Goofy, fun additions? (plus questions on flag etiquette, ratlines) - Page 4 - SailNet Community

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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
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  #31  
Old 08-26-2008
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Pappy, is it a novelty flag? Simply because the folks who flew it died out and their living brethren no longer fly it?

I don't get how anyone could not get the association. You fly a flag--any flag--and you endorse what that flag stands for. That's where the phrase "showing the flag" somes from. That's what flags are, after all, all about.

If you're not proud of what it stands for, you don't fly a flag. Pirate flag? Like I said, ok for kiddies who think it was all about swashbuckling. Get a little older and unbribled stealing and taking from the weak to feed the "ME ME ME" isn't funny. Oh, wait, that's right...This is the ME ME ME generation that celebrates Enron and junk mortgages with all the brokers profiting as the economy tanks.

I wonder if anyone has ever profiled the kids who wanted to play Robber instead of Cop, to find out how many of them wound up being corporate profiteers? Ergh, megasuccesses, excuse me.

But the original quedstion was about etiquette and the pirate flag, and proper etiquette for a pirate is "Whatever I damned well want it to be!"

Isn't it?
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  #32  
Old 08-26-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
But the original quedstion was about etiquette and the pirate flag, and proper etiquette for a pirate is "Whatever I damned well want it to be!"

Isn't it?
Absolutely and that's it in a nut shell, it is your personal POV

My POV is some what different in that I think some, and I might even go as far as say few, take it all that seriously.

We have Sailing Clubs & Sailing Associations and Maritime Museums all putting on festivals all the time with Pirates themes; The Festival of Sails just ended here in SD, had some 20 Tall ships from all over the place here for 5 days, the theme of the Festival was ??? Pirates, a few of them will go to DP, then over to cat Island, the theme ??? priates

I quarantee ya, they and the 10's of thousands that participated in the festival are not out to glorify rape, plumder & murder, they are out to have fun and enjoy the sailing with their friends and family

So to the question of flying a pirate flag , fly it where ever you choose, to the question of etiquette, don't fly it above the Stars & Stripes when on the same staff or halyard

That's from another point of veiw of course
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Cut off from the land that bore us, betrayed by the land we find, where the brightest have gone before us and the dullest remain behind, .......but stand to your glasses, steady,.......tis all we have left to prize, raise a cup to the dead already, hurrah for the next that dies

Last edited by poopdeckpappy; 08-26-2008 at 07:16 PM.
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  #33  
Old 08-26-2008
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Originally Posted by ronspiker View Post
Of course "Real" pirates aren't going to be stupid enough to fly a pirate flag to give you warning that they are about to cause you trouble. So anyone that thinks someone flying a pirate flag actually is one is probably not to bright anyway.

Fly yer flag and enjoy.
OR ARE THEY!?!?

Maybe those drunken hillbillies really are pirates and they've lulled you into complacency by flying the Jolly Roger all over the place. Now they are just waiting for the right time to strike!
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  #34  
Old 08-26-2008
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OR ARE THEY!?!?

Maybe those drunken hillbillies really are pirates and they've lulled you into complacency by flying the Jolly Roger all over the place. Now they are just waiting for the right time to strike!

Don't worry until you hear the dueling banjos......then run like hell
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
I don't get how anyone could not get the association. You fly a flag--any flag--and you endorse what that flag stands for. That's where the phrase "showing the flag" somes from. That's what flags are, after all, all about.
Do you /really/ think that the skull and cross bones still stands for "rape, robbery, plundering, and murder"? Really? Still today? Or, maybe, does it stand for something else today than it did a few hundred years ago?
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Don't worry until you hear the dueling banjos......then run like hell
You sure do got a purdy mouth boy!


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  #37  
Old 08-27-2008
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" Or, maybe, does it stand for something else today"
Sometimes, it just means "I have goofy nine year olds on board who need to play!"

So what flag do you fly when you moon a toll booth attendant or a bridge keeper?
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re

Haha. wow. Good thing I found out that flying a jolly roger off the shrouds of my 25' Tanzer would cement me as a supporter of not only rape, murder, and theft, but also junk bonds and felonious corporate accounting! Thanks. I assumed that the fact that several US military units past and present (four squadrons of the 90th Bombardment Group of the Fifth Air Force in WWII, several USN Fighter Squadrons, including the current VFA-103, the VF-84, the VF-17, etc.) as well as the entire Royal Navy Submarine Service have adopted as their emblem would have made it apparent that the jolly roger no longer stands explicitly for rape and murder but rather for bravado tinged with lawlessness. Somebody better write all those jet pilots and perhaps the Queen of England and let them know exactly what they're getting themselves into.

I would argue that the historical connotations of the flag have been overruled by more recent usage in military and popular culture. Connotations change. The swastika was a Hindu symbol for prosperity, welfare, and luck. If you were to fly it today, people would associate it with the more recent, popularly understood use of the symbol (The Third Reich) rather than the meaning assigned to it centuries beforehand.

As to the hypothetical aspersions on my character and the assertions that I'd be seen as a 'drunk hillbilly' (by the way, you might want to double-check your epithets - hillbillies live in rural and mountainous areas and have not been spotted in boats larger than 8'), I can probably live with the occasional disapproving glance from hypersensitive yachtsmen. You'll forgive me if I don't deem it necessary to defend my reputation to you. I hope the Coast Guard and any naval vessels I encounter will hold their fire, choosing to capture rather than kill the four or five teenagers aboard the 25' bermuda rigged sloop.

Thanks for the input on black hulls/other fun accoutrement. The plank definitely seems do-able and within my limited carpentry skills. My boat is in RI so it sounds like the black hull might be ok. I might go with a dark blue or green just in case. Cannons look like fun but I might stop short of exploding munitions and stick to a mounted water balloon launcher of some sort. Thanks to whomever suggested getting another set of standing rigging - I was a little worried about messing up mine. Special credit to whoever took the painstaking time to type up 3 paragraphs in pirate speech.

Cheers. And to all of you naysayers - beware, there's a water balloon with your name on it.
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Old 08-27-2008
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Nay, I'm not the stuffed shirt type -- I have, and occasionally fly, a Jolly Roger. But out of respect for my country, I never fly it with the Stars and Stripes. Not above, not below, not abaft, not on the same vessel! I am proud of my country and it's flag, unlike certain misguided politicians and their wives. So I say, have fun, fly your Jolly Roger, walk your plank, climb your ratlines, paint your hull black! Just don't paint your deck black if you go barefoot! We need to figure out how to launch a water balloon with an authentic looking cannon!
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Old 08-27-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wkwray View Post
Haha. wow. Good thing I found out that flying a jolly roger off the shrouds of my 25' Tanzer would cement me as a supporter of not only rape, murder, and theft, but also junk bonds and felonious corporate accounting! Thanks. I assumed that the fact that several US military units past and present (four squadrons of the 90th Bombardment Group of the Fifth Air Force in WWII, several USN Fighter Squadrons, including the current VFA-103, the VF-84, the VF-17, etc.) as well as the entire Royal Navy Submarine Service have adopted as their emblem would have made it apparent that the jolly roger no longer stands explicitly for rape and murder but rather for bravado tinged with lawlessness. Somebody better write all those jet pilots and perhaps the Queen of England and let them know exactly what they're getting themselves into.

I would argue that the historical connotations of the flag have been overruled by more recent usage in military and popular culture. Connotations change. The swastika was a Hindu symbol for prosperity, welfare, and luck. If you were to fly it today, people would associate it with the more recent, popularly understood use of the symbol (The Third Reich) rather than the meaning assigned to it centuries beforehand.
good point.

Quote:
As to the hypothetical aspersions on my character and the assertions that I'd be seen as a 'drunk hillbilly' (by the way, you might want to double-check your epithets - hillbillies live in rural and mountainous areas and have not been spotted in boats larger than 8'), I can probably live with the occasional disapproving glance from hypersensitive yachtsmen. You'll forgive me if I don't deem it necessary to defend my reputation to you. I hope the Coast Guard and any naval vessels I encounter will hold their fire, choosing to capture rather than kill the four or five teenagers aboard the 25' bermuda rigged sloop.
You never met Cam... he's got a boat a bit bigger than 8' and is often described as a drunk hillbillie...

Quote:
Thanks for the input on black hulls/other fun accoutrement. The plank definitely seems do-able and within my limited carpentry skills. My boat is in RI so it sounds like the black hull might be ok. I might go with a dark blue or green just in case. Cannons look like fun but I might stop short of exploding munitions and stick to a mounted water balloon launcher of some sort. Thanks to whomever suggested getting another set of standing rigging - I was a little worried about messing up mine. Special credit to whoever took the painstaking time to type up 3 paragraphs in pirate speech.

Cheers. And to all of you naysayers - beware, there's a water balloon with your name on it.
I like the water balloon slingshots...
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