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  #61  
Old 07-05-2012
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Well perform your own experiment.
Make a new account.
Ask a question like "is this a blue water boat" or maybe "full keel or fin keel"
See what your first responses might be.

Both are valid questions for someone trying to get familiarized with what direction they may think they want to start looking into.

Responses might include "do a quick search" or "oh not this subject again" either responses might very well put someone new off and just send them somewhere else.

If someone has been on the forum for years then id have to say pretty much every topic imaginable has already been discussed over and over and in about every imaginable way and angle possible. Think about it most of the boats out there have been out there for what maybe 20 years Plus?

So the choices are people can either be pleasant and rehash old topics again welcoming new members with pleasant responses making them feel welcome and not trying to tell them they are morons for asking tiara questions.

Or

The forum can go the path of not including new members in a friendly manner the only real topics are boating news, new boats, new equipment innovations, race events, or possibly a few other things.

Forums eventually fall quiet and people move on. And that's the same process for any forum on just about any topic you can imagine.
  #62  
Old 07-05-2012
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Re: Fond Fairwell

Re: Sailnet ain't how Sailnet Used to be.
Some people like Pre-Army Elvis.
Others like 60s Elvis.
Some like Fat Elvis.
But it's all Elvis.
Each era has it's positives and negatives, but to an Elvis fan, any Elvis is better than none at all.

To compare Sailnet to CF is to demonstrate that one is a Percy Faith fan. Or possibly Perry Como. But you certainly don't get Elvis.
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  #63  
Old 07-05-2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy:892952
So what would a complete reset look like? What was the original path?
If you take a look at the member's list by date (around 2000-2002) then posts you'll see what type of posts and threads prevailed. Many are similar, but the tone was much different. A complete reset would wipe everything clean except the member's list along with all posts, threads and ratings.
  #64  
Old 07-05-2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bljones:892970
Re: Sailnet ain't how Sailnet Used to be.
Some people like Pre-Army Elvis.
Others like 60s Elvis.
Some like Fat Elvis.
But it's all Elvis.
Each era has it's positives and negatives, but to an Elvis fan, any Elvis is better than none at all.

To compare Sailnet to CF is to demonstrate that one is a Percy Faith fan. Or possibly Perry Como. But you certainly don't get Elvis.
Sail or power, Sailnet or CF, racer or cruiser; there's still boater's out there who know squat about boating.
  #65  
Old 07-05-2012
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Re: Fond Fairwell

Quote:
Originally Posted by SEMIJim View Post
I really cannot say which of the three forums, this one and two others, I find the most useful, because the answer is that I find each of them useful. But I can say this: No one of them, nor all of them together, are as enjoyable or useful as SN used to be, before the multi-way split occurred. It's unfortunate, but it is what it is.
tdw: I realize I still owe you an answer on this very subject. I apologize for not having produced it yet. I think part of the reason is I don't know as I care to relive old, futile battles. Part of it is undoubtedly imperfect memories. Part of it is I don't know what good the effort would produce. What's done is done. Nobody's mind will be changed. Humpty Dumpty cannot be put back together again.Jim
Jim,

Now ain't that the truth. For mine Cruising Anarchy is and always has been a stand alone but what we here lost as people drifted away to A-S and to some extent CF did leave a hole and that is a shame. Myself I think in large part due to the fact that a bunch of us arrived here around 2006 and a certain cammeraderie (Hi George) developed. That one of those members (Giulietta) was such a character did not hurt in creating a certain something that is now gone, not just from here but as you said Jim, from the offshoots as well. Everyone was in some small way a loser. Reality is however that overall SailNet is as strong (or weak) as it ever was when it comes to participation.

As for getting back to me on the other matter, yes let it pass. What's over is over the fat lady has done her thing. No need to smack a sleeping dog.

Andrew B
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  #66  
Old 07-05-2012
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Re: Fond Fairwell

Quote:
Originally Posted by Allen-deckard View Post
Well perform your own experiment.
Make a new account.
Ask a question like "is this a blue water boat" or maybe "full keel or fin keel"
See what your first responses might be.

Both are valid questions for someone trying to get familiarized with what direction they may think they want to start looking into.

Responses might include "do a quick search" or "oh not this subject again" either responses might very well put someone new off and just send them somewhere else.

If someone has been on the forum for years then id have to say pretty much every topic imaginable has already been discussed over and over and in about every imaginable way and angle possible. Think about it most of the boats out there have been out there for what maybe 20 years Plus?

So the choices are people can either be pleasant and rehash old topics again welcoming new members with pleasant responses making them feel welcome and not trying to tell them they are morons for asking tiara questions.

Or

The forum can go the path of not including new members in a friendly manner the only real topics are boating news, new boats, new equipment innovations, race events, or possibly a few other things.

Forums eventually fall quiet and people move on. And that's the same process for any forum on just about any topic you can imagine.
I'm with you. Internet forums are cyclical. If you've been here a long time (I kinda' have), either help or don't help, but please don't tell the newbie to search the site for his answer. If you happen to know there was a recent great thread on the topic the newbie is asking about, then pointing to that particular thread is helping, but basically telling them to pound sand the first time they have the temerity to ask a question you have seen before will eventually kill off the forum until its a dozen of the same people talking about topics that only interest them.

Face it, if we aren't here to provide real time input, they could close Sailnet right now and break it out into a big FAQ's section since nearly every sailing topic has be touched on.
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  #67  
Old 07-05-2012
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Re: Fond Fairwell

Quote:
Originally Posted by PalmettoSailor View Post
I'm with you. Internet forums are cyclical. If you've been here a long time (I kinda' have), either help or don't help, but please don't tell the newbie to search the site for his answer. If you happen to know there was a recent great thread on the topic the newbie is asking about, then pointing to that particular thread is helping, but basically telling them to pound sand the first time they have the temerity to ask a question you have seen before will eventually kill off the forum until its a dozen of the same people talking about topics that only interest them.

