How Far Do You Heel...? - Page 8 - SailNet Community
 34Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #71 of 90 Old 09-06-2013
Moderator
 
Jeff_H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Annapolis, Md
Posts: 6,819
Thanks: 5
Thanked 133 Times in 106 Posts
Rep Power: 10
     
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottUK View Post
Cheers Jeff.

So from what I gather the mainsail is flattened at the leading edge in the area of the mast bend and then the leech would not have as much tension thus adding more twist and spilling more wind. It has been what I thought but have heard conflicting information.

I understand moving the top of the forestay aft and down would also decrease the tension on the leech of the headsail and so induce twist. Not sure about flattening the headsail though. If the foreatay tension is tight and is moved aft through increased backstay tension wouldn't this just decrease the angle of the straight line of the forestay and not reall effect the luff. But I guess it would all depend on the initial forestay tension.
As a broad general rule, as the wind increases the headstay sags more, and this is especially true on a fractional rig where the increased headstay forces induce more mast bend. When you tighten the backstay, this increases the tension on the forestay and that reduces this sag. When you reduce sag, almost by definition, the stay itself moves forward and to windward. And this increases the distance between the leech of the sail and the stay. As that distance increases, the jib is flattened and therefore depowered.

Jeff


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Curmudgeon at Large- and rhinestone in the rough, sailing my Farr 11.6 on the Chesapeake Bay
Jeff_H is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #72 of 90 Old 09-06-2013
Remember you're a womble
 
PaulinVictoria's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sidney, BC
Posts: 2,087
Thanks: 10
Thanked 53 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

Fantastic, thank you very much indeed Jeff, you're a star. I even understood it!

Orange Crush
1974 C&C27 MkII

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
PaulinVictoria is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #73 of 90 Old 09-06-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: new england
Posts: 2,109
Thanks: 42
Thanked 41 Times in 38 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

Great explanation Jeff .thank you. ? Do you see any advantages to mast head rigs? Just came in from sailing. Variable day. Have Solent rig. Find if I leave tension on furled genny halyard a little loose get more out of the back stay.? Am I just fooling myself ? Obviously leave tension in actual stay the same all year once tuned.

s/v Hippocampus
Outbound 46
outbound is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #74 of 90 Old 09-06-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 149
Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 8
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

Just want to point out how lucky we all are. We all have whatever level of experience, interest, academic background to opine on various topics. But we get to read and interact with a truly accomplished yatch architect.

It reminds me of a conversation I had years ago with a large animal vet (my wife is an equestrian and has had several horses over the years). He was describing his "experience" of horse owners.

"There are two ways I know of to becoming an equestrian vet and an expert on horses. The first is to go to college, go to veterinarian school, intern, pass your boards. The other is to buy a horse."

Skywalker
jimgo likes this.
SkywalkerII is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #75 of 90 Old 09-06-2013
grumpy old man
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 3,975
Thanks: 1
Thanked 93 Times in 89 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

I drive past dairy farms all the time up here.
I really want to own two milk cows.
I would treat them really well.
I'd feed them beer.

It's my dream.

Please visit my blog. It's fun to read.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Bob's Blog ....

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Please also visit my new web site
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
bobperry is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #76 of 90 Old 09-06-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 149
Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 8
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

Nice dream

I'll donate to the cause. Anyone who recognizes the many uses of beer gets my support.
SkywalkerII is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #77 of 90 Old 09-07-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 366
Thanks: 0
Thanked 18 Times in 17 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

Cheers Jeff
ScottUK is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #78 of 90 Old 09-07-2013
Senior Member
 
blutoyz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 661
Thanks: 10
Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

All this talk of heeling has made me want to go out and buy a clinometer today and mount it. I just heel until it slows me down right now but I am curios to see what angle that is.

I do not plan on buying a horse of a cow though
blutoyz is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #79 of 90 Old 09-07-2013
Sea Sprite 23 #110 (20)
 
mad_machine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Atlantic City, NJ
Posts: 3,217
Thanks: 5
Thanked 69 Times in 60 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff_H View Post
As a broad general rule, as the wind increases the headstay sags more, and this is especially true on a fractional rig where the increased headstay forces induce more mast bend. When you tighten the backstay, this increases the tension on the forestay and that reduces this sag. When you reduce sag, almost by definition, the stay itself moves forward and to windward. And this increases the distance between the leech of the sail and the stay. As that distance increases, the jib is flattened and therefore depowered.

Jeff
This explains the small triangle the Oday used to use on their rigs on the backstay. With the Mainsheet hooked to it, the more tension on the sheet, the tighter it pulled the stay

Art Haberland
__________________

In the end all that matters is how fully you loved, how gently you lived, and how gracefully you let go of things that did not belong to you -Buddha

__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
mad_machine is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #80 of 90 Old 09-09-2013
Senior Smart Aleck
 
jameswilson29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Posts: 2,152
Thanks: 34
Thanked 70 Times in 65 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Re: How Far Do You Heel...?

Jeff_H,

It appears your photo made the BoatUS Foundation facebook quiz today:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=1&theater

or here: https://www.facebook.com/BoatUSFoundation
jameswilson29 is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Crealock 37 heel and sea comfort swiftibis Pacific Seacraft 13 01-23-2012 02:21 PM
How far can I heel over? Will I tip? Shadbjohnson Learning to Sail 16 09-05-2011 02:38 PM
Excess Heel HuskerDave Seamanship & Navigation 29 10-20-2008 05:36 PM
Minimizing the Heel Mark Matthews Learning to Sail Articles 0 10-24-2001 08:00 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome