalina 27
Columbia River, Wa

Last edited by Catalina274me; 02-15-2008 at 03:16 PM. Reason: Spelling errors bug me
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #22  
Old 02-15-2008
Thanks Courtney.
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: IL
Posts: 3,953
Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 10
T34C has a spectacular aura about T34C has a spectacular aura about T34C has a spectacular aura about
The Coast Guard definition of Inland waterways is a completely different animal all together. Some one else will be along shortly with the actual defination of "inland waterways".
__________________
hunter Legend 37 Semper Paratus
Formerly - Tartan 34C Yawl
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #23  
Old 02-15-2008
vega1860's Avatar
Swab
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: At Sea
Posts: 689
Thanks: 0
Thanked 16 Times in 14 Posts
Rep Power: 8
vega1860 is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freesail99 View Post
When does coastal cruising before off shore ? At what point does that happen ?
When your mind shifts from considering running for port when the weather starts kicking up to worrying about having enough sea room.

Malie ke kai

Last edited by vega1860; 02-15-2008 at 01:58 PM. Reason: add sig
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #24  
Old 02-15-2008
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
A big mistake that novice sailors often make is trying to make a break for a harbor, and then they get hammered just before they make the safety of the harbor... often, it is far safer to make a break for deeper waters when in doubt of whether you'll make the harbor.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #25  
Old 02-15-2008
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: New York
Posts: 5,399
Thanks: 0
Thanked 14 Times in 14 Posts
Rep Power: 14
bubb2 has a spectacular aura about bubb2 has a spectacular aura about bubb2 has a spectacular aura about
My first Coast Guard License read as follows: Operator of uninspected passenger vessels upon NEAR COASTAL WATERS (not more than -100- miles offshore)

Last edited by bubb2; 02-15-2008 at 02:50 PM. Reason: spell error
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #26  
Old 02-15-2008
.
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 10,855
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 12
Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice Giulietta is just really nice
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freesail99 View Post
When does coastal cruising before off shore ? At what point does that happen ?
Your answer is:

When you are doing coastal navigation, there is a line when you will no longer be doing coastal.

If you cross that line, your're off shore.


When you are doing off shore navigation, there is a line when you will no longer be doing off shore.

If you cross that line, your're coastal.

Just cross the line...simple
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #27  
Old 02-15-2008
chucklesR's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Pasadena Md - Magothy side
Posts: 5,938
Thanks: 9
Thanked 29 Times in 29 Posts
Rep Power: 9
chucklesR is a jewel in the rough chucklesR is a jewel in the rough chucklesR is a jewel in the rough
The Chesapeake bay has areas that are more than 30 miles wide down south of me so the 12 mile rule would not seem to apply.
It depends I guess on for what purpose you are classifying the boat - as RB said in Europe according to their system 12nm is where it is delineated. So if the manufacture wishes to have the boat he's building listed as class A (open ocean) he has to follow certain rules regarding scantlings, safety factors and the like. On the other hand what is the magical difference between 12nm and 13nm, or even pushing the limit to 24nm - not a damn thing. 12nm is the arbitary international sovereignty limit (aruguable, some don't recognize it) So at 13nm in theory you could sail around the world? I think not.

While my Gemini is a certified Class A boat per EU standards and has made both Pacific and Atlantic crossings I do not consider it open ocean / blue water for me without substantial modifications, and I think that is all that matters.
A fine example is Hunter 49 (not picking on it, just a example - substitute any production boat in it's class), a 'blue water, world cruiser'. But it, and others in its class are built for the mooring ball more than high lat sailing by design if not scantlings.
We know design is far more important than scantlings, building a J24 so it's a inch thick does not make it a world cruiser.
I think what makes a boat a blue water boat is when you can take that boat out with an average crew (average experience, average physical capabilities) and sail it bluewater with what a average person would call a reasonable expectation of success, by which I mean not only survival, but arriving in port heathly, strong and whole in both mind and body.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #28  
Old 02-15-2008
danielgoldberg's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: New York
Posts: 679
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 7
danielgoldberg is on a distinguished road
Fun Question

