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  #11  
Old 05-15-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

40M of 3/8 chain will weigh 183# more if you use BBB. 50M of 5/16 will weigh 163#. You do need to check and see what size fits your chain gypsy. This will make your decision for you.
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Old 05-16-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

Well the chain Gypsy is for a 10 mm chain, if the chain gypsy is the part of the winlass that takes the chain, but it can be replaced esaly, but I figuere out that with short scope 3:1,or 5: 1 I will sleep better with that extra weight...thanks my decision is made
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Old 05-16-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

walt123,
Five to one is reletivly short scope. Seven to one being normal in normal conditions and I''m curious, what kind of conditions do you use three to one scope with a CQR.Do you sleep with that??CQR''s are known for needing higher ratio scopes so what are you talking about? The laws of physics don''t apply on your boat?? You talking all chain or what??
As far as your comments on the Bruce, thats baloney! In the years I''ve been using my Bruce, I have never had or heard or read of anyone ever having their Bruce fail due to a rock or a mudball. I''m sorry, but thats laughabul. Even if it did happen, the design of the Bruce wouldloose the obstruction and re-set.Also, I can''t believe you compared a Bruce to a Danforth. I rember one night in Hadley''s Harbor in Woods Hole, Mass in near gale gusting into gale force winds, being anchored with my twenty lb CQR to port and my twenty five lb danforth to stbd at sixty degrees apart. Well,you know how somtimes you wake up because you know somthings not right? Thats what happened.I went to the foredeck. The danforth rode was limp.The CQR was straining and dragging(in mud). I pulled the danforth to the boat! It just dragged along the bottom effertlessly.When I pulled it up there was a double fist sized rock in it!Rendered junk!If I''d have been on that anchor soley, I''d have been beached. To get the CQR to grab I had to put my bow in four feet of water,(there''s a drop-off at the shore) drop it and let out one hundred-fifty feet of rode...it held until I got things right. But even with all that said I do Like my CQR.Both of them ,a twenty and a thirty-five... it''s just that my Bruce preforms better in different conditions than a plow and there are no moving parts.

Dennis
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Old 05-17-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

In my experience, see my personal page, I have talked with sailors who have had rocks/coral lodge in their bruces and render the anchors useless in that condition. I have used bruces and they have never fouled for me and genrally have had good experiences with them. I know of a number of instances that Danforth anchors caught rocks or even balls of mud and skipped accross the bottom. I am of the school that Bruces and Danforth type anchors preform best in soft sand and semi-firm mud.I have never seen nor heard of a CQR being fouled in the same way. As to the 7 to 1 scope that number has been bandied about for years and if I have the room I use that much or more if the situtation dictates.The longer the rode the less strain on the gear. 5 to 1 and yes even 3 to 1 are often used in crowded anchorages. The key here is to check the set of the anchor and if not properly set, redo it or dive on it and set it by hand and if necessary set another anchor or 2. I have set through typhoon winds in Guam on the plow and it preformed excently and I used a plow as my primary anchor on a five year circumnavigation and while it dragged on a few occasions it was by far the quickest to grab and hardest to get out once set. I commonly use 50 feet of chain with 3 strand nylon for anchoring. If the anchorages were suspect and I couldn''t dive on the anchor I would add chain in 50'' increments until the anchor buddy in my head said enough. I hope to purchase a Delta anchor for my new boat. I have always found that while chains helps in the inital setting of an anchor and if the area is foul is the best for chafe protection, Good quality 3 strand nylon is stronger then chain and I like the strech to prevent shock loading. Anchoring is a personal experience for each of us. Good seamanship dictates that you do what is best under the circumstances..in your opinion. I do that and try and share it with others. I hope they gain from reading these posts and the questions and answers they elicit. But as with everything else the Skipper calls the shots. Fair winds and protected anchorages to you.
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Old 05-17-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

