Gulf of Mexico oil spill - Page 9 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #81  
Old 05-03-2010
new and proud of it
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Saint Petersburg
Posts: 829
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
w1651 is on a distinguished road
Send a message via Yahoo to w1651
I live here in Saint Petersburg Florida and the beaches and their residents are in a huge predicament. Jobs are few and far between. Our unemployment rate hovers around 12 to 13 percent. Now our tourism and fishing industry may be under attack because of this. Meanwhile our absenty governor Charlie Christ is not saying a word about it. Professional Politician that he is!
Good news is Our State prosecutor Bill McCullim is in Alabama meeting with the other states about the situation. BP better get their act in gear because our state as well as others in the gulf are meeting to Sue BP for the oil spill. And It is already going to cost them Billions

On anther note !
If you do the research, what the companies and the government (Our President specifically) Say is true. Alternate fuels will never surpass the economical impact of fossil fuels across the country and it's grid. At best you may get around twenty percent supplementation.

What was said earlier was absolutely correct.
If we (meaning you and me) started to refit our own properties however close to 80 percent is doable.
What the companies and government won't tell you is on a small scale it could be done at a very large expense to home owners though. Solar panels, battery rooms, wind generators, and hydrogen are all possible on a smaller scale. So what is said on up high in the hierarchy is true but the fact that the powers to be leave this little piece of knowledge out is a bit worrisome to me.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #82  
Old 05-03-2010
Iroquois MkII
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 241
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 8
LookingForCruiser is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROSA View Post
We are now in a position, today, to reduce drastically our need for oil, and eliminate off shore all together.

The estimate to outfit my home here in LA with enough Solar to eliminate my electric bill in total is $80,000. This includes AC and Heat. 70 to 80 % would be rebated by the Feds and the State.
That's absolutely abysmal.

a) I'm paying for your solar power (along with other taxpayers). How would this scale? Honestly I'd prefer you to buy your solar panels with your own money, rather than tax me

b) What's the lifespan on these panels? 5-10 years I'd guess, but maybe I'm wrong. In any case, if you're paying $3000 per year in energy bills normally, that's an $80000 investment to eliminate a $30000 energy bill, assuming it all last 10 years without failing. If you get an 80% rebate that's $16000, so you'd break even around 5 years, which is the pessimistic lifespan of the equipment

So with a massive tax subsidy you could either break even, or save up to half your power costs, depending on how long your equipment lasts. Without the tax subsidy, it's a disaster.

Maybe your energy costs are way way higher at your house, which would make that equation more attractive.

We can reduce the need for oil - go nuclear! That doesn't require gigantic tax subsidies.

None of this has anything to do with cleaning up the oil spill in the gulf. We're all just screwed now. Best we can probably do now is retro-fit safeguards onto existing rigs.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #83  
Old 05-03-2010
ROSA's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Slidell, LA
Posts: 104
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
ROSA is on a distinguished road
W1651, I am a little confused here and you may know something I don't, probably plenty, LOL.

I do know that I can for 20 to 25k save 300 to 400 dollars on my electric bill a month, as I would have no bill. Won't take long to recoup the initial investment for me, maybe five years or so.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #84  
Old 05-03-2010
ROSA's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Slidell, LA
Posts: 104
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
ROSA is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by LookingForCruiser View Post
That's absolutely abysmal.

a) I'm paying for your solar power (along with other taxpayers). How would this scale? Honestly I'd prefer you to buy your solar panels with your own money, rather than tax me

b) What's the lifespan on these panels? 5-10 years I'd guess, but maybe I'm wrong. In any case, if you're paying $3000 per year in energy bills normally, that's an $80000 investment to eliminate a $30000 energy bill, assuming it all last 10 years without failing. If you get an 80% rebate that's $16000, so you'd break even around 5 years, which is the pessimistic lifespan of the equipment

So with a massive tax subsidy you could either break even, or save up to half your power costs, depending on how long your equipment lasts. Without the tax subsidy, it's a disaster.

Maybe your energy costs are way way higher at your house, which would make that equation more attractive.

We can reduce the need for oil - go nuclear! That doesn't require gigantic tax subsidies.

None of this has anything to do with cleaning up the oil spill in the gulf. We're all just screwed now. Best we can probably do now is retro-fit safeguards onto existing rigs.
Not this spill, but future ones.

Wake up and smell the facts:

Panel last 20 or so years.

The gov rule is in place now, I did not write or pass it. I am playing by the rules.

It is available for everyone now and has been for some time.

We have already recovered 70% of that which we installed on the boat. Sorry.

I guess the bottom line here is that in your opinion we have only two choices;

Live on the Gulf Of Texaco or

Glow in the dark.

My taxes are paying too you know.

Changes are coming!

Last edited by ROSA; 05-03-2010 at 02:15 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #85  
Old 05-03-2010
tommays's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,219
Thanks: 1
Thanked 24 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 6
tommays will become famous soon enough
Well

Solar would work on MY roof becasue a PO clear cut the trees NOT sure thats a good trade

It would NOT work in most ANY other house in my area DUE to trees

IMHP when you have to get a credit that big(70%) to make it worth while its a BUST
__________________
1970 Cal 29 Sea Fever

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

1981 J24 Tangent 2930
Tommays
Northport NY


If a dirty bottom slows you down what do you think it does to your boat
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #86  
Old 05-03-2010
new and proud of it
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Saint Petersburg
Posts: 829
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
w1651 is on a distinguished road
Send a message via Yahoo to w1651
I checked this out years ago

Back in 2000 I wanted to get a house that was totally self sufficient. I bought 5 acres and started to build my dream. I got a double wide. I know what your thinking but after the big one hit in Miami they are actually built very well now.Plus I was able to opt for 6 inch studs and extra insulation. (that's actually where you need to start)
I went and got the filing kit from the Solar energy center at the University of central Florida . The problem I had was in Florida storms during the summer are prevalent and I wanted to get a wind generator also. If I did Then I could not get the subsidy from the government not to mention there was a waiting list at the time.
What you are forgetting is
1. Solar is not the only alternative
2. All bulbs and appliances have to be 12 or 24 volts
3. You can get a video how to make your own panels saving lots of expense
4. The same for hydrogen and wind generators.
5. This is the best of all, you can sell the extra you make to the electric company helping to pay off the initial costs.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #87  
Old 05-03-2010
new and proud of it
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Saint Petersburg
Posts: 829
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
w1651 is on a distinguished road
Send a message via Yahoo to w1651
Smile There are ways to cut costs

Quote:
Originally Posted by ROSA View Post
W1651, I am a little confused here and you may know something I don't, probably plenty, LOL.

I do know that I can for 20 to 25k save 300 to 400 dollars on my electric bill a month, as I would have no bill. Won't take long to recoup the initial investment for me, maybe five years or so.
1. If I were you the first thing I would do is insulate my home very very well.
2. You can get a video on building your own solar panels as well as wind generators substantially less than buying them.
4. You can sell back any extra electricity to the company that uses your grid for even more cost reductions.
3. Remember that Wind is a very viable alternative to solar in some areas. Or to take over during the night or during a storm.
5. Also hydrogen has basically been cracked wide open thanks to the university of Indiana. You can make hydrogen during working hours to run a generator, stove, or other appliances off of as long as you can store it. That's the hard part. You need a tank specially designed for it as well as pump and it will need internal regulators as the pressures are upwards of 12000 psi to store it as a liquid. I believe it's 12000 plus but I am still researching that.
The tank can be found but I haven't figured out the 12 or 24 volt pump to get it in the tank. By the way it all works off of solar or wind energy.
I would make my own panels first to cut my costs of start up.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #88  
Old 05-03-2010
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 451
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 7
RXBOT is on a distinguished road
It's not just energy

Except for the wood and metal probably everything on your boat comes from oil. Hull,deck,sails,lines lifejackets,harnesses and the soles on your shoes and fancy windbreaker plus the bottle that water comes in that is more costly than the diesel in your fuel tank. Where are all the rigs,helicopters, supply boats and high paid workers and refinerys that make that expensive water , I can never seem to find them.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #89  
Old 05-03-2010
tommays's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,219
Thanks: 1
Thanked 24 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 6
tommays will become famous soon enough
Solar System 5376 Watt Capacity
(24 Solar Panel Array approx. 450 sq. feet)
Total Retail Price $34,000
LIPA rebate at $3.50 per watt $18,816*
Initial Investment after rebate $15,184
NY State Tax Credit
(25% of net cost max. $5,000) $3,796**
Federal Tax Credit
(30% of net) $4,555
Total Investment $6,833
Est. Electrical Production / yr $1,445***
Est. Increased Value of Property $28,891
Simple “TAX FREE”
Return On Investment 21%

This return is enhanced if interest on funds borrowed is tax deductible, and results in owning the system for an after tax cost less than $50.00 per month. By reducing the utility costs for your home, the value of your property will increase when you sell your home.

* The LIPA Solar Rebate is dropping to $2.75/watt as of January 1, 2010. CALL US NOW to lock in the present $3.50/watt rebate!

**NY State Tax Credit can be carried over multiple years if needed.

***Estimated savings based on LIPA Clean Power Estimator.


A system with battery's is MUCH MORE money and the state is BROKE so good luck on the tax

And its biggest issue is FORCING the electric company to buy you excess even when they DON'T NEED IT making me help you again
__________________
1970 Cal 29 Sea Fever

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

1981 J24 Tangent 2930
Tommays
Northport NY


If a dirty bottom slows you down what do you think it does to your boat
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #90  
Old 05-04-2010
new and proud of it
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Saint Petersburg
Posts: 829
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
w1651 is on a distinguished road
Send a message via Yahoo to w1651
Talking RXBOT is right

We do need fossil fuels to make all kinds of products but we could help with a little bit of smarts in that area as well. Plastics are here to stay but things like clothing could be made of cotton or hemp instead of polyester fibers.(I know what you all are thinking)
Why do milk jugs need to be plastic? Why not cartons like a quart or half gallon?
Bring your own cloth bags to the grocery store. Do people really understand how many of those things are in landfills? Don't even get me started on diapers now.
That's just a few of the things we can do.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Oil Change experience - Lessons Learned kmeeks Gear & Maintenance 33 04-16-2010 08:55 AM
Teen drowns in Gulf of Mexico near Bradenton - Bradenton Herald NewsReader News Feeds 0 10-03-2006 01:19 PM
Changing Engine Oil Tom Wood Gear and Maintenance Articles 0 10-02-2002 08:00 PM
An Island in the Stream John Kretschmer Seamanship Articles 0 02-22-2001 07:00 PM
An Island in the Stream John Kretschmer Cruising Articles 0 02-22-2001 07:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:08 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012