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Children now? Pirate Content...

8K views 39 replies 22 participants last post by  jackdale 
#1 ·
Somali pirates 'seize Danish children' in Indian Ocean

Denmark's foreign ministry said the children were aged between 12 and 16, and that two Danish crew members were also captured during the attack.

Pirates seized the boat on 24 February and were said to be heading to Somalia.

Piracy is a highly lucrative trade in Somalia, where gangs can often demand millions of dollars in ransoms.

As of last week, the EU's anti-piracy naval force said pirates were holding a total of 31 vessels, and 688 hostages.

Many of the vessels they target are cargo ships sailing near the Gulf of Aden - one of the world's busiest shipping lanes.
Increasing violence

The foreign ministry told the AP news agency that the ship sent a distress signal on Thursday: "It has now been confirmed that the sailboat was hijacked by pirates."

The Danes are be the second group of non-commercial sailors seized by pirates in recent weeks.

A group of Americans was seized earlier in February, and four of them were killed as the US Navy tried to rescue them.

US forces say the pirates shot them.

Analysts say the piracy industry is becoming increasingly lucrative - Somali gangs recently hijacked a tanker with $200m (£136m) worth of crude oil on board.

International naval forces patrolling the area are becoming more willing to send in commando teams to free hostages.

But the pirates also appear to be responding with increasing violence - two Philippine sailors were murdered last month by pirates angered at an attempted rescue.
 
#3 ·
I gotta question the wisdom of sailing to Somalia, particularly with kids on board.
 
#5 ·
Not to mention, blogging about it, with current position position reports posted with each entry... This is the Danish yacht ING's track straight though the heart of the area of pirate activity, available for anyone with internet access to see:


They're not the only ones doing this, it would appear the desire to blog trumps all reason...


You've really got to wonder, what planet some of these people are from...
 
#7 ·
Utter stupidity.
 
#9 ·
You have GOT to be kidding me!! :eek:

Do these idiots think that the pirates don't have internet? They made something like $100 million last year in ransom money. I think you can afford some broadband with that. And what I mean by broadband is they could afford to get their own fiber-optic cable run from Egypt.
 
#10 ·
In another 12 months or so I will have to make the decision about which way to continue our circumnavigation either Red Sea or around South Africa. It is not an easy decision and there are lots of considerations including (but not limited to): which set of destinations is most interesting since the two sets are so different, distance, and how do you compare the pirate risk to the weather risk around the Cape (of Storms). Lots of boats do the Red Sea route but with care - travelling in convoys, having the significant naval forces in the region keep an eye on you, no lights, AIS, taking down radar reflectors, restricting radio use (heard of one convoy that switched their radios to Canadian frequencies and only talked to each other on the Canadian Coast Guard channel (not likely to be monitored by the bad guys). I agree that a blog with positions does not make much sense.
 
#16 ·
Answering the question would take me clear into "Off Topic & Political" territory. So I shall refrain.

I will comment on the idiocy of taking children into pirate infested waters AND blogging one's position whilst your in them. I don't care why you think you can/should be able to sail waters known to be pirate infested - you don't risk children based on your ideals. I have some pretty strong ideals of my own, but I'd never in a million years risk my kids well-being.

And before people start berating me about me defending pirates or how people should be able to sail the waters without worrying about them - I am not saying anything against those concepts. I am simply pissed off at the irresponsibility of the parents risking their kids lives like that.
 
#17 ·
It's the Pirates that are to be blamed in any instance and their reach is extending.

It's appeasing attitudes that provide the moral compromise necessary to provide the bad guys the rope to continue their activities.

There is a lot of money being exchanged both by the Pirates and insurance companies. Follow the money to the real bad guys behind this it will lead to government leaders. Pirates are permitted to operate where they could easily be shut down and it's for good reason - money. The insurance companies are cleaning house and they buy politicians.

Stopping piracy is simple and you don't have to kill a single one. Simply sink their vessels when you find weapons fire or weapons on board (or video from a Helo/Drone). They simply will not have any vessels and hence cannot execute their trade. It's pretty darn simple but there is no motivation to truly stop this.
 
#18 ·
It's the Pirates that are to be blamed in any instance and their reach is extending.
For the kidnapping, yes. For exposing the children to the known liklihood of being kidnapped - that is the responsibility of the people sailing the boat (I am assuming the parents).

Piracy needs to be stopped, I don't disagree. Going into the "why hasn't it been stopped" and "what we should do to stop it" lines of conversation will get this thread yanked (like the other one), so I will refrain from that.

On the responsibility of captains for the well-being of their crew (especially, though not only, children) is something that I think we can discuss here. And, quite frankly, I don't think the people making the decisions in regards to sailing the waters they were kidnapped in were doing a spectacular job of that.

I cannot think of a good reason to take my kids into those waters KNOWING the risk of being boarded and held for ransom. It's not a secret what's going on over there.

It's appeasing attitudes that provide the moral compromise necessary to provide the bad guys the rope to continue their activities.
I don't think it is "appeasement" to discuss the wisdom of taking youngsters into pirate infested waters. I think the two discussions are distinct from one another and discussing one does not imply an opinion in the other.

I personally think there is (many politically charged) reasons to deal with the pirate problem and (many politically charged) methods of doing so. I also think there are (politically charged) reasons for why it hasn't been done. My opinion on that has nothing to do with the fact that I think taking children into those waters and regularly blogging one's position is monumentally stupid.

Stopping piracy is simple and you don't have to kill a single one. Simply sink their vessels when you find weapons fire or weapons on board (or video from a Helo/Drone). They simply will not have any vessels and hence cannot execute their trade. It's pretty darn simple but there is no motivation to truly stop this.
I WANT to answer this but cannot. If you want to get the full breadth of opinion on this issue, start a thread in the Off-Topic subforum... or (if you are feeling brave) start it in the Political subforum (where there be dragons ;) )
 
#20 ·
You have to question anyone's actions that sails in that part of the world. I like what the Russians have done with some pirates they caught. In 1 case it is reported they tied them to the deck and then burned the ship, in another they stripped the pirate vessel of navigation equipment and extra fuel and left them.
 
#23 ·
Well, that was to be expected I suppose. It's not really a hostage situation unless one is willing to kill/damage the hostage. I don't condone it at all, but it is not surprising.

Of note is how many people in that article thought the family idiotic for sailing the waters they did.
 
#24 ·
when I first heard of this my thoughts covered the two areas mentioned here: One stopping the pirates, and two using some common sense in what dangers you place yourself (and your family).

As far as stopping the pirates, I am confident that the US and others have sufficient satellite capabilities to monitor and detect this activity. Stopping it or at least intervening is then just a matter of desire (as in time, money, risk of military lives). While I am not an advocate of using the US military like a police force, this seems like a perfect use for a global police force.

One the second count, I was not aware of the blogging, that is amazing. I was thinking of ways to avoid pirates, even say in the Caribbean. Sails show up for a long way on the water, an obvious slow and easy target. How about some camo sails, with geometric shapes like used on warships to break up the outline? I say go stealth, and wait to publish your journal when you're safe at home port.
 
#25 ·
Based on my experience, in the 3rd world children are of no consequence. And, a "child" over 13 - 14 years of age is not considered a child. In fact a child that is capable of aiming and firing a weapon isn't considered a child. The Danes will see no "mercy" for their children in that part of the world.

Frankly, while I think it would have been bad judgement to have taken the yacht into that area with adults only, having done so with children aboard--and exposing them to such danger--verges on criminal negligence.

Unfortunately, I don't think any government, or group of governments, will take any preemptive action to stop piracy until the body count, and accordingly public outrage/indignation, is great enough to force action. Until then, I doubt anything will happen to remedy the situation.
 
#27 ·
We are currently in New Zealand, two years into our circumnavigation. We met the family aboard ING at a boatyard in Papeete last year. It's sad to hear what has become of them. The two boys from the boat participated in the Tahiti/Moorea sailing rendezvous aboard another Danish boat. They are very nice, soft spoken kids. I for one have absolutely no intention of sailing anywhere near Somalia. South Africa is the far more attractive route.
 
#28 ·
I have been 'stuck' in Malaysia for the last few years.
Personally I do not feel like taking the risk on any of the routes at the moment, but are in the lucky position that I may just wait and see.
On the other hand I'll not straight out condemn those who do. There are risks as soon as you set out in the oceans, one way or the other.
To me it looks like the Danish boat has taken a 'high risk' route all from the start, blog or no blog. Going by Cochin and down the Oman coast seems less risky, at least according to available info from Noonsite and others, but quite a bit longer.
The latest info I got tells af about 70 yachts waiting to cross the Indian Ocean.
I think it is time that Paul Watson and Sea Shepard stop chasing the whalers and start chasing pirates!!!
 
#33 ·
The problem is how do you tell some fishermen wanting to trade fish for cigarettes or booze, from pirates?

and as far as I know, there is no navy for rent.

but Blackwater, er Xe, might be willing for a price.


There is one thing I would do, if I choose to arm myself. put a laser on the weapon.

Everyone knows a laser dot means a gun is pointed at them... that could be an effective weapon, short of shooting into the air.

-in the previous photo, I'd have shot a warning shot.. into the air... just so everyone knows I meant business.
 
#34 ·
Most of the primary predators in Africa have as their favourite food source a herd of whatever they're hunting. Why?

Well, the herd has only one thing on their mind when the predator attacks - flight. Leaving the animal under attack to take the heat while they get the flock out of there.

Thirty yachts in a flotilla, a pirate vessel decides which one he wants (same as the lion does) and then attacks it, bristling with rocket launchers, grenades and automatic weapons. How many yachts in the flotilla are going to come to their rescue?

If you believe any of them will, then go flotilla sailing. Me?

I'd go to the Cape while the rest of the flotilla (like the animals in the herd) shout warnings at each other over their VHF's and head as fast as possible in the opposite direction.

OK I am a born skeptic. Sorry.
 
#35 ·
Well, it depends... some prey animals flee, others fight... if the convoy is armed, that changes things....but carrying weapons can be a big problem otherwise.
 
#37 ·
#38 ·
Question: These attack have occurred hundreds of miles of the coast, 600mi in the latest incident I believe. So the pirates are operating out of a larger base ship? - probably a stolen commercial vessel? If that's the case then it should be an easy matter of finding and sinking them....no?

It's one thing if you're making hit and run attacks in a high speed skiff with the safety of the coast to run to, but if your in a giant stolen freighter flying a flag that's not yours - how hard is it to find, board, and check that all is in order?

There's a big difference between a rouge coast you should avoid and piracy on the high seas. What seems to be the problem here?
 
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