Boat Sinks off Barnegat Inlet - Page 2 - SailNet Community
 5Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #11 of 46 Old 10-16-2011
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 4,623
Thanks: 1
Thanked 188 Times in 156 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb32863 View Post
Getting my popcorn and a cooler.... let the "quarterbacking" begin....
Aw, what the hell, I'll give it a whirl...(grin)

First, my Standard Sailing Forum Disclaimer, following the lead of Herman Cain:

"Now, I don't have any facts to back this up, but..."

Quote:
The following statements neither express nor imply any criticism, second-guessing, or Monday Morning Quarterbacking of the actions of the crew of the sailing vessel ODES TO JOY on Thursday evening whilst attempting to enter Barnegat Inlet... My comments are intended to be taken, in the absence of further details at this time regarding this incident, solely as my best supposition of what might have been likely to have occurred that evening, in an effort to use this incident as a merely cautionary example of the sort of thing that can go wrong at a place like Barnegat... My comments are to be construed as nothing more than a "hunch" about what may have occurred, and are solely reflective of my personal OPINION... Said opinions are primarily derived from my personal experience and observation,. Despite the fact I have lived most of my life on Barnegat Bay, and have fished out of both Manasquan and Barnegat Inlets since boyhood, anyone taking these opinions to be either ”informed”, or constitute anything bearing even the slightest resemblance to ”expertise”, does so entirely at their own risk... No liability should be implied or assumed in posting the following comments. Additionally, anyone feeling there is no value whatsoever in discussing the potential hazards of a transit of Barnegat Inlet, or this particular incident in the absence of more information than is available at this time, is politely requested to refrain from reading any further…

(grin, bigtime)
I think the timimg of this incident/distress call likely says it all, after 1900 on Thursday would have been getting onto pretty much full-on darkness… Also, we’ve had a fair amount of fog coming and going along the coast the past week, the visibility in the pic the following morning doesn’t look so hot… Even the fanciest 3-D electronic cartography would be of minimal help at Barnegat, even with local knowledge, entering at night in the fog would be very risky… I’d want to get inside really badly to make the attempt in heavy fog at night, in anything less than absolutely benign conditions…

The submerged jetty on the north side is not particularly well-defined on most charts, and would have been well beneath the surface at the stage of the tide that night (about mid-tide, on the flood)… I think the lighted tower at the end of the visible jetty sometimes further lulls some boaters into thinking that marks the outermost hazard, and this boat likely passed by Manasquan Inlet that afternoon, where it is apparent that is certainly the case (With a swell running, or the tide on the ebb, locals often prefer to cutting around the rocks at Manasquan as closely as you dare, then making a quick sharp turn in).. Such an approach will definitely NOT work at Barnegat, in anything other than a small center console fishing boat, or anything else of similarly shallow draft… I routinely cut a LOT of corners up and down the East coast, and guys who fish around those rocks insist there is a passage for a deeper draft sailboat through there, but… maybe in my next life, I’ll have the nerve to give it a try… But, not in this life, that's one corner I don't have the nerve to cut closer than about the second pair of fairway buoys in from the sea buoy...

Older, submerged jetties pose a similar risk at several inlets along the East coast – Ocean City, MD, Winyah Bay Entrance, Charleston, Savannah River, and St Mary’s Entrance, to name the most obvious… Absolutely boggles the mind that their furthest seaward projections are not marked more conspicuously, especially by lighted aids at night… The end of the north jetty at St Mary’s is the only one that comes to mind, that has a lighted buoy positioned near the end of the jetty… The submerged rocks at Barnegat are not even marked with true nav aids, but rather usually small unlit buoys similar to the type that usually mark “No Wake Zones”, or similar…

After the loss of the s/v MORNING DEW and the death of the 4 aboard after hitting the jetty at Charleston back in the 90’s, I thought for sure something would FINALLY be done about marking the end of the jetties that become awash at high tide with a light of a more distinguishing characteristic than the line of nav aids that define the entrance channel – something like a yellow strobe, or similar… One would think in the wake of a $35 million lawsuit brought against the CG in the wake of that incident, and the litany of recommendations made by the NTSB investigation, at least some attention might have been given to better identifying submerged jetties to mariners, but apparently not…

Absolutely heartbreaking, the loss of a beauty like ODE TO JOY so shortly after such an effort given to her restoration… Just one more reminder, bad things can happen entering small boat inlets/harbors at night…

Last edited by JonEisberg; 10-16-2011 at 11:09 PM.
JonEisberg is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #12 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 218
Thanks: 0
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
When I look at the NOAA chart for Barnegat Inlet, it shows the lighted buoy out at the end of the submerged part of the north jetty, so you would have to cut inside it in order to ground on the submerged jetty when arriving from the north. Am I missing something?
Plumbean is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #13 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
Over Hill Sailing Club
 
smurphny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Adirondacks NY
Posts: 3,324
Thanks: 78
Thanked 94 Times in 91 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
Very sad about this boat. Hope they can somehow salvage her. One thing that may be helpful to some are .jpg images you can save from Google Earth photos. I have a folder of printouts of all the E.Coast inlets which sometimes give a pretty clear picture of what is not on charts. They can even be calibrated to work with chartplotters. They are often outdated but still give a good idea of what an inlet actually looks like.

Boat Sinks off Barnegat Inlet-barnegatinlet2.jpg

Boat Sinks off Barnegat Inlet-barnegatinlet.jpg

These are Barnegat--obviously a nasty spot.
smurphny is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #14 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
GMC
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: CT
Posts: 150
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
It does look like it was the Ode To Joy from other paper reports. Owner had restored wonderfully and launched on the Hudson in late September according to his blog. Looks like a lot of sweat and love went into getting it ready. My condolences to him. Glad everyone is safe.
GMC is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #15 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
Sunsets and Warm Beer....
 
LandLocked66c's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Bottom of a Pint Glass...
Posts: 2,111
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
So what did he on the photo's above? I'm not familar with the area.

1971 23' Oday Pop Top
S/V Frida

You can't steer a boat that isn't moving? Just like a life - P. Lutus
LandLocked66c is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #16 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
AEOLUS II
 
WouldaShoulda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: From The Land of Pleasant Living
Posts: 2,894
Thanks: 3
Thanked 12 Times in 12 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
Has anyone been arrested, gotten drunk, or pooped in a cop car yet??
CaptFoolhardy likes this.
WouldaShoulda is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #17 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
Sunsets and Warm Beer....
 
LandLocked66c's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Bottom of a Pint Glass...
Posts: 2,111
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WouldaShoulda View Post
Has anyone been arrested, gotten drunk, or pooped in a cop car yet??
So far no "yuck light" can's have been found at the scene...

1971 23' Oday Pop Top
S/V Frida

You can't steer a boat that isn't moving? Just like a life - P. Lutus
LandLocked66c is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #18 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
Senior Member
 
TakeFive's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Swarthmore, PA
Posts: 3,090
Thanks: 6
Thanked 80 Times in 70 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by smurphny View Post
...One thing that may be helpful to some are .jpg images you can save from Google Earth photos. I have a folder of printouts of all the E.Coast inlets which sometimes give a pretty clear picture of what is not on charts. They can even be calibrated to work with chartplotters. They are often outdated but still give a good idea of what an inlet actually looks like...
The outdated part is worth emphasizing. These satellite pics can give a general idea of the area, but boaters are also well advised to heed the warning on Note C of NOAA's chart for this area:
Quote:
Buoys in these channels are not charted because they are moved frequently. Hydrography in Barnegat Inlet is not shown due to its continually shifting nature.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Formerly posted as "RhythmDoctor"
1998 Catalina 250WK Take Five (at Anchorage Marina, Essington, on the Delaware River)
1991 15' Trophy (Lake Wallenpaupack)
1985 14' Phantom (Lake Wallenpaupack)
TakeFive is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #19 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
Senior Member
 
RichH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 3,388
Thanks: 23
Thanked 143 Times in 133 Posts
Rep Power: 15
 
The problem with most less than Class A inlets is that the buoyage is moved frequently and the NOAA charts only reflect 'greyed out' areas of the inlet.

In the computer age with instant 'net access it wouldnt be 'all that hard' for the CG/NOAA to compile the exact buoyage / hazzard and list such info on 'temporary' charts that would be helpful and increase SAFETY. The only agencies that do issue inlet condition / buoyage is via private enterprise (such a whitesound press, etc.) and those are 'hard copy' which are instantly obsolete at the next buoy changes .... but still INFINITELY better than the 'greyed out' NOAA charts. Worse yet the 'greyed out' areas of charts containing inlets are always at low resolution, low magnification on even the standard issue NOAA charting. "local knowledge" just doesnt cut it in the 'information age'.
RichH is online now  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #20 of 46 Old 10-17-2011
Senior Member
 
TakeFive's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Swarthmore, PA
Posts: 3,090
Thanks: 6
Thanked 80 Times in 70 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichH View Post
...In the computer age with instant 'net access it wouldnt be 'all that hard' for the CG/NOAA to compile the exact buoyage / hazzard and list such info on 'temporary' charts that would be helpful and increase SAFETY...
I'll take it one step further. AIS technology was designed with the capability to transmit "virtual buoys" that could be relocated or otherwise modified in real time. USCG could easily transmit these signals through their repeating towers.

All it takes is money, which is sure to become harder to come by going forward.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Formerly posted as "RhythmDoctor"
1998 Catalina 250WK Take Five (at Anchorage Marina, Essington, on the Delaware River)
1991 15' Trophy (Lake Wallenpaupack)
1985 14' Phantom (Lake Wallenpaupack)
TakeFive is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Moriches Inlet vs Fire Island Inlet threeofakind Cruising & Liveaboard Forum 4 02-03-2014 05:29 PM
Adding a 50A AC inlet to a boat with two 30A labestia Electronics 8 02-19-2010 08:30 AM
Sailing to Barnegat Inlet fdefran12 General Discussion (sailing related) 6 06-29-2009 01:46 PM
Missing Sailor Found Off BARNEGAT Inlet Freesail99 General Discussion (sailing related) 14 10-09-2008 11:22 PM
Bottom Boat Strip/Paint in Upper Barnegat Bay, New Jersey Trescool Gear & Maintenance 1 03-24-2008 12:50 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome