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  #11  
Old 01-06-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krozet View Post
15 years ago there would have been a simple solution to this issue, shoot first and ask questions later. I really don't understand the problem here! I know that there are economical issues and problems with international fishing in Somli waters but the BS that people were doing this to feed their family's is over. It is now a business for some of these people.

When every major power was faced with piracy throughout history they met force with force, today everyone wants to talk about it... As crude as it is a few head shots or smart bomb to a mud hut and the situation would start to resolve itself.

The 'Rules' don't apply when you are dealing with lawless people. Can you imagine the state of Pakistan if they had to continually stop to talk too the taliban or other extremest groups? Yes I know the two situations are not the same but the principal remains, some people only respond to force.

I do not normally advocate violence but there is no way to change the situation off the North East Coast of Africa... It has gone past the tipping point when goons are pulling in that much money with such little investment. If nothing is done soon this will give carte blanche to other lawless coastal area's of the world where they are looking for an easy way to make money.

Can you imagine if this was happening off the coast of Cuba?!?!

(not saying Cuba is lawless, just imagine what America would do if a couple ships were hijacked off the coast of Cuba)
I understand your sentiment on the pirate issue. But I think you are overlooking the next logical necessary process that comes first in the global free market capitalist system within which we operate.

First, when a serious pile of money shows up on the world stage, the bankers take notice and begin talking to the insurance execs, and they figure an angle to get a big chunk of the money pile. Any day now, Goldman Sacks or Morgan Stanley (god willing they beat their European competitors at UBS or RBS ) will announce a new hedge fund, monetizing the ransom money the Somalis are compliling. Big spec money is going to love the revenue growth rate and it should be easy to raise a couple of billion bucks to open the fund. By one estimate, Somali pirates have pulled in over $100 million so far in just a few years. Can't you see it? Every ship taken will send the stock up another 15%. We're talking a 20 fold opportunity for profit, both up and back down. You don't want the military mucking about ruining the game until it's about over, n'est pas?

In fact, time is of the essence as the 'pirate treasury' is getting tapped already by the realtors in Nairobi.

Thank Pirates For Kenya's Booming Real Estate Market

Despite the film rights and other ancillary profit potentials, the market can fleece western investors of several billion at least in trading the Pirate fund on world stock exchanges. Eventually, the Somalis will become a liability and that is when the financial 'leaders' will greenlight their destruction. Patience, it won't take more than a few more years.

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  #12  
Old 01-07-2010
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If you think killing is okay under certain exceptional circumstances, then you should expect pirates to think so too. I personally do not think killing a person is ever okay, an opinion which is further cemented by the chance that maybe someone else out there shares this idea, and won't kill me because of it.
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  #13  
Old 01-07-2010
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Tager, I for one was talking arrest and due process. I would prefer my government not assasinating anybody on my behalf.
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  #14  
Old 01-07-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tager View Post
If you think killing is okay under certain exceptional circumstances, then you should expect pirates to think so too. I personally do not think killing a person is ever okay, an opinion which is further cemented by the chance that maybe someone else out there shares this idea, and won't kill me because of it.
I can't promise that I'll never think of any situations in which killing a person can be justified, and I reserve the right to disagree with pirates on what these situations are.

Just because one person decides that an action is morally acceptable in one situation, it doesn't automatically throw open the doors to anybody who wants the "right" to perform that action in any situation. That logic is much more dangerous than the "it's okay to kill people sometimes" logic.

Besides, while yes there is likely the chance that other people share your view, it's also likely that those people also share your view that piracy is bad. So I wouldn't expect protection from your "killing is never good" principle in pirate encounters
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  #15  
Old 01-17-2010
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A win win situation would be granting safe passage for the Somali pirates to the southern ocean and letting them have the Japanese whaling fleet as booty. Maybe even give them a bit of nav gear so they find the whalers easier. Everybody gets what they want!
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Old 01-21-2010
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The Somali Pirate threat has been an issue for years. It was never a huge issue in the states because prior to April of last year because it never affected any Americans. There are a few key issues with the piracy threat. First, the world failed to stop the problem when it first occurred. It became a profitable means of existence when there were no other means. Second, the coastline of Somalia is too vast to cover. It costs 1 to 3 million dollars to divert a tanker around Africa; it is economically cheaper to take their chances in paying a ransom. When proceeding east bound from the BAM, all ships are advised to transit the Internationally Recommended Transit Corridor. This is a sector patrolled by NATO Warships (Russian and Iranian warships also patrol the sector). Every hour these warships transmit messages over VHF channel 16. Any merchants that see any suspicious traffic are advised to contact the nearest warship. The goal of NATO’s Combined Task Force is to not completely stop piracy but to protect all ships transiting the corridor. This is an attainable goal; stopping piracy completely is not. The only way to stop piracy is for there to be political stability in Somalia; the resources to do this do not exist. Somalia is still in a civil war; it has been for over two decades. The Transitional Federal Government (TFG) (controls northern Somalia) is currently battling Al’Shabaab (the extremist Islamic sect that controls Southern Somalia). There is no government to look out for its people. In late 2008 the UN abolished Somalia’s rights to territorial boundaries. In other words Somalia is not a sovereign country; Somalia is a broken country. It has no territorial waters. The Pirates are theoretically not bound to international law; they are not armed combatants. They are not bound by the Geneva Convention. With that said, they are still granted certain rights. The rules still apply to lawless people. As long as the President and Congress are voted into office and every political action they make is scrutinized by all 24 hour media outlets they will still grant rights to all humans. NATO ships are advised to arrest any suspected pirates. The US had an agreement with Kenya to transport and try suspected pirates in Kenya, however Kenya does not have the infrastructure to continue to jail and care for the suspected pirates. If you really want the US to make a stand to completely stop Piracy then you need to start petitioning your Senator and Congressional Representative.
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Old 01-22-2010
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No need to kill them. Just take the crew off of any boat putting out from Somalia and sink it. Return the crew to shore to spread the word. Should take only a few weeks for them all to get the message.

Yes, some innocent fishermen would lose their boat. Sorry. That is what happens when your country goes outlaw.
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  #18  
Old 01-23-2010
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Can the pirates' boats just put in on any beach? Looking at the Somalian coastline, it looks like there are only a few harbors.

There is a way to stop the piracy, there just isn't a reason to. Nobody who has the money or power to stop the piracy has good reason to. They won't do it if they don't have a good reason. It would take a huge amount of resources. Stopping the piracy would be analogous to fumigating a three story building in order to rid the kitchen of fruit flies.

It's a sad situation that the world sucks.

I guess the best that we can do, as sailors, is to hope we don't get pirated!
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  #19  
Old 01-28-2010
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What is the situation with boats maintaining arms for self defense in these waters? What happens when they land or enter at a port with arms? Do any of you maintain weapons on board?
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  #20  
Old 02-26-2010
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I'm simply stating, it's difficult to understand what people with no hope do.
I've never had to live with no hope for a long time.
If they have guns it seems that they shoot a lot. If they have rocks they throw them. If they have vodka they drink it.
I don't know what I would do if I had no hope.
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