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  #21  
Old 06-01-2012
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

[quote=poopdeckpappy;879058]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fstbttms:878870

In lieu of advocating to have a inferior product legislatively shoved down our throats to protect your livelihood, why don't go advocate to produce a product that is at least equal too copper base at a cost equal too or less than copper based.

Do this and boaters will overwhelmingly support non copper paints
Agreed!
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  #22  
Old 06-01-2012
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Management Strategies for Copper Sources in Urban Runoff

Cooling Water Systems

Investigations conducted by the RWQCP determined that cooling water systems were a significant source of water pollutants, especially copper and tributyltin.

Vehicle Service Facilities and Car Washes

Of the 305 vehicle service facilities regulated by the RWQCP in 1998, 247 chose to be zero dischargers (no discharge to the sanitary sewer or storm drain) and about 58 facilities were permitted to treat their wastewater and discharge it to the sanitary sewer.

Copper-Based Root Control Products

In 1992, all cities in the RWQCP service area prohibited the discharge of copper-based root control products to the sewer system. Unfortunately, the RWQCP lacked legal authority to ban the sale of the root control products and could not prevent purchase and use of products from large regional stores in neighboring towns. Since the root killer

Corrosion of Copper Piping
Approximately 58% of the copper discharged from the RWQCP comes from corrosion of copper pipes in homes and businesses. During 1995, Dr. Moran managed an investigation of copper piping corrosion and potential corrosion reduction measures. The study, which was conducted by Dr. Moran and a consultant in coordination with City of Palo Alto Planning and Utilities Department staff and the City of San Jose, involved the following tasks:

Vehicle Brake Pads
In May 1999 brake manufacturers promised to conduct additional cooperative research on the environmental impacts of vehicle brakes, and to reformulate products to reduce brake-related copper problems in rivers and estuaries and to prevent future environmental problems from brakes.


It is good to see they are looking at everybody and were are not the sole target


Boats and ships coated with copper-containing
biocides may release copper directly into the Bay during storage, operation, and in-water
maintenance. On-shore maintenance activities have the potential to release copper into

Its pretty unclear how BIG are contribution is say compared to household plumbing

Treating all urban runoff in the Bay Area is almost certainly financially and
technically infeasible under current conditions.Typical runoff treatment systems have
incomplete copper removal; removal of dissolved copper is even more difficult
than removal of total copper.26 Without maintenance, performance of runoff
treatment systems can fall to near zero over a period of a few years. Costs for
treatment include costs for installation and maintenance, and costs to ensure that
treatment systems meet performance standards. Installing runoff treatment
devices for existing developments poses potentially significant retrofitting costs.



It would seem to me there NOT real sure what % of the "problem" is from boats
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  #23  
Old 06-01-2012
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Quote:
Originally Posted by poopdeckpappy View Post

In lieu of advocating to have a inferior product legislatively shoved down our throats to protect your livelihood, why don't go advocate to produce a product that is at least equal too copper base at a cost equal too or less than copper based.

Do this and boaters will overwhelmingly support non copper paints
Yeah, that would peachy keen. Except the product you described doesn't exist.
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Old 06-01-2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fstbttms:879072

Yeah, that would peachy keen. Except the product you described doesn't exist.
Exactly the point, the enviro friendly products are inferior at a premium, why? And why should we be forced through legislation to except a inferior product?

SD has a program to convert from copper based paints, they will pay to have the boat stripped of all copper paint, you then pay the cost of this inferior, yet, enviro friendly paint at the tune of $2000.00 ( thats for my 37' boat )

I can have my boat stripped and painted ( 1 in the field and 2 on the L.E's ) for $1400.00 and I've heard even less if I want to go into the south bay area.

Someone needs to use their head more and the pen less
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

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Originally Posted by poopdeckpappy View Post
Exactly the point, the enviro friendly products are inferior at a premium, why? And why should we be forced through legislation to except a inferior product?
You do not have some God-given right to use copper paint for ever and ever. When tin paints were banned, boaters were forced to use a less effective anti fouling paint. Yet the sky didn't fall, the economy didn't collapse and life went on. Copper paints will eventually fall by the wayside folks, that's the reality of the situation. Better get over it.
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Fast Bottom what would you put on your boat? Im do for a bottom job next spring. Our boat is in Channel Islands, the water is cold by my standers mid 50s to low 60s mostly. I clean it myself and the albative pant works ok but you know there is always slime, no hard growth but ya you have a tough job no what you use.
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

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Originally Posted by Bradhamlet View Post
Fast Bottom what would you put on your boat? Im do for a bottom job next spring. Our boat is in Channel Islands, the water is cold by my standers mid 50s to low 60s mostly. I clean it myself and the albative pant works ok but you know there is always slime, no hard growth but ya you have a tough job no what you use.
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

It's not clear what the copper is killing as the study is big on words like "can amd may "

It MAY harm phytoplankton And can effect salmons ability to smell and yet it is needed in are diet ?

In reading the findings of the now 20 some odd year study they do not even seem to be able to put a number on the amount of copper from boats as it is such a small % of the load*

It would seem there are well aware of the sorce of 98% of the copper inparement and it is to costly / difficult / some other excuse to do anything about so boats once again become the tarke
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Last edited by tommays; 06-01-2012 at 08:57 PM.
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fstbttms View Post
You do not have some God-given right to use copper paint for ever and ever.
Never assumed for a second that I did

Quote:
When tin paints were banned, boaters were forced to use a less effective anti fouling paint.
You mean like copper?

Quote:
Copper paints will eventually fall by the wayside folks, that's the reality of the situation. Better get over it.
Don't have a problem losing copper paints, I do have a problem losing a working product, then being force to use a inferior product with a elevated cost based on speculations, advocations and incomplete studies
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  #30  
Old 06-02-2012
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Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

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Originally Posted by tommays View Post
It's not clear what the copper is killing as the study is big on words like "can amd may "

It MAY harm phytoplankton And can effect salmons ability to smell and yet it is needed in are diet ?

In reading the findings of the now 20 some odd year study they do not even seem to be able to put a number on the amount of copper from boats as it is such a small % of the load*

It would seem there are well aware of the sorce of 98% of the copper inparement and it is to costly / difficult / some other excuse to do anything about so boats once again become the tarke
What study are you referring to? Link please.
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