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  #141  
Old 10-16-2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP777 View Post
Both of Laura's parents, who are very experienced sailors and know her better than any government body, have decided that she can indeed make this trip.
Mate, you keep saying that but it isn't so. Only her father has so decided. Her mother would prefer for her to stay home. Trouble seems to be that the father has custody.
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  #142  
Old 10-17-2009
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Hey Smack,

The reason no one want's to answer my question is .......... the answer is way too obvious.

The answer is ......... one size doesn't fit all. It comes down to the individual in question. There are probably a dozen people (maybe three or four dozen) who know this girl well enough to make an informed decision. The rest of us are just full of it, including the Dutch government.

So, Smack, I understand why you picked 18; age of consent in your state. If you lived in Deleware would you have chosen 13? Also must consider age of consent is about sex and marrage. Why not go with the legal age to drink; 21 in most states. Hey, let's go with that.

Note to USCG; Arrest all teen age sailors!

Now all our kids are safe!

DB
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  #143  
Old 10-17-2009
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They just arrested a father for child endangerment here in NC USA for leaving his 2 children alone 6 days when he went out of town. kids were fine and they know this isn't the first time he has done it. So I agree lock up all the little brats till there 21. then military school. Yes I have kids...lol
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  #144  
Old 10-17-2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
I also completely agree with your earlier statement that governments need to protect minor children when parents don't.
Like, say, raising a baby in a tent or on a boat in danger of sinking with a leaky transom ... (?)

Oh but that was different I guess, ...
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  #145  
Old 10-17-2009
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Oh now wind, nice try. But of course that was different. In that case, you guys were judging living conditions for an entire family - conditions they were actually trying to improve and which, though not the safest/best, weren't illegal in the first place. That has nothing to do with neglect and abuse of a minor as determined by law. Sorry dude, completely different kettle of monkeys.

What those guys (I edited "you guys" because I'm not sure if you were in on the battle royal) did to that woman was ridiculous no matter how you want to try to frame it.
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  #146  
Old 10-17-2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtboy View Post
Hey Smack,

The reason no one want's to answer my question is .......... the answer is way too obvious.

The answer is ......... one size doesn't fit all. It comes down to the individual in question. There are probably a dozen people (maybe three or four dozen) who know this girl well enough to make an informed decision. The rest of us are just full of it, including the Dutch government.

So, Smack, I understand why you picked 18; age of consent in your state. If you lived in Deleware would you have chosen 13? Also must consider age of consent is about sex and marrage. Why not go with the legal age to drink; 21 in most states. Hey, let's go with that.

Note to USCG; Arrest all teen age sailors!

Now all our kids are safe!

DB
No I actually picked 18 because, if I'm not mistaken, it's the draft age in the US. It's not a state thing. I figure if you're old enough to go to battle, you're old enough to solo-circ. Keeps things simple.

As for it coming down to the individual in question - it doesn't. That's why the law is there. And, in cases where, as porc mentioned, parents are burning kids with cigarettes, I doubt you'd want to use this same argument. I would imagine that you would be pretty ticked if a regulatory body didn't step in and do something...which requires the law.

I'm just saying you can't have it both ways. You have to find that age that most people agree on - make it the standard, and live with the consequences. Or you let parents beat their kids with pipes because that's how they choose to raise them.
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Last edited by smackdaddy; 10-17-2009 at 11:56 AM.
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  #147  
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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Oh now wind, nice try. But of course that was different. In that case, you guys were judging living conditions for an entire family - conditions they were actually trying to improve and which, though not the safest/best, weren't illegal in the first place. That has nothing to do with neglect and abuse of a minor as determined by law. Sorry dude, completely different kettle of monkeys.

What those guys (I edited "you guys" because I'm not sure if you were in on the battle royal) did to that woman was ridiculous no matter how you want to try to frame it.
It's only different because you are saying it is different my friend, it is all fun and games until child protective services shows up at the dock and asks you what the hell you think you are doing ...
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  #148  
Old 10-17-2009
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Very true. So in terms of the debate we're having in this thread, you've proven my point on both counts.
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  #149  
Old 10-17-2009
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Quote:
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No I actually picked 18 because, if I'm not mistaken, it's the draft age in the US. It's not a state thing. I figure if you're old enough to go to battle, you're old enough to solo-circ. Keeps things simple.

As for it coming down to the individual in question - it doesn't. That's why the law is there. And, in cases where, as porc mentioned, parents are burning kids with cigarettes, I doubt you'd want to use this same argument. I would imagine that you would be pretty ticked if a regulatory body didn't step in and do something...which requires the law.

I'm just saying you can't have it both ways. You have to find that age that most people agree on - make it the standard, and live with the consequences. Or you let parents beat their kids with pipes because that's how they choose to raise them.
I agree, I'd be pretty ticked it parents were burning their kids with cigarettes. And, I also agree that government does have a duty to protect those who can't protect themselves (at any age.)

But, there are exceptional people in this world. People who end up accomplishing much more than anyone imagined was possible. They are frequently, as may or may not be happening in this case, held back by well meaning but mis-guided individuals. Do I think most 13 year olds could do this, NO WAY. Can She? Looks like we'll never know.

Are 100% of 13 year olds not equiped to do this, or could it be 99.9999999999%? Of all the millions of girls who have been 13, are 13 or will be 13, not one could?

But laws are "one size fits all."

I just don't think any of us really knows if she could do it. Maybe if we had known her for the last 12 years we'd think differently ........... maybe not.

DB
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  #150  
Old 10-17-2009
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Are 100% of 13 year olds not equiped to do this, or could it be 99.9999999999%? Of all the millions of girls who have been 13, are 13 or will be 13, not one could?
See that's been my argument all along.

If the girl is mature enough to handle problems at sea, to fix the boat when it needs maintenance, to deal with bad weather, etc, then handling the authorities shouldn't be any problem for her at all.

Or maybe she's just a child and needs an adult to work it all out for her.
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