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  #151  
Old 07-12-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

A person can't deny the obvious differences between the generations that remember the pre internet days, and the ones that do not. I believe that viewing this "new world" we now live in via technology in the same old way: "oh, every generation thinks they know more than the younger ones coming up" is just not accurate anymore. Technology is changing the way people are, and where I live (and probably you as well) it's undeniable that kids don't go outside anywhere near like they did when we were young. As a whole, this is not an "outside" generation at all, even if there are exceptions here and there.

Cate has a very large family, and she has nieces, nephews and cousins in the late teen/twenty something set. I am always stunned when I ask them "got your license yet?" only to get the inevitable "no", with no explanation whatsoever as they check their device (Facebook I assume)... My neighbor in fact, right next door has a 20 year old daughter and 18 year old son. Neither ever leave the house that I have observed in any kind of social way (other than to go on their back deck to smoke), and neither drive cars. At that age being inside and home all the time is something I cannot even begin to relate too, it's so weird.

Kids today play the "guitar hero" game and think that is talent and actually playing guitar. Kids from my era actually started bands with musical instruments, you know what I mean? It just isn't the same anymore. Who knows, maybe soon they'll make some new game that has a winch and a wheel as the controllers, and you can sail/cruise "virtually"... (no thanks, I'm good... have at it though)..

It's never a good idea to generalize one person of course, but when judged as a generation overall, Y's/millennials really seem to very often be oversized, oddly shaped, terrible at human interaction/social graces and are quite shut in and glued to a screen or device (I attribute the odd shapes to what we feed kids these days, but that's clearly another topic..).

Huh, now that I think about it - I don't trust anyone under 30...
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  #152  
Old 07-12-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

the internet is just another way to help me boat i can find cheaper boating parts online. And i can find out what the winds will be so i can plan acordanly for my day of sailing. I sail all the time and love boating the internet is a great tool.
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  #153  
Old 07-12-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

in Haiku?

The net helps me boat
A plan for wind the net says
I sail all the time
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  #154  
Old 07-13-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

Quote:
Originally Posted by puddinlegs View Post
Sorry that you feel I've singled you out. But if I have, oh well. We might be in a unique situation in Seattle where there are a number of younger folks buying older boats, fixing them up, and racing/sailing the hell out of them. Yes, my sample is biased to two locations that I know pretty well, Seattle and a whole bunch of young designers (industrial, architecture, communication) in Japan. No, the kids in Japan aren't sailing, but they're working damn hard doing interesting things and just getting by.

This is not a simple nor one dimensional problem of 'computer games' and spoiled youth. Yeah, young people travelled all over during the depressing.... to simply survive. Very bad analogy. A lot of younger folks don't drive because families can barely afford gas for getting to work yet along jr. taking a date to the prom or going to the submarine races. As for having already 'drank the kool-aid', we'll have at least two 20 somethings on the boat tonight who didn't grow up sailing, but just think boats are cool. One is a university student living on a 25' boat, the other someone who just likes the people she's been exposed to on our boat and others she sails with.

I'd also hope that a lot of the older crowd here remember the age group that's risking life and limb every day and coming home to very diminished economic prospects. We're in the middle of a world wide structural political and economic shift because of radical changes in how we communicate that hasn't been seen since the likes of the invention of the printing press, Martin Luther, and the reformation. If anyone including current presidents and potential contenders really think they know where all this is going and what the end result will be in the US, they're kidding themselves. That young people are sailing at all is an accomplishment. So am I biased? Yes. I am because I've also taught them.
I don't feel singled out at all. i just am the guy who responded to your inaccurate generalizations. And pump your brakes on the hyperbole- It's a recession, not the end of the world, and it has hit homeowners, career blue collar workers and those over 40 a hell of a lot harder than it has hit those in their 20s. not being able to find a job you really want when you graduate with your McDegree is not the same as seeing your 401K evaporate, your career disappear and your home equity evaporate, all while supporting your aging parents who won't die and your stay-at-home kids who won't live.

In fact, i posit that Gen y has the most to gain from this recession simply because of their possible adaptability and portability, exactly the reason why the "greatest generation" migrated during the 30s, looking for opportunity, thereby supporting my comparison, which is not, btw, an analogy... i hope you are not teaching them English.
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  #155  
Old 07-13-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

Quote:
Originally Posted by bljones View Post
I don't feel singled out at all. i just am the guy who responded to your inaccurate generalizations. And pump your brakes on the hyperbole- It's a recession, not the end of the world, and it has hit homeowners, career blue collar workers and those over 40 a hell of a lot harder than it has hit those in their 20s. not being able to find a job you really want when you graduate with your McDegree is not the same as seeing your 401K evaporate, your career disappear and your home equity evaporate, all while supporting your aging parents who won't die and your stay-at-home kids who won't live.

In fact, i posit that Gen y has the most to gain from this recession simply because of their possible adaptability and portability, exactly the reason why the "greatest generation" migrated during the 30s, looking for opportunity, thereby supporting my comparison, which is not, btw, an analogy... i hope you are not teaching them English.
You're wrong...unemployment has disproportionately hit the youth of the country. Source: Unemployment Demographics | Department of Numbers



And not having a job after gaining a college degree is more damaging than you say. It puts you at a LIFE LONG disadvantage. Its called "lost generation" for a reason. People that cannot establish a working pattern early in career have shorter lifespans, suffer from more physical and mental health issues, have fewer children get divorced more, etc etc.

Oh, and they also tend to cause radical revolutions (Iran in the 70s, Cuba in the 50s, Arab spring in the current era).

So while your 401(k) may have taken a hit, to be frank, you've already contributed to society and will soon become a net debit....you're spent! The youth are wasting their most productive years. Hence the "lost generation" tag...its a generation of lost value to society.
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  #156  
Old 07-13-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

I respectfully disagree- if you don't own a home, still live at home, and are out of work for a year or so until you finally realize that yes, you will have to start at the bottom and bust your butt even with a degree, the impact on the economy as a whole is minor compared to the evaporation of trillions of dollars of equity and the foreclosures of millions of homes along with the disappearance of skilled blue collar jobs.
It's real simple. People without a driver's license don't buy cars. people living at home don't buy homes. no cars and no homes means no furniture, no appliances, no trailers, etc...
Therefore the impact of their unemployment on the economy overall is negligible.

Your own example shows that 35-44 is STILL impacted. Until Gen X feels comfortable with sepnding money, the economy si gonna be stadning still, and it is hard for gen X to feel comfortable when their coddled helicoptered, no summer-job-having non-driving, liberal arts grad kids are still living at home.

SWMBO and I have two kids, a 19 year old son and a 17 year old daughter. For almost half a decade they have been the only members of their peer group who have had to have summer jobs, part time jobs or volunteer jobs. That fact simultaneously stuns me, and makes me very proud of them.
Yes, they hate me. I am okay with that.
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  #157  
Old 07-13-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

Interesting. You're in Canada which does have some differences.
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  #158  
Old 07-13-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

Quote:
Originally Posted by night0wl View Post
You're wrong...unemployment has disproportionately hit the youth of the country. Source: Unemployment Demographics | Department of Numbers



And not having a job after gaining a college degree is more damaging than you say. It puts you at a LIFE LONG disadvantage. Its called "lost generation" for a reason. People that cannot establish a working pattern early in career have shorter lifