S/V Triumph lost in the atlantic - Page 51 - SailNet Community
 532Likes
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #501 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Senior Member
 
mitiempo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Victoria B.C. Canada
Posts: 7,485
Thanks: 0
Thanked 94 Times in 85 Posts
Rep Power: 8
   
Adam

I don't think you will find any bronze on a Catalina 27. None I have seen anyway. And chromed bronze is rare now compared to years past.

Brian
Living aboard in Victoria Harbour
mitiempo is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #502 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Sunsets and Warm Beer....
 
LandLocked66c's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Bottom of a Pint Glass...
Posts: 2,111
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Granite chain plates are the biznes right now! Just sayin...
xymotic likes this.

1971 23' Oday Pop Top
S/V Frida

You can't steer a boat that isn't moving? Just like a life - P. Lutus
LandLocked66c is offline  
post #503 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Senior Member
 
casey1999's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: HI
Posts: 3,274
Thanks: 18
Thanked 44 Times in 43 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamLein View Post
Is bronze on boats guaranteed to always look bronze? Is there any way to tell whether my shiny metal bits are stainless, vs. some sort of plated bronze?
On my 33 year old boat a lot of the standing fittings and winches are chrome plated bronze. They still look strong. I can tell because the chrome plating has either been worn away or there may be small dings in the chrome where you can see the underlaying bronze.

BTW, the bronze is not shiny (after being on a boat), it is dull color bronze and salt water can give it a very dark green tinge. You could polish it, but that just removes good metal and takes away the protective petina.

Here is another interesting video:

Jack Chrysler Presents: Titanium - The Ultimate Metal for the Marine Environment

Last edited by casey1999; 09-27-2011 at 03:19 PM.
casey1999 is offline  
post #504 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 4,610
Thanks: 1
Thanked 188 Times in 156 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by casey1999 View Post
Read item #8 of your link. Looks like Titanium should be ok with as a chain plate even if they are connected. The rigging should not be active, it should be passive.

Also found this site (interesting article):

Titanium Chainplates Info - Allied Titanium

they also sell titanium chain plates at about $200 each all fabricated.
Thanks for those links, amazing how quickly things have changed with the pricing on titanium, wasn't very long ago it was often jokingly referred to an Unobtainium, and for good reason... I've been using titanium anchor shackles for awhile, and they were still considerably more expensive than an equivalent stainless counterpart ...

If I were replacing or starting from scratch today, I'd probably have a good look at composite chainplates from a material such as G-10, a number of high-end builders appear to be going that route, as well... Probably pretty pricey, however, would be my guess...
JonEisberg is offline  
post #505 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Senior Member
 
casey1999's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: HI
Posts: 3,274
Thanks: 18
Thanked 44 Times in 43 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
Thanks for those links, amazing how quickly things have changed with the pricing on titanium, wasn't very long ago it was often jokingly referred to an Unobtainium, and for good reason... I've been using titanium anchor shackles for awhile, and they were still considerably more expensive than an equivalent stainless counterpart ...

If I were replacing or starting from scratch today, I'd probably have a good look at composite chainplates from a material such as G-10, a number of high-end builders appear to be going that route, as well... Probably pretty pricey, however, would be my guess...
Just to confirm, this link shows titanium chain plate pre fabed for many types of boats.
Titanium Chainplates, Items 1 to 50 of 90 - Allied Titanium

I have seen some new boats building the chain plate (of epoxy) right into the hull/deck) looks good although it seems their could be a very large stress concentration in the hole of the fiberglass chain plate- not sure if I would trust that over the long hual. Maybe for a short life race boat it is ok.
Regards
casey1999 is offline  
post #506 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Doesn't sail enough
 
zedboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Eastern Med
Posts: 361
Thanks: 0
Thanked 18 Times in 18 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by casey1999 View Post
To be honest, don't understand why so many fittings on a boat are made of stianless. For what a gather, it mainly came about because stainless "looks" good. You hear so many stories of stainless just failing, even if a recent inspection indicated all was good. Bronze is the true marine metal.
Just out of curiosity, how much weaker is a typical bronze chainplate than its SS equivalent? Is bronze strong enough that other things (swages? mast-side fittings?) will fail first?

For that matter, I see that there are about a zillion copper alloys in the bronze family. What's typically used for marine applications?
zedboy is offline  
post #507 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Senior Member
 
casey1999's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: HI
Posts: 3,274
Thanks: 18
Thanked 44 Times in 43 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zedboy View Post
Just out of curiosity, how much weaker is a typical bronze chainplate than its SS equivalent? Is bronze strong enough that other things (swages? mast-side fittings?) will fail first?

For that matter, I see that there are about a zillion copper alloys in the bronze family. What's typically used for marine applications?
My understanding is silicone bronze is best in marine applications.

Here are specs:
Silicone Bronze: Ultimate strengthe 85k psi, Yield 55k psi
316 SS Ultimate strength 90K psi Yield 60k psi
304 SS Ultimate strength 73K psi Yield 31k psi

So Silicone Bronze should be fine- for practical purposes as strong as "new" 316 SS.

Good link:
Stainless Product Guide - AlcobraMetals.com

http://www.alcobrametals.com/guide.php?metal=2#silicon

Last edited by casey1999; 09-27-2011 at 04:43 PM.
casey1999 is offline  
post #508 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 713
Thanks: 3
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
I have an OLD steel boat, and where the rigging attaches there is significant rust.

I'm not sure if these are 'chainplates' per se because they are welded to the boat, and I've not investigates exactly how they are constructed all that much.

But, it seems to me that one will never be abole to paint or protect that area, since the rig will move slightly and the shackles will rub, and also hold a tiny amount of water, which obviously will equal rust.

Which brings me to my question, is there a material that I could use to isolate the stainless rig from the steel chainplate? something like a g10 sandwich or a composite ring that the rig would attach to?

How can I better protect this area, and prevent THIS:
xymotic is offline  
post #509 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Senior Member
 
casey1999's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: HI
Posts: 3,274
Thanks: 18
Thanked 44 Times in 43 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by xymotic View Post
I have an OLD steel boat, and where the rigging attaches there is significant rust.

I'm not sure if these are 'chainplates' per se because they are welded to the boat, and I've not investigates exactly how they are constructed all that much.

But, it seems to me that one will never be abole to paint or protect that area, since the rig will move slightly and the shackles will rub, and also hold a tiny amount of water, which obviously will equal rust.

Which brings me to my question, is there a material that I could use to isolate the stainless rig from the steel chainplate? something like a g10 sandwich or a composite ring that the rig would attach to?

How can I better protect this area, and prevent THIS:
A freind has an 85 foot steel ketch that he has sailed several times aroung the world and sailed continusely for the last 20 years. The boat also has steel chain plates welded to the hull like yours. The plates were corroded where the stainless pin goes through the hole in the steel chain plate for the shroud connection. I was surprised it has held. Maybe a marine grease would work at that location where the pin would rub.
casey1999 is offline  
post #510 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011
Senior Member
 
tommays's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,296
Thanks: 1
Thanked 30 Times in 30 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
I have to go with it depends keeping in mind i fix broken SS stuff for a living





For example on the Cal 29 there are SIX chain-plates taking care of the load on at the widest part of the boat(the uppers shrouds are only 3/16 on and 8000# hull) and a 3/16 upper would POP before it got close to stressing the plate

All six were removed checked and buffed and given the light use they had for most of the boats life i not to worried

I have also never seen SS crevice corrode from the inside OUT it always starts on the surface and works IN

1970 Cal 29 Sea Fever

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

1981 J24 Tangent 2930
Tommays
Northport NY


If a dirty bottom slows you down what do you think it does to your boat
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by tommays; 09-27-2011 at 06:23 PM.
tommays is offline  
Closed Thread

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Report from yacht lost in the Atlantic SallyH General Discussion (sailing related) 21 08-06-2011 10:49 AM
Spin Tec Triumph 2000 furlers ???????? sailbear50 Gear & Maintenance 0 11-17-2009 11:10 PM
Teens Triumph On the Bay - Washington Post NewsReader News Feeds 0 08-05-2007 12:15 AM
The Triumph of Good Tania Aebi Cruising Articles 0 07-21-2004 08:00 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome