Sketchy features on offshore cruisers - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 08-16-2010
bjung's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Blue Ridge
Posts: 472
Thanks: 5
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
bjung is on a distinguished road
Sketchy features on offshore cruisers

I would like your input on some features for offshore cruisers as far as safety is concerned:
1) Portlights in hull
2) Large windows of decksalon/ pilothouse models
3) Centerboard/ swing keel
4) Spade rudder
These are all items, I would like to stay away from in an offshore cruiser for safetyreasons.
Has build and material quality overcome the stigma attached to the above points, or are these still worrysome features?

Thanks for the input.
Bernd
PSC 31
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 08-16-2010
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
It depends... there are many bluewater boats that have some or all of the features that you describe and yet they have made passages without issue. Ovnis for example are french built aluminum boats with a centerboard, but are quite well respected for being a very capable bluewater boat.

Properly designed, built and maintained, none of those features should be deal breakers IMHO.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

óCpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

StillóDON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 08-16-2010
JomsViking's Avatar
Splashed
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 554
Thanks: 28
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 8
JomsViking is on a distinguished road
I concur with SD..

Quote:
Originally Posted by bjung View Post
I would like your input on some features for offshore cruisers as far as safety is concerned:
1) Portlights in hull
2) Large windows of decksalon/ pilothouse models
With the right materials/build these can be as strong as the hull. Big pilothouse's may be detrimental to windward ability, though.

Quote:
3) Centerboard/ swing keel
Depends on stability - refer to the GZ and stability curves for the actual vessel. Like SD said, the Alubat boats (OVNI) and Southerlies (amongst others) are succesfull bluewater boats in that category.
Quote:
4) Spade rudder
Plenty of boats with spade rudders have made successful blue water cruises.
Quote:
These are all items, I would like to stay away from in an offshore cruiser for safetyreasons.
Has build and material quality overcome the stigma attached to the above points, or are these still worrysome features?
The answer is YES, correctly designed and constructed, there's no need to worry about these features.
__________________
Watch great footage about the story of one manís slow odyssey around the UK:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 08-16-2010
cormeum's Avatar
48' wood S&S yawl
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 421
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
cormeum is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjung View Post
I would like your input on some features for offshore cruisers as far as safety is concerned:
1) Portlights in hull
2) Large windows of decksalon/ pilothouse models
3) Centerboard/ swing keel
4) Spade rudder
These are all items, I would like to stay away from in an offshore cruiser for safetyreasons.
Has build and material quality overcome the stigma attached to the above points, or are these still worrysome features?

Thanks for the input.
Bernd
PSC 31



It all depends on where you go and when you go there.
Our boat has "none of the above".

Isn't there a "stuck swing keel" thread floating around here?
__________________
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." - Robert A.Heinlein
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 08-16-2010
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,370
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 9
puddinlegs is on a distinguished road
Sounds like you've already decided on what you think is inappropriate for an offshore capable yacht and are looking for others to support your thoughts. Everything you've asked about can be accurately answered with, "it depends".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 08-16-2010
美国华人, 帆船 教授及输送
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: MD
Posts: 2,484
Thanks: 23
Thanked 22 Times in 14 Posts
Rep Power: 9
rockDAWG is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by cormeum View Post

It all depends on where you go and when you go there.
Our boat has "none of the above".

Isn't there a "stuck swing keel" thread floating around here?
I think what OP meant is: Can the "boat" follow your "none of the above" boat with ease and comfort. Let's say your boat rated 9 out 10 in ease and comfort. Will the "other" boat be at -5 , 1, 5, or 7 assuming the boat is made a bit better than a Hunter.

Note: No disrespect to Hunter owners. You are still way ahead of me since I am boatless.
__________________

Fine Print:
I am old school. Integrity is to do the right thing even when no one is watching.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 08-16-2010
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,370
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 9
puddinlegs is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockDAWG View Post
I think what OP meant is: Can the "boat" follow your "none of the above" boat with ease and comfort. Let's say your boat rated 9 out 10 in ease and comfort. Will the "other" boat be at -5 , 1, 5, or 7 assuming the boat is made a bit better than a Hunter.

Note: No disrespect to Hunter owners. You are still way ahead of me since I am boatless.
The OP wrote:

"These are all items, I would like to stay away from in an offshore cruiser for safetyreasons. Has build and material quality overcome the stigma attached to the above points, or are these still worrysome features?"

...and for the sake of clarity, what makes a boat 9 out of 10 for ease and comfort? I'm guessing it will be a long and subjective list . Will it have anything to do with the OP's question?

Last edited by puddinlegs; 08-16-2010 at 01:04 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 08-16-2010
bjung's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Blue Ridge
Posts: 472
Thanks: 5
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
bjung is on a distinguished road
puddin,
No, I have not made up my mind on these items, if I had, I certainly wouldn't waste your time or mine.
I am interrested in your input, because all these features have advantages that I like in one way or another, but come attached with safety issues(at least for me). As I am looking at bluewater boats that I like, some of these items are part of the boat.
I guess when it comes down to it, I am looking for people to contadict my personal inclination, and give me a good reason to do so.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #9  
Old 08-16-2010
cormeum's Avatar
48' wood S&S yawl
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 421
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
cormeum is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockDAWG View Post
I think what OP meant is: Can the "boat" follow your "none of the above" boat with ease and comfort. Let's say your boat rated 9 out 10 in ease and comfort. Will the "other" boat be at -5 , 1, 5, or 7 assuming the boat is made a bit better than a Hunter.

Note: No disrespect to Hunter owners. You are still way ahead of me since I am boatless.
Were I to rate them by how much they'd creep me out in a bad storm, I'd put large windows as the worst feature by far.

In hull portlights have to my understanding held up well, but they are another area that can fail catastrophically should they go

I don't think that swing keels have been proven in a cruising environment and should they fail it'd be a big problem. Centerboards are well understood and although they require additional beam for form stability, a centerboard fan shouldn't be put off by them for passagemaking.

I personally am not a fan of spade rudders but a lot of boats use them without incident. They have advantages in manoeverability despite their vulnerability.

Note, none of these relate to "ease and comfort" but rather to survivability.
__________________
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." - Robert A.Heinlein
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #10  
Old 08-16-2010
JomsViking's Avatar
Splashed
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 554
Thanks: 28
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 8
JomsViking is on a distinguished road
bjung,

It is all myth. You can safely take swingkeel, spade rudder boats bluewater cruising. You have to do proper planning for all types of vessels no matter if they're of the old long-keel type or not, but don't believe in the myth about old long-keelers being the safest offshore boats.
Old wooden boats had long keels because of material, tools, and possibilities, not because that was necessarily the best.
Affordability is another thing, sometimes you can find a great "old" boat that is safe for offshore, but might not be able to afford a newer (well constructed) boat capable of the same thing. Then it's easy - choose the one that takes you sailing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
whats more helpful to cruisers? meteorology or astrology TheWhiteRabbit General Discussion (sailing related) 16 08-03-2010 08:29 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:05 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.