Sailng & The Older Person - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 01-13-2011
BudgieSmugglers's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 31
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
BudgieSmugglers is on a distinguished road
Sailng & The Older Person

Being in my 60s & luckily still very fit, healthy & active, i am faced with fitting out my small yacht that i`ve just bought as a liveaboard boat. my circumstances have changed from fairly wealthy, to now, fairly broke (read VERY broke) and it will be taking me a while to fitout. i do have thoughts of my future & old age and living aboard a boat and thought that i have the perfect opportunity to fitout this boat for my future, as i`ve gotta do it anyway.I`m very new to sailing (read... I hav`nt been out once yet!!!) i would love some thoughts on my intentions..... i`m thinking of a small mainsail so that i can lift the boom up fairly high (i`m tall) so that i can enclose the cockpit area in a semi permenent way for a more comfortable outdoor area. i`m also thinking of a `very large` self furling foresail and an outboard motor a little larger than `normal` for a small yacht (24 ft)...possibly a 15hp......most of my sailing will be with the wind or beam on. However fit you are... as you age, "cant be bothered" does creep into your life, even though there are some very elderly sailors out there that work their magic, mentally they would be working a lot harder than most people would think to get past that "cant be bothered". now i personally have been a very high achiever throughout my life and NOTHING was too much trouble, but those "cant be bothered" words, sadly have crept into my own life of late. anyone have ideas on fitouts for the older person? thanks..Rob
__________________
stuck in broken bay building up funds to fix my just bought adams 24. intend sailing eastcoast australia, if i can ever pluck up the courage to go outside the heads!!

Last edited by BudgieSmugglers; 01-13-2011 at 11:33 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 01-13-2011
Large Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,000
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 8
mdbee is on a distinguished road
Not sure about your particular boat but I would guess an a 8hp 4strk (maybe a HT model) would be quite adequate, a 9.9hp overkill and a 15hp over the top.
Of course if you find a 15hp cheap.... it would be pretty heavy though.

How high do you want to raise the boom? It will change your boat's geometry.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 01-14-2011
BudgieSmugglers's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 31
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
BudgieSmugglers is on a distinguished road
hi mdbee, at the moment i have 2 damaged mainsails (one that brings the boom down to just above sitting height in the cockpit (quite large) & one that will reach the top of the mast meaning that i can raise the boom to suit (gives me nearly standing headroom in cockpit) i was thinking that one. i have a 8hp mariner sailpower 2 stroke at the moment, it fits in a well in the cockpit..... this is a 1998 model and i will replace this motor if it becomes at all unreliable....at first i thought this well was a great idea, but the noise & smoke is incredible ( a 4 stroke as you recommend, would make a world of difference)..i think the prop is wrong at the moment (10 * 8 inch pitch) as the boat will only do 3 knots motoring. `suppose this is why i was leaning to a 15hp but the prop may be the problem.... i`m getting a 10 * 5 inch 4 blade high thrust prop in two weeks. my mast is 25 ft high and my forestay length is 26 ft .... i`m guessing the boat weighs 1500 kilos but with all my gear maybe 2300 kilos. the distance from the base of the forestay to the mast base is 9 ft. my boom length is 10 ft and if i fit the smaller mainsail to give me near standing headroom, it reaches 7 ft 6 inches along the boom. the boom is then 3 ft up from the bottom of the mast.
__________________
stuck in broken bay building up funds to fix my just bought adams 24. intend sailing eastcoast australia, if i can ever pluck up the courage to go outside the heads!!

Last edited by BudgieSmugglers; 01-14-2011 at 02:10 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 01-14-2011
Jeff_H's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Annapolis, Md
Posts: 6,664
Thanks: 5
Thanked 103 Times in 79 Posts
Rep Power: 10
Jeff_H has a spectacular aura about Jeff_H has a spectacular aura about Jeff_H has a spectacular aura about
Seeing that you are a new sailor you probably do not understand the dynamics of yacht design, but reducing the size of the mainsail, and increasing the size of the jib will do two things, it will result in a boat with "Lee-helm" and will make the boat much harder to manhandle.

The first item, lee helm, is very dangerous. In a gust you want the boat to change course towards the wind so that the sails will empty a little and the boat heel less. That tendancy to turn towards the wind (head up) is called a 'weather-helm' and it is a real life saver in a small boat in gusty conditions.

Lee helm is the tendancy for the boat to head away from the wind, (fall off)and that means in a gust the boat wants to turn more perpendicular to the wind, and so can lead to some serious and potentially dangerous knock downs. The desireability of weather-helm (and the dangers of lee-helm) is especially acute for new sailors whose natural reactions to a gust have not developed yet.

I understand your goal of enclosing the cockpit thereby adding more living space, and your goal of adding more headroom under the boom while sailing, but trying to sail with a full cockpit enclosure on a small small boat generally does not work in terms of sail handling, but more significantly, in terms of dangerously altering the sailing characteristics of the boat. And unless the boat was designed with headroom under the boom, there is almost no way to raise the boom sufficiently to gain full headroom without screwing up the sailing ability of your boat.

As a fellow 60 year old, I can assure you that mainsails are much easier to handle than jibs and so in terms of adding a smaller mainsail and a huge jib, you are really making your boat much harder to to sail and so less suitable for an older sailer. Most cruisers can actually get by with a smaller headsail which makes the sailing much easier with a proper sized mainsail and proper sail handling gear.

In terms of the outboard, an 8 horsepower outboard is a very big engine for a 24 footer. A 4 hp two-stroke is normally enough to push a boat this size at hull speed in most condituons. If you are not able to achieve hull speed (roughly 4 1/2 knots) then you probably have a fouled bottom on your boat or else the wrong prop and gearing on the outboard.

But at the heart of it, I would strongly suggest that you learn to sail well before deciding whether to and how to modify your boat. In doing so you will learn how your boat behaves in a variety of winds. You will understand the trade-offs involved in making changes to a boat. Trying to abitrarily make changes without even understanding the basics is somewhat akin to saying, I am going to design and build an airplane before I learn to fly, if you see what I mean.

Respectfully,
Jeff
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Curmudgeon at Large- and rhinestone in the rough, sailing my Farr 11.6 on the Chesapeake Bay

Last edited by Jeff_H; 01-14-2011 at 09:23 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 01-14-2011
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Concord NH
Posts: 202
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 7
omaho5 is on a distinguished road
15 HP is alot of power for a 24'. I have an 8HP four stroke Merc on my
22 Cape Dory. I can get away with a 4 HP Yamaha, though.
Also, sail REGULARLY at 65... Three times a weel in season.. New Hampshire.
Have someone your age , or so, help you with the learnng process.
There will be lots of people that will gladly show you the ropes.
What make boat ????
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 01-14-2011
Faster's Avatar
Just another Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: New Westminster, BC
Posts: 15,304
Thanks: 88
Thanked 241 Times in 232 Posts
Rep Power: 10
Faster has a spectacular aura about Faster has a spectacular aura about Faster has a spectacular aura about
I'd add my vote to waiting for a season or two with the boat before deciding what, if any, major modifications you'll need/want to make.

I think your perceptions will shift dramatically even after one season. As you simply learn to sail your appreciation of what works and what doesn't, what ultimately makes sense and what doesn't will become more relevant, and you'll avoid doing things you may well 'undo' later. And perhaps more sadly, if you rush into these mods you may well never know how much better things could have been.
__________________
Ron

1984 Fast/Nicholson 345 "FastForward"

".. there is much you could do at sea with common sense.. and very little you could do without it.."
Capt G E Ericson (from "The Cruel Sea" by Nicholas Monsarrat)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 01-14-2011
Boasun's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 3,069
Thanks: 1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
Boasun will become famous soon enough Boasun will become famous soon enough
As long as you are in GOOD Health and Spry, Age has nothing to do with it.
I just turned that big seven zero and am thinking of acquiring a live aboard boat to travel with.

In other words: It isn't the age but the heart of the man at the helm...
__________________
1600 Ton Master, 2nd Mate Unlimited Tonnage

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Maritime Instructor
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

S/V Rapture
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 01-14-2011
Jeff_H's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Annapolis, Md
Posts: 6,664
Thanks: 5
Thanked 103 Times in 79 Posts
Rep Power: 10
Jeff_H has a spectacular aura about Jeff_H has a spectacular aura about Jeff_H has a spectacular aura about
I would agree whole-heartedly with Boasun. Depending on your health and physical condition, you should have no problem single-handing a 24 footer for many years to come. At 60, I routinely single-hand my 38 footer and I run into Jack Sherwood (68 or so) all over the Chesapeake and in all kinds of weather on his 23 footer. (Jack is an inspiration to us all). Stories of Boat Related Mishaps and Experiences | Soundings Online Column

My Dad sailed his 42 footer well up into his late 70's.

But no matter how old you are, you need to learn to sail smart, and that takes time on the water mixed with a little bit of studying.

Jeff
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Curmudgeon at Large- and rhinestone in the rough, sailing my Farr 11.6 on the Chesapeake Bay
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #9  
Old 01-14-2011
rikhall's Avatar
old guy :)
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Fredericton, NB, Canada
Posts: 1,036
Thanks: 12
Thanked 14 Times in 12 Posts
Rep Power: 7
rikhall will become famous soon enough
I'm 65 next birthday - who you calling old?

Just smiling and enjoying it!



Rik
__________________
Irwin Citation 34
Mystery
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #10  
Old 01-14-2011
Barquito's Avatar
Barquito
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 2,070
Thanks: 0
Thanked 18 Times in 18 Posts
Rep Power: 8
Barquito is on a distinguished road
One downside to OB's is that they tend to come out of the water as the boat rides over waves. Get a long shaft version. 9.9 HP is probably fine. I would think you would want some reserve power for a margin of safety if you find yourself in a jam (like escaping an achorage that has suddenly become a lee shore).

I think younger people tend to "muscle" their way out of mistakes. With wisdom (not necessarily age), you will develop a tool box of strategies for every emergency.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
two person monohull, how big? yellowwducky General Discussion (sailing related) 43 11-18-2008 11:51 AM
Im a very mean person........ SVDistantStar General Discussion (sailing related) 3 09-19-2008 03:03 PM
Suburban Dad Dies In Maui Sailng Accident - NBC5.com NewsReader News Feeds 0 03-27-2007 09:15 AM
Looking For A Compatible Person SailKabbalah Crew Wanted/Available 5 01-31-2004 04:20 PM
Crew Person Available mkoltuv Crew Wanted/Available 0 03-19-2003 09:20 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:46 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.