L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns - SailNet Community
 5Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 20 Old 03-09-2012 Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
skygazer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: western Maine
Posts: 393
Thanks: 2
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 4
 
L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

I often read old books from the library, I get points of view that are different than today's, but sometimes interesting or useful.

I was reading L. Francis Herreshoff's "Sensible Cruising Designs" when I came across a statement that surprised me, and which I thought might surprise others.

He believes in simplicity (for example, a cedar bucket for a toilet, can be used anywhere and good if sick) and breaks down the cabin necessities into two groups. Those things which are kept aboard, and those brought aboard for each trip.

Here is a quote:

"The things kept on board might be the stove, pressure cooker, pipe berths, Hudson Bay blankets, oilskins, a clam hoe, and, because a cabin does not look homelike without it, also a gun. Oh yes; and the cedar bucket."

I'm surprised at how much things have changed. Of course, he also mentions personally plowing (farmland) with horses, so he has an old fashioned viewpoint. I guess what surprises me the most is the idea that the cabin doesn't look "homelike" without a gun plainly visible. He later expands on hanging the gun on strong wooden brackets, how to shellac it against rust, and shooting a revolver from a yacht "quite safe when sensibly done, and perhaps the best training for coordinating the hands and eyes." He clearly views the gun as a tool, like the clam hoe.

I'm not trying to argue about it, just thought others might be interested in an old fashioned view before TV and movies and political correctness muddied the waters. I won't be responding to those who wish to turn this into a pro/anti gun argument, it is simply historical fact.
skygazer is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 20 Old 03-09-2012
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Narragansett Bay
Posts: 10,837
Thanks: 45
Thanked 218 Times in 203 Posts
Rep Power: 7
   
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

You bet. The USA was built on them. The Minute Men didn't win our freedom from a Monarchy by arguing in parliament and filing legal briefs. Actually, that was somewhat tried first. They are engrained in a culture of self sufficiency. "We don't need your rich government, sun never sets on it, largest navy in the world, to take care of us and in turn take from us". It would have never worked peacefully, as unfortunate as that is.

When LFH was a kid, we were not yet a superpower and still probably quite threatened by e experience just about 100 years earlier.

As far as the pro/con flames, there is ample evidence world wide to support both points of view. I agree, that game long ago ended in a stalemate.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Jeanneau 54DS

In the harsh marine environment, something is always in need of repair. Margaritas fix everything.

Last edited by Minnewaska; 03-09-2012 at 11:50 AM.
Minnewaska is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #3 of 20 Old 03-09-2012
Senior Member
 
PaulfromNWOnt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Fort Frances, ON, CA
Posts: 342
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 5
 
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

Ashore, there likely would have been a "possibles" bag to go along with it. The frontier days are not that long gone that the same philosophy can still help out.

Thanks for the tidbit.

1975 Catalina 22 and looking to "Move on up"
Member of the Rendezvous Yacht Club that straddles the Canada/US border.
PaulfromNWOnt is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #4 of 20 Old 03-09-2012
Senior Member
 
KIVALO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Central New York
Posts: 391
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 4
 
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

We could learn much from past generations if only we took the time to do so.
MedSailor and jimrafford like this.

s/v KIVALO
2003 Hunter 260
"Any damn fool can navigate the world sober. It takes a really good sailor to do it drunk." - Sir Francis Chichester while loading his boat with gin.
WORK IS OVER-RATED
KIVALO is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #5 of 20 Old 03-10-2012 Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
skygazer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: western Maine
Posts: 393
Thanks: 2
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 4
 
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

My latest acquisition had a marine toilet removed by a PO, leaving two nice bronze through hulls connected to nothing. I hope to eventually remove them and glass it over.

Here is what L. F. Herreshoff thinks of through hulls on small boats (meaning not great square sailed ships). He quotes an even older author, J. J. Roche:

"They bored a hole below her line to let the
water out
But more and more, with awful roar, the
water in did spout."



I think my book is overdue, need to return it soon.
skygazer is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #6 of 20 Old 03-11-2012
Senior Member
 
denverd0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 991
Thanks: 0
Thanked 24 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

It is amazing the difference a generation makes.