I agree with walt. Beyond that I beleive the Bruce to be a very good anchor, with one of the quickest sets out there. But I have seen photos in a sailing magazine showing something (Odd shaped rock) caught in between the center and one outer fluke. I guess it can happen. But then again I have also heard of a CQR or Delta that was fouled. After a time when the skipper continually failed to get a good set he hauled up the anchor to find a rusty paint can stuck on the tip. I agree on the danforth''s they are very good anchor once they are proper set. Probably as good as any or superior to a plow or Bruce for holding power. Problem is getting them to take a proper set, that is the big issue. I have seen too many times than I care when a danforth fails to set. I''m sure most of the time the skipper didn''t properly back down on the anchor, or not enough scope or chain. But I know people that swear by them and say that once set properly they tend to "head to China" and don''t budge once set. 5-1 scope for a CQR has worked well with me for most average anchorages on a rope/chain combination. I''d like to use more but it depends on what is around me at times in a protected anchorage. I have gotten away with 3 to 1 with no ill effects (If a heavy storm blew threw I''m sure I would be awake checking the anchor though). But I typically use a 18 lb. kellet (or sentinel)so I''m sure that has helped also
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Old 05-17-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

I''ve always found this topic of which anchor works best interesting.I''ve used quite a few different ones, but prefer the Delta over-all.Each anchor obviously has different merits, but what I find amusing about anchoring is the amount of people that don''t know how to set any anchor in the first place.To the author of this text-Please don''t take this as that I''m questioning your abilities, because I am not. Just some mere comments from the "Peanut Gallery." They pull their boat up, drop the anchor (with plenty of chain and rope on top of it, then run back to the cockpit and throw the boat in a strong reverse. Duh...what''s wrong with this picture? Recently, a power boater anchored beside me in a small anchorage. She decided she needed two anchors after it was obvious the first was dragging as the boat drifted back towards the harbor entrance. She loaded the second anchor into the dink, along with a good measure of chain and rode, motored out to about 10 feet in front of the bow, and threw the whole mess (except the bitter end....I was surprised!)overboard. She then motored back to the boat and started winching the rode to tighten up the conglomeration! I guess she knew what she was doing, because somehow the boat was still there in the morning! ha!ha!ha!At another anchorage, a sailor in a 39 ft.boat had the bow of his boat pointing in every direction possible (except into the wind)while dropping anchor, but didn''t understand why the anchor refused to bite? I''m sure everyone reading this could tell similar comical stories. Observation from the "Peanut Gallery": As the original author of this text pointed out, understanding which anchor works best for the area you''re in is important, but knowing how to anchor in the first place is even more so.
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Old 05-17-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

The skipper of a 30'' Hunter put on quite a display last weekend while repeatedly dumping his Danforth and 80'' nylon rode in a big heap before trying to back down at 5+ knots. Not surprisingly, the tackle skipped happily across the bottom for quite some distance before he gave up. Two attempts (and a lot of cursing at his wife) later, he snagged something solid and came to rest significantly downwind from where he started.

Graham

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Old 05-18-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

Sounds like the heavier chain results in better sleeping conditions. For racing, can you consider leading your chain to a locker that is NOT on the bow? It might involve leading a hawsepipe somewhere aft, or leading the chain aft along the deck to a locker further aft, but might provide better racing.
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Old 05-18-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

Well, for racing what YI probably going to do is letting the anchor on land and taking an emergency on the aft locker. About the techinques of anchoring and what rode and how is it used is what I am trying to get opinions, nad we had a lot thanks, for now i will try the Delta 16 Kg and 40 m of 10 mm chain with 60 m. of 14 mm Nylon. Iwere I will be anchoring I think that sholud work fine If I pay atention. Thanks !
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Old 05-18-2002
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Anchoring, chain diameter is a big difference?

quida123,
May I ask you...(or any one else) what conditions have you used three to one scope on a CQR in? You could anchor in a mill pond with two to one scope in light air and not drag. And may I also ask... what kind of experience do you have with the subject?
You haven''t completed a personal page, so I ask.
My experience with ground tackle comes from many years with it,not just from magazines.
When you say ''the problem is getting them to take a proper set'' is like saying the boat would float if only their were water.
As far as fouling, any anchor can foul, the question is how often?
Dennis
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