Face it, if we aren't here to provide real time input, they could close Sailnet right now and break it out into a big FAQ's section since nearly every sailing topic has be touched on.
Good heavens ... never tell anyone to search the site, that way lies madness. I have no idea why it is so but the search engine is rubbish. OTOH, if you throw your question at Google the appropriate SailNet thread will more than likely appear. Why this is so I have no idea.

Is this a Blue Water Boat or Full/Fin keel are for mine valid questions. Yes they have been hashed over a thousand times but heck havn't most questions ? I confess that "I've never sailed but which $5000 boat should I buy to circumnavigate" does get the juices flowing. Some questions do show a level of stupidity that seems to scream out for sarcastic slash and burn.

The other side of all that is a forum's role as a place to natter. How many times have you hashed and rehashed certain topics with your mates ? Cripes, if we only got to talk about something once we'd have all have run out of things to say years ago.

oh yes .... and Jones .... Percy Faith and Perry Como notwithstaning .... what of Mitch Miller ?
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  #68  
Old 07-05-2012
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Re: Fond Fairwell

Quote:
Originally Posted by tdw View Post

Is this a Blue Water Boat or Full/Fin keel are for mine valid questions. Yes they have been hashed over a thousand times but heck havn't most questions ? I confess that "I've never sailed but which $5000 boat should I buy to circumnavigate" does get the juices flowing. Some questions do show a level of stupidity that seems to scream out for sarcastic slash and burn.


oh yes .... and Jones .... Percy Faith and Perry Como notwithstaning .... what of Mitch Miller ?

Good heavens! What kind of moron would circumnavigate in a $5000 boat? You need at least a $10,000! I've sailed mostly in inland lakes, but that's my forum-qualified expert opinion!

But seriously, Hope everyone had a safe 4th!
  #69  
Old 07-05-2012
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Re: Fond Fairwell

These are my general comments, and they have nothing to do with the OP's apparent reason for leaving:

I've moderated a forum oriented toward professional musicians for 15 years, and I can tell you that, like the tides, forums ebb and flow. Good people get fed up with newbies and take off, dejected that things just aren't like they used to be. Sometimes those good people come back after a cooling off period, sometimes new people come in who have a lot of experience to contribute and fill the void left by the old salts. It's just how forums work. There will always be newbies coming in asking the same questions, and it is important to welcome them warmly or the forum will die.
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  #70  
Old 07-05-2012
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Re: Fond Fairwell

Quote:
We beleive that Sailnet is drifting away from their original message, thus the exodus of quite a few number of serious sailors some of who were our friends to other sailing forums. It may be that these administrative things have take a normal couirse of action, and it maybe the way that Sailnet has chosen to maintain or increase future memebership,, but in light of recent decisions by the controlling board of Sailnet we no longer wish to support by actively participating.

We are serious sailors and do not need a new social interaction site as it is becoming.-chef2sail
This is part my original post and were the reasons for my movement away from Sailnet except in PMs which some of my frends have already been receiving to their posts. These reasons may need clarification as others seem to be attributing differing motives. When a person leaves my organizatuion we always do an exit interview so as to learn an hopefully improve ourselves. Thats why I aired my criticisms. To almost all of the mods credi..they have replied to me.

Quote:
I've moderated a forum oriented toward professional musicians for 15 years, and I can tell you that, like the tides, forums ebb and flow. Good people get fed up with newbies and take off, dejected that things just aren't like they used to be. Sometimes those good people come back after a cooling off period, sometimes new people come in who have a lot of experience to contribute and fill the void left by the old salts. It's just how forums work. There will always be newbies coming in asking the same questions, and it is important to welcome them warmly or the forum will die.- Rhythm Doctor
Rick you are a friend of mine. We got together in person last week and rafted on your trip charter on your trip with your wife. This is not aimed at you, but what you wrote here.

I dont need a cooling off period- that would be a pandantic statement dismissive of my reasons.

I left because my goals as a sailor and Chesapeake sailor who beleives in giving back to
to others and I felt that some at SN do not parallel my goals and beleifs anymore.

My decision was well thought out and not an act of anger.

My decision was not based on interactions in the off topic threads and I was not insulted by anyone in them more than the usual.

My decision was not the normal ebb and flow ( thats what people say when they dont want to look at themselves and blame things on the cosmos and nature and say its predetermined).

My decison was based on a change I percieved since I joined Sailnet from a serious sailors forum to a more social one ie chatrooms and such.

My decison was also one based on an in-person ( not online) interaction and disrespect by someone who is an appinted member of the Sailnet leadership who demonstarted to me that they put their own importance and opinions before others.

In all to dismiss my leaving as "like the tides" is grossly overlooking the reason and therefore may repeat itself through others. And yes that may not seem important to you overall as your numbers show you are increasing, but I prefer quality over quantity and dont use quantity as a measure.

Many of you have PM me, and I thank you for your kind words and many have already seen me at Cruisers Forum getting involved with the same vigor I was involved here. My wife and I will never compromise our ideals of respect and goal of paying it forward in the sailing organizations we choose to join. We will continue to sponsor a Rondevous for Chesapeake sailors at the Matyland Yacht Club in early June to continue the network we have helped bring together and want to continue. My choosing to post elsewhere does not negate the many in person friendships and bonds we have made.

As is the usual case some may now take shots at what I have said. When you do ask...is this respect? and what you want a new poster at SN to see how you treat someone?
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