My father grew up in Sidney, Nebraska. He says that during pheasant season, when he was old enough, he brought his shotgun to school with him, so that he could do a little hunting on his way home. Just left it in his locker during the day. Most of the boys, and a few of the girls, he says, did the same thing. No one raised an eyebrow and there was never any problem.

If someone did something like that today the school would be locked down, a SWAT team would be called, the kid who brought the gun would be spending a long time in juvenile detention, and the kid's parents would probably end up in jail also.
denverd0n is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #7 of 20 Old 03-11-2012
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 609
Thanks: 0
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Rep Power: 14
 
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

When I was in HS in the late '70's, it was not unusual to see guys w/ a Buckknife on their belt. Folding, about 3.5 inches long.

Hell, now a days a kid who picks up the wrong lunch bag off the kitchen counter and takes it to school and finds Mom's paring knife in HER lunch bag gets suspended.

And while searching for the link to THAT story, I found a similar one HERE.

Jeez.
sailordave is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #8 of 20 Old 03-11-2012
Swab
 
vega1860's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: At Sea
Posts: 805
Thanks: 2
Thanked 21 Times in 19 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

Quote:
Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
It is amazing the difference a generation makes.

My father grew up in Sidney, Nebraska. He says that during pheasant season, when he was old enough, he brought his shotgun to school with him, so that he could do a little hunting on his way home. Just left it in his locker during the day. Most of the boys, and a few of the girls, he says, did the same thing. No one raised an eyebrow and there was never any problem.

If someone did something like that today the school would be locked down, a SWAT team would be called, the kid who brought the gun would be spending a long time in juvenile detention, and the kid's parents would probably end up in jail also.
My childhood was much the same as your father's. No one thought anything of a 11 or12 year old kid carrying a .410 or .22 for a little after school hunting.

Things have changed.

I was reading a news report just the other day concerning the parents of a four year old who were arrested when their child's pre-school teacher called police after the little tyke drew a picture of a gun. The parents were held while their home was searched. No guns were found. This took place in Canada.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
vega1860 is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #9 of 20 Old 03-11-2012 Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
skygazer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: western Maine
Posts: 393
Thanks: 2
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 4
 
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

Quote:
Originally Posted by vega1860 View Post
My childhood was much the same as your father's. No one thought anything of a 11 or12 year old kid carrying a .410 or .22 for a little after school hunting.

Things have changed.

I was reading a news report just the other day concerning the parents of a four year old who were arrested when their child's pre-school teacher called police after the little tyke drew a picture of a gun. The parents were held while their home was searched. No guns were found. This took place in Canada.
Wow! Perhaps they should arrest television.
skygazer is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #10 of 20 Old 03-11-2012
amyspins
 
amyspins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: CT
Posts: 45
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
 
Re: L. Francis Herreshoff - boat designer... and guns

yes things have changed! Growing up (I was born in '66) no self-respecting guy went anywhere without a pocket knife - and we all learned how to shoot a 22- to start with.

BTW, I've been looking for a copy of that (or other) Francis Herreshoff book as he designed the boat I'm in the process of buying - and he was quite dogmatic with all his opinions. As a woman, I would have to beg to differ with many of those opinions. However, I get where he's coming from- a different age and a different America -and I still enjoy the reading. I've seen a quote several times - something to the effect that if you changed the design of his H-28 one tiny bit, then the birds would not continue to sing over the companionway - or something to that effect. Too sad, as I have a flushing head and no cedar bucket on board!

Still love the boat, though, even if it is made of "frozen snot" not wood.

amy
amyspins is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Flare-guns and other alternatives (excluding guns) as weapons BlueSovereign Cruising & Liveaboard Forum 59 10-25-2012 11:25 AM
guns on a the boat of the 16 year old sailing around the world. SSBN506 General Discussion (sailing related) 70 10-11-2008 07:25 PM
St. Francis Cat? cbcat Boat Review and Purchase Forum 4 05-31-2007 11:18 PM
Sir Francis Drake Stede General Discussion (sailing related) 0 10-08-2003 05:10 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome