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Video of Jordan Series Drogue deployment...

11K views 42 replies 18 participants last post by  Brent Swain 
#1 ·
Here is a video of a Jordan Series Drogue deployment on a Brent Swain designed steel boat (yes our Brent Swain;)) off the coast of Chile.

windy days on Vimeo

It's pretty interesting to see how the boat goes from starting to surf with the waves, to having the waves pass under the transom. You can really see the aft buoyancy of the boat working to raise the cockpit out of harm's way from the waves.

Note the extra line that is rolling hitched outboard of the bridle legs. That's a retrieval line that he used, apparently to great effect. The couple said they found the motion so comfortable, and the deployment and retrieval so easy that they plan to use the JSD is moderate conditions and not just severe or survival ones.

MedSailor
 
#35 ·
I read all the retrieval information available, and everyone pretty much said it was a real PITA that required the strength of a young athlete--not a shot to Hell 71-year-old man. Now, looking at all the videos, diagrams, etc..., my thought process kicked in and said "Why not just attach a line to the tail end of the drogue and use it for retrieval. This would invert the parachutes, thereby decreasing the resistance substantially. The retrieval line could be tied off to a cleat on the stern's corner, which I believe would prevent it from becoming wrapped around the drogue's main line.

So far, at least for me, heaving too and allowing the storm to pass seems like a much better option. There are several instances in Pardy's Storm Tactics Handbook that relate to boats using drogues attached to their stern with a bridle. Some sank, many suffered severe damage. Lynn Pardy aptly describes typical weather patterns and the onset of storm patterns in the book(s), information that I believe it very accurate--at least in my part of the world. Like I said earlier, I'll give it a try this summer and I'm fairly open minded about these things.

Back to the retrieval. I got to thinking about this again last night. When I spent endless hours offshore in a relatively small boat fishing for billfish and tuna there were times when the action of the lures twisted the fishing line horribly. The only way to untwist the line was to remove the lures and all hardware, then just let the line pay out behind the boat while you cruised toward home port. Well, after about 100 yards of line is out, the reel was engaged and the friction of the line, with absolutely nothing attached, at 5 knots, was just about enough to drag the person holding the rod overboard. Now were talking about 50-pound-test, fine-diameter monofilament line--not half-inch drogue line with a couple dozen 5-inch parachutes attached. Think about it!

Gary :cool:
 
#36 · (Edited)
I don't see how a small, swiveled float on the end of a parachute type drogue would substantially impede the function. It would probably make it much easier to retrieve as with a sea anchor. Pulling in a series drogue, it seems, would be difficult from either end as the cones would still likely exert quite a bit of drag, albeit less than when going in their functional direction.

My first choice is still the para-anchor, mainly because with an older style hull with a keel attached rudder that heaves-to readily but has little control surfing down the face of waves, keeping the pointy end into the sea still seems like the right thing to do. Having waves break over the cockpit is just not my idea of how I want to deal with a large, dangerous, breaking sea...sorry.
 
#37 · (Edited)
I am not a big fan of this kind of systems but it seems to me that this one is the best. With this one you can even control your speed, letting go more or less cones.

On those conditions I would not have used it (on my boat), I mean with that sea and wind but I don’t know their boat. It seems to me that it is an old hull with a narrow stern and that kind of boat roll a lot dead downwind.

Anyway it seems to me that if he had taken one of the head sails, changed the course to 135/140 of true wind he would have stabilized the boat would not need to deploy the drogue and would be making good speed. Perhaps he just wanted to make a movie about the drogue:D.

Regards

Paulo
 
#38 · (Edited)
Warning, noob here.

Do you guys ever use actual parachutes (the nylon kind that fall out of the sky) for this kind of deceleration/stabilization work? If so, what kinds do you use? Has anyone considered a ringslot/ribbon canopy? Instead of the typical type of round parachute you think of, this one is made of concentric bands held together with webbing. It would allow water to escape through the slots between the bands. Cargo ringslot parachutes are extremely strong, nylon canopies. They are towed behind aircraft at 150 knots with no damage. Nt sure how they would fair in salt water, but just a thought.

For reference, the one I'm thinking of is 15' diameter. If that's too small, there's also a 28'.
 
#39 ·
I believe people have used ordinary chutes and they are prone to fail. Purpose built sea anchors have the ability to off load excess force through tear away panels or other openings. Think of it this way.

The weight of a 1 inch column of air that extends from sea level to the top of the atmosphere is approximately 15 lbs.

A 1 inch column of water that weighs 15 lbs is only 33 ft tall.

The drag and pressure differentials are extreme. The chute should probably take that into consideration.
 
#40 ·
The type of heavy duty military surplus cargo chutes mentioned in Storm Tacticshave not been available as far as I was able to find. They were built with very heavy reinforced polymer. That's why I bought a Para-Anchor which is designed to take the extreme loads, proven and tested. Why screw with something like this? The Para (which I hope to never use) is MUCH heftier than a regular parachute. Moving water can exert unbelievable force.
 
#42 ·
I don't think the separate retrieval line is a good idea. It might work if you are deploying the JSD for a quick lunch, but if left out for a while my guess is that the line would end up wrapped around the JSD anyway and when you pull it, you would still be pulling the JSD from the front, not the back. That must be why they have elaborate instructions for retrieving the JSD using winches on alternating sides. I have never used a JSD, but I am convinced that it deserves a spot in one's bag of tricks.
 
#43 · (Edited)
I used 4 inch sch 40 pipe for the mooring bits on Silas Crosby, ran thru a 12 inch square , 3/16th doubler plate, to a point ten inches below decks , where I welded it on a horizontal piece of plate, which was welded to the transom. You can see this bit in the bottom of the picture, next to the chock. It has a sheer strength of 90 tons.
If there was a chafe problem , one could run a short length of chain around the bit, to take it clear of the hull, where the rope would be attached.
The Silas Crosby has a single aluminium door for a main hatch , which is extremely tough and resistant to any boarding wave. She is also a centre cockpit boat, which makes her even more resistant to boarding waves.
Altho I have never cruised in a boat with a reverse transom, those who have, said they invite, and even launch a breaking wave into the cockpit. The difference between a reverse and traditionally sloped transom is around 6,000 lbs of extra buoyancy in the stern of the boat with the traditional transom. Thus, a reverse transom may be the cause of waves ending up in the cockpit.
Being a steel hull, she has a fraction the structural worries of non metal boats.
She has since rounded the horn.
On a fibreglass boat a large stainless U bolt in the corners of the transom, with huge backup plates would be the best attachment points for a drogue.
With the drogue shackled on, thru hard eyes, there would be zero chafe.
I built my own parabolic drogue from salvaged seat belts ( free) , using a large mooring ball , about 5 ft in diameter , as a mold. I stapled the webbing in the shape of a half sphere over this ball, then sewed it later, while removing the staples.
A friend on a Fraser 41 , during the queens birthday storm off New Zealand used this type of Galerider drogue with good success. He kept having to shorten the rode to stop it from fouling the skeg, in the troughs, when the line went slack. When it was down to 80 feet , it worked far better, the rode stopped going slack, and they went to sleep til the storm was over. This saves one from having to carry a huge amount of line.
Boats with drogues from the bow tend to lie beam on, which is far less comfortable and puts far greater loads on the drogue and line.
 
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