Do you carry firearms while cruising? - Page 22 - SailNet Community
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post #211 of 335 Old 10-22-2010
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Originally Posted by poopdeckpappy View Post
We read this differently, I read it as they were anchored or moored in a cruising area, the banditos came from a no go zone
Yes, knowing that if they could get back to that (relatively nearby, I presume) no-go zone before the authorities arrived, they'd be home free.

Failing to see the disincentive for the bad guys. Thus my assessment that the entire area is unfavourable.

Jim
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post #212 of 335 Old 10-22-2010
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In the article that Pappy posted, those cruisers now take steps to give themselves time to signal for help from others. What are the ethics involved in summoning supposedly unarmed folks nearby to help out with armed bad guys?

Ray
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post #213 of 335 Old 10-22-2010
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Originally Posted by erps View Post
What are the ethics involved in summoning supposedly unarmed folks nearby to help out with armed bad guys?
Maybe the other, nearby cruisers have enough sense to be armed?

(Just keepin' it goin', folks, just keepin' it goin' )

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post #214 of 335 Old 10-22-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erps View Post
In the article that Pappy posted, those cruisers now take steps to give themselves time to signal for help from others. What are the ethics involved in summoning supposedly unarmed folks nearby to help out with armed bad guys?
Ray

You sail in Canada quite often; you may want to know.

Actually it is not a moral imperative it is a legal one:

Quote:
the United Nations Convention on Law of the Sea ("UNCLOS") says that every signatory to the convention must require the master of a ship flying its flag to render assistance to any person found at sea in danger of being lost and to proceed to the rescue of persons in distress.

Simultaneously, the Safety of Life at Sea Convention ("SOLAS") sets out the obligation on ships' masters to render assistance.
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"Every qualified person who is the master of a vessel in any waters, on receiving a signal from any source that a person, a vessel or an aircraft is in distress, shall proceed with all speed to render assistance and shall, if possible, inform the persons in distress or the sender of the signal.

"The master of a vessel in Canadian waters and every qualified person who is the master of a vessel in any waters shall render assistance to every person who is found at sea and in danger of being lost."
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Formerly $500, the maximum fine is now $1,000,000.
The Obligation to Render Assistance at Sea

Others may wish to check their nation's equivalents.

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post #215 of 335 Old 10-22-2010
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I am a Canadian, I don't have guns on board, but I promise, if I see you sailing where I sail in Canada, and I see you being attached by Somali pirates, I will come to help you.

And if I get there and it wasn't really an attack, we can have a beer or something, eh!



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post #216 of 335 Old 10-22-2010
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render assistance to any person found at sea in danger of being lost and to proceed to the rescue of persons in distress.
unless the skipper determines that it is unreasonable to respond

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or considers in unreasonable or unnecessary to respond, he shall enter the reason in his official log book;
So we're back to whether it's ethical (reasonable) to summon supposedly unarmed help to an armed confrontation.

Ray
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post #217 of 335 Old 10-22-2010
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Quote:
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unless the skipper determines that it is unreasonable to proceed
My understanding is "unless it endangers the crew or the vessel." I will try to hunt that down. (t is in our manuals, but I would like the legal reference.

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post #218 of 335 Old 10-23-2010
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Hey guys,

I firstly want to apologise to ERPS - I was very abrupt and rude earlier on. Sorry mate.

Secondly, the current talk about assisting others' needing help is interesting. A different topic, but the Sydney-Hobart race 98 (I think) - a couple of boats kept plugging on instead of stopping to help and people died. The skippers were asked to explain!


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post #219 of 335 Old 10-23-2010
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Well the Canadians have a lot of empty beer cans they can toss at those Dastardly pirates. And if the those empty beer cans are filled with the aftermath of drinking beer, those pirates will woe the day.

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post #220 of 335 Old 10-23-2010
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My understanding is "unless it endangers the crew or the vessel." I will try to hunt that down.
that sounds reasonable. It may not be in statute, but a result of case law.

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A different topic, but the Sydney-Hobart race 98 (I think) - a couple of boats kept plugging on instead of stopping to help and people died. The skippers were asked to explain!
I imagine it's settled on a case by case basis on whether non responding skippers failed in their obligations to others in need of help.

Ray
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