It comes up all the time on various boards, but it's still fun to debate. I don't think there is any one definition that works, and I think it's a combination of a number of factors, many dependent on where you are. Setting the line simply at the point where it's hard to get into port before the weather hits doesn't really work, IMHO. If you're halfway between Fisher's Island and Block Island, you have no chance of getting to port before a fast moving system comes upon you (at least in a sailboat). Same is true between Block and Martha's Vineyard. And even though those stretches are exposed to the ocean from the south and east (basically you sail in the lee of London), I wouldn't really call them "bluewater." Though maybe I should reconsider that, as it would mean I would have many many more "bluewater" miles under my keel. Hmmm?

Oddly enough, I think water depth also plays a little part in this analysis. Not because it matters intrinsically whether the water is 50 or 5,000 feet deep, but once you are "off the shelf," you really are out there. The wave pattern also is much different. Likewise, at some points on the Bahama bank you can't get to port too easily and you have miles and miles of sea room, but can you possibly claim to be in bluewater when your depth sounder reads 12 feet and you can just drop an anchor at any point and ride out whatever's hitting you?

I actually think some (not all) stretches off the NJ coast have several attributes that make them feel like bluewater, if they are not in fact so. The water is very deep, there are no harbors of refuge that are reachable as a practical matter, and in anything with an easterly component you feel the wind and sea just like you would if you were 100 miles to the east. I appreciate that if you're only a few miles offshore you're hard-pressed to call that "bluewater" (particularly off the Jersey coast where it's mostly brown water; just a joke, keep your swords sheathed), but that stretch most definitely has some attributes that are akin to bluewater sailing.

All that blubbering said, if you had to pick one attribute that "defined" bluwater sailing, I would say the inability to get to port without an overnight passage puts you in bluewater territory, with the caveat that there are places on the planet that would constitute exceptions, going both ways.

Regards,
__________________
Dan Goldberg

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #29  
Old 02-15-2008
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Chuckles-

The EU RCD A rated Geminis are a bit different from the one you have. For instance, the EU version has a bridgedeck in the cockpit, which helps prevent water from downflooding into the cabin from the cockpit. IIRC, the American versions of the boats don't have that feature. There are a few other differences IIRC as well. If you were to import your boat into the EU, you would not get an EU RCD A category rating, since your boat doesn't have the required modifications.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucklesR View Post
While my Gemini is a certified Class A boat per EU standards and has made both Pacific and Atlantic crossings I do not consider it open ocean / blue water for me without substantial modifications, and I think that is all that matters.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #30  
Old 02-15-2008
PBzeer's Avatar
Wandering Aimlessly
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Cruising
Posts: 19,777
Thanks: 0
Thanked 78 Times in 75 Posts
Rep Power: 14
PBzeer has a spectacular aura about PBzeer has a spectacular aura about PBzeer has a spectacular aura about
You can be less than 20 miles offshore in Florida and be in the Gulf Stream, and I certainly wouldn't call that "coastal" waters. Though it would be a coastal area.

You could also say it's anywhere you have to navigate by chart, rather than sight.
__________________
John
Ontario 32 - Aria

Free, is the heart, that lives not, in fear.
Full, is the spirit, that thinks not, of falling.
True, is the soul, that hesitates not, to give.
Alive, is the one, that believes, in love.
JCP


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
- Website & Blog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Production blue water boats JakeLevi Boat Review and Purchase Forum 73 07-31-2009 10:07 PM
Bluewater defined? dch Learning to Sail 44 07-29-2009 07:20 PM
WARNING..shore power ON, engine ON is a NO-NO Giulietta Gear & Maintenance 20 01-14-2008 06:12 AM
Coastal vrs. Offshore Ronbye General Discussion (sailing related) 7 09-10-2006 12:05 AM
Please Help Me Choose a Boat! JEdwards Boat Review and Purchase Forum 62 08-14-2006 02:19 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:59 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012