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20' to 22' swing keel with small cuddy

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cuddy trailer
12K views 48 replies 25 participants last post by  Ziaduck 
#1 · (Edited)
Hello again,

I don't like redundant threads as much as the next guy, but in need of pretty specific information.

My dad and I are looking at going half-in on a small trailerable sailboat. I live in Vancouver, Canada, he is in inland WA state. We thought of getting something we could keep at a marina, say in Everett, during the sailing season.

Neither of us has much boating experience, so a forgiving boat would be preferred. Key is that it have a larger cockpit than an equal sized cruiser. Probably will be used for day outings and perhaps tow to other parts of the region....hence the swing keel. A small cuddy with room for two would be nice, definitely room for a portable head.

I'm thinking Tanzer, Catalina or early MacGregors would fit the bill, but are these not more cruisers? Suggestions welcome. My dad is eager to spend money, but I'd rather step back and do some research.

Thanks,
Matt
 
#31 ·
I'll second the Kent Ranger 20 as a great boat, I currently own 1 and have owned another. They are local for you (100 miles) and close for dad. They sail very well, weigh 1550 lbs. and trailer great. 1 healthy person can set the mast in place and be sailing from trailer in 30/45 minutes. Active forums both here in Seattle, and in Portland, with at least one active Sailmaker, and several of the original vendors still at the same addresses that they were when the boat was built. Approx 700 boats were built with some even being built in Salt Lake City.
Mine is in the water, If you or dad want to see it, let me know....They come up for sail on the Forums/Craigslist but you have to be fast, as they sell quickly. After the snow stops/melts I'm willing to go for a sail if you are interested. I'm on Lake Washington, near downtown.
Let me know
Kary
S/V Mariah
*49080
 
#34 ·
The price in not bad BUT........condition is everything. The dodger was an option and a replacement is ~ $550.00 (just got a new one from the original vendor 2 years ago) that boat has what we call the travel/storage cover on it. Sails = it needs a genoa, and they are hard to find and ~600.00 new. I have lots of INFO on the boat, feel free to contact me if you need more/have questions....I'm 1 of the more active R20 owners around, and have done many up-grades/changes to my R20.
Kary
S/V Mariah
#49080
 
#35 ·
Thought I would provide an update. My folks moving back up to BC and my dad still wants to get a boat, he's getting older and does not want to put it off indefinitely. I've been rereading all the great suggestions and starting to lean towards a San Juan 21 or a Kent Ranger. The bonus is once he's up here we can store the boat on dry land over winter. I guess my only issue with the San Juans is that the fleet is getting older. Not sure if that should be a worry on a fiberglass boat. Many are in the 40 year-old area. Should I let this bother me?
 
#36 ·
I think condition is more important than age with anything that you'd be interested in. I wouldn't get hung up on a specific model...none of these is going to be your boat to live on or to take you around the world. I'd just see what's for sale in your area, go look at them, and buy one that looks good. Find someone to go look at it with you if you don't know what you're looking at. Get sailing. It's been almost 2 years since your original post...you could have been pondering your perfect San Juan purchase from the cockpit of your Catalina 22!

It's not about Ms. Right in this price range. It's Ms. Right Now.
 
#38 ·
A Catalina 22 will do the job AND be relatively easy to sell on after a year or two.

I am biased because I had the UK version and it looked after me well on the West Coast of Scotland and the Adriatic.

Cracking little boat, sure some others are fast but it gets there.
 
#39 ·
What are your plans now? Will you always trailer-sail the boat, or will you keep it in a slip for part of the year? Will you take the boat to other waters? A trailer-sailor is different from a trailerable boat, and your intended use can make one a good choice and the other bad.
 
#46 ·
A trailer-sailor is different from a trailerable boat, and your intended use can make one a good choice and the other bad.
Would love it if you could explain the difference. I imagine any boat can be "trailered", that does not however make it easy to launch from a ramp.
Odds are I will leave on trailer for most of the year, then perhaps find a slip. There are many large lakes, bays, inlets and other sheltered waters in my area.

That said, I suspect it would be nice to be able to keep it in the water for a length of time. The getting there, putting in, stepping the mast, etc, can take a fair bit of time....time you could be spending on the water.
 
#40 ·
I will put my 2 cents in on this (which may only be actually worth 1 cent). I am partial to Macgregor if you get the right one. The the older swing keel options are great boats. I sailed my MacGregor 222 (pop top for extra room at dock/mooring) THe boat sails like a much bigger boat and would routinely have it out on Lake Michigan in 4-6 footers and she handled it like a champ. The cockpit is roomy enough on the 22 footer for 4 adults to sit comfortably. The boat is well balanced. If you could find a MacGregor 25 w/ swing keel that could be a great boat for you.

That being said here are some other quality boats that could fit the bill.

Cal 21
Chrysler 20 0r 22 (22 is feels like a much bigger boat)
Catalina 22
San Jaun

I second what Jeff said. Find a decent boat in decent condition and go for it. Each of these boats has pro's and con's and you will learn to deal with them. Just make sure your keel lifting cable is good and the hull and deck is in good shape. I would say make sure the main sail is in good shape and the jibs can be had for pretty cheep (I had 5 jibs that cost me less than $500 collectively) Everything else on those boats is relatively inexpensive.

Just stay away from Bay-liner Buccaneers (really poor design) and MacGregor M's (Power boat and sailboat combo that doesn't do either very well at all.)
 
#41 ·
As above the big question is whether you are going to trailer every time or keep it in a slip. A swing keel will be easier to launch but I tend to prefer the shoal keel/CB style (Oday, Compac, Precision) simply because they are more stable with the board up. But really it does come down to price and availability.

So think about all that carefully and then go buy this boat and go sailing.

MacGregor Sailboat w/Trailer $500

Sort of kidding but check out a yahoo group call freesailboats. They post boats under $1000 and even free. Most are projects but not all, there are some great deals and now is the time of year to look since people don't want to deal with them over the winter.

I am a fan of get something close to what you want, don't obsess now. Get a boat, sail it and you'll have a great time and learn more about what you want in your next boat.
 
#42 ·
As above the big question is whether you are going to trailer every time or keep it in a slip. A swing keel will be easier to launch but I tend to prefer the shoal keel/CB style (Oday, Compac, Precision) simply because they are more stable with the board up. But really it does come down to price and availability.
The MacGregor 22 , 222, 24 and 25 all have 500lbs in the locking swing keel. The draft down is about 5 feet. I have had my old 222 in gust up to 18 knots with full main and 90 jib and she put the rail in the water and then stiffened up. If you are sailing more shallow waters you simply bring the keel up halfway and you are shoal draft (performance is a bit different with center of gravity farther aft but still fine.) Catalina and Cal are similar setups. I never had an issue with the boats balance or feeling top heavy. The transverse cannot be always be said about a shoal draft 24 footer or less. On main only my boat would handle 25knts and fly. Personal opinion is that a deeper heavy swing keel is pretty good setup.
 
#43 ·
Oh, no question that a swing keel can be stable and I wouldn't dissuade anyone at all. Putting the weight further down definitely helps and allows you to get more stability from less ballast, which makes trailering easier (lighter overall) and launching easier since you don't have to float the boat as much. Note that I did point him to the MacGregor with the swing keel and would have not have turned down a boat with one. There are the disadvantages of a lot of weight hanging on one pivot bolt, more weight to crank up and down, and they are definitely tippier with the board up but not generally all that bad. I also don't like the clunking you can get with a swing keel that's not locked down and then there is the whole 'lock the keel down' thing. But again nothing that would really dissuade me from owning one.

Boats with shoal keel/CB setups tend to have a lot more ballast to compensate for the weight being shallower which makes them less desirable to tow (heavier) and harder to launch (higher on trailer). The upsides are that you can lose the centerboard and they still sail pretty well and it also really opens up the interior since you don't have the keel trunk.

Either way you will have fun so get out there and sail!
 
#47 ·
I vote for the swing keel Santana 21 by Shock. Trailer able and one normal person can step the mast. Easily driven by a 4 hp outboard. Comfy cabin with a liner. Sails well with a little weather helm to keep you out of trouble. I think they were built in the early 70s.
 
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