Big Freakin' Sails - Page 5 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree261Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #41  
Old 09-23-2008
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 4,192
Thanks: 50
Thanked 37 Times in 36 Posts
Rep Power: 14
knothead has a spectacular aura about knothead has a spectacular aura about knothead has a spectacular aura about
Quote:
Originally Posted by camaraderie View Post
Nice job on that one Knotty! Next time we're gonna make you type the whole thing out though!!
I knew that if I didn't post the original log pages none of you guys would have believed that I could be so inept.

Except Sailingdog of course.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #42  
Old 09-23-2008
smackdaddy's Avatar
Last Man Standing
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 12,950
Thanks: 80
Thanked 72 Times in 66 Posts
Rep Power: 8
smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough
Dude - if hooking the dog and fiascoing gear engagement are as inept as you get - you're way ahead of the majority of us.

I'm just glad to see you finally learned how to type.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #43  
Old 09-23-2008
smackdaddy's Avatar
Last Man Standing
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 12,950
Thanks: 80
Thanked 72 Times in 66 Posts
Rep Power: 8
smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough
Okay - so from the preceding stories I have a few questions:

1. Sea Anchoring: What is the principle behind sea anchors - and at what point are they really needed? Don't get too technical here - just explain what the sailor is trying to achieve for us newbies - and the pros and cons of the various means. For example, Allen talks about drogues he was using, he also talks about sea chutes, etc. Then there have also been discussions about tandem anchors, etc. on this site. What's the skinny?

2. Sailing into the slip: How about some tips on this. I've been practicing heaving to in open water - but I'm not yet confident enough to sail in. One of the issues is that with our water down, there's a bottle neck in our marina that leaves maybe 8 feet on either side of our boat coming in/out (with boats on either side). Would that bother the salts out there? Or is that nothing? Giu - you need to get us a video of this (if you haven't already). They've been great tools.

3. The decision to fall off or beat in big wind and waves: When/how is this decision made? In other words, there's the comfort variable in choosing to beat or not in the world of daysailing (when you have the luxury to choose). But I assume that goes out the hatch pretty quickly in a storm. And I understand at some point that the wind and the sea will make the decision for you. But what about the in between. What drives the decision and how do you prepare?
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #44  
Old 09-23-2008
JohnRPollard's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Chesapeake
Posts: 5,680
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 10
JohnRPollard is a jewel in the rough JohnRPollard is a jewel in the rough JohnRPollard is a jewel in the rough
Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
John - that makes perfect sense. Thanks for the feedback. So do you think sheltered water provides a good opportunity to "push" skill level a bit in order to learn to handle the boat/sails in bigger wind without the sea-state "penalty" (at least part of the sailing equation)? That's kind of been my thinking in wanting to get out in winds that I probably wouldn't want to be out in otherwise.

BTW - I fired off a quick email to Beaufort, and he's cool with the whole lake-knot thing. He just said not to get too cocky around sea sailors when bragging about it.
Smackdaddy,

Definitely. Sheltered waters are a blessing for everyone, not just beginners. They let you sail in windspeeds that would be much more difficult out on open waters. You only have to manage the heavy wind and chop, usually without the worry of destructive seastates. One caveat, though, is that sometimes heavy wind blowing over shallow water can create a very nasty, short, steep sea/chop, that can be pretty uncomfortable and tricky to deal with, particularly if sailing upwind.

That said, there are reasons why even folks who usually sail in relatively sheltered waters, don't usually set out when it's blowing 35+ knots. The primary reason is that things tend to break, and it can become pretty costly. Most coastal sailors would rather invest in equipment that makes their routine sailing more enjoyable, than spend all the money investing in storm sails, etc that will rarely if ever get used, or replacing broken parts.

Sure, you can go out in the 40 knots with your regular sails reefed down, but they are not really designed for those windspeeds and you will end up putting a couple year's worth of regular wear and tear on them in one afternoon. Or maybe you'll break the boom and now you're replacing a component that would have given you good service for years instead of buying that new spinnaker you really wanted. If your pockets are deep, none of this much matters, but most of us have a sailing budget we have to live within.

So, we try to be prepared and have a plan for how we'll deal with 40 knots if we're caught out in it -- which will happen eventually if you sail enough. But, most folks won't purposefully set out in those conditions unless they are very well equipped ($$) for them.

P.S. I'm surprised Beaufort replied at all. He's a fairly reclusive type, preferring to let his proxies defend the honor of his scale. You must have a persuasive way with words! If I have time, I will share a story about my first encounter with the Beaufort Scale.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Pacific Seacraft Crealock 31 #62

NEVER CALLS CRUISINGDAD BACK....CAN"T TAKE THE ACCENT
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #45  
Old 09-23-2008
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Trust me Steve, we have no doubts about the depths you can reach in your ineptness...
Quote:
Originally Posted by knothead View Post
I knew that if I didn't post the original log pages none of you guys would have believed that I could be so inept.

Except Sailingdog of course.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

óCpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

StillóDON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #46  
Old 09-23-2008
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 4,192
Thanks: 50
Thanked 37 Times in 36 Posts
Rep Power: 14
knothead has a spectacular aura about knothead has a spectacular aura about knothead has a spectacular aura about
Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog View Post
Trust me Steve, we have no doubts about the depths you can reach in your ineptness...

Thanks buddy. I knew I could count on you.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #47  
Old 09-23-2008
artbyjody's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Bellingham, PNW
Posts: 3,146
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 10
artbyjody is just really nice artbyjody is just really nice artbyjody is just really nice artbyjody is just really nice
Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Okay - so from the preceding stories I have a few questions:

1. Sea Anchoring: What is the principle behind sea anchors - and at what point are they really needed? Don't get too technical here - just explain what the sailor is trying to achieve for us newbies - and the pros and cons of the various means. For example, Allen talks about drogues he was using, he also talks about sea chutes, etc. Then there have also been discussions about tandem anchors, etc. on this site. What's the skinny?
Drogues and sea anchors (or the quick easy way - just drag something behind you that sinks) are used in heavy weather to slow down a boat in fast or high level waves - mainly on the downhill sled of the wave. Principle is like this - take a dock cart heavily loaded and go up the ramp at high tide (there will be an angle on the ramp if you have those floating piers - if you are manly enough and do not have floating docks then use stairs)..If you push the dock cart up- all the work you have to do is countered by the resistance of the dockcart naturally wanting to slide down. This in effect is what the boat does climbing waves - loses momentum...When you get to the top - its easy to get the cart moving faster (ie downhill) and if there is a downhill slope you now have an almost runaway cart...(gains momentum)

Dragging the sea drogue if it is the right distance away from the boat will prevent the downhill momentum allowing a more comfortable slide down the wave because it will be providing the resistance needed to slow the boat down and maintain a slower momentum (like brakes on a trailer)...

Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
2. Sailing into the slip: How about some tips on this. I've been practicing heaving to in open water
Practice with just the main or the jib out - but keep the motor running and ready to engage. Probably the safest way to do it - things get out of hand you luff the sail and use the motor to get back to a position...Easiest way to practice and have that piece of mind...

You stated "non technical" and that's how I would explain it for the most part...
__________________
-- Jody

S/V "
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
" -
1983, Barberis Show 38! or
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.







Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #48  
Old 09-23-2008
smackdaddy's Avatar
Last Man Standing
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 12,950
Thanks: 80
Thanked 72 Times in 66 Posts
Rep Power: 8
smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough
Cool - thanks Jody. Great explanations. Cogent and coherent, my good man!!

I was really lost on the drogue thing until you finally spoke some language I understand..."brakes on a trailer". Yeah - baby! So it's kind of like tying two dead pit bulls and a busted fridge to the back of my mobile home in a tornado. Got it.

Seriously - thanks. So what about the types of sea anchors - and the reasoning behind choosing one type over the other?

As for the slip sail. I'll work on it. I mean that's what my AIG boat insurance is for, right?
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #49  
Old 09-23-2008
artbyjody's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Bellingham, PNW
Posts: 3,146
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 10
artbyjody is just really nice artbyjody is just really nice artbyjody is just really nice artbyjody is just really nice
Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
that's what my AIG boat insurance is for, right?
You're just looking for a bailout

There are a few articles in the Sailnet Articles section that discuss all that and a few threads (and we know stating personal prefs is like dragging back up the Rocnar thread). I have a huge parachute drogue that I have ready for use but, if going offshore (ocean) I would purchase that fancy one that has tons of those parachutes all in tandem.

For coastal / inland sailing - the single parachute type or dragging a bucket behind is probably all that is needed. Personally - I have yet to use one myself but its good to have like all safety equipment...
__________________
-- Jody

S/V "
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
" -
1983, Barberis Show 38! or
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.








Last edited by artbyjody; 09-23-2008 at 12:53 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #50  
Old 09-23-2008
smackdaddy's Avatar
Last Man Standing
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 12,950
Thanks: 80
Thanked 72 Times in 66 Posts
Rep Power: 8
smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyJones View Post
if it's blowing at 45-50, and it's bigger than a loincloth, it's too big to control during a blow like that.. the good lord gaveth us storm sails for a reason..use them wisely!
Speaking of loincloths - are you a Deadhead? The name got me wondering. "Casey Jones you better watch yo speed". How perfect is that?
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
luffs, Battens and Leech ? painters Gear & Maintenance 17 11-15-2009 04:56 PM
Sloop or Ketch? maxheadspace Boat Review and Purchase Forum 46 07-27-2007 02:56 PM
Sails on a Boat That I'm Looking At FritzN Gear & Maintenance 9 02-22-2007 11:42 AM
The Balance of Hull and Sails Steve Colgate Buying a Boat Articles 0 05-25-2000 08:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:03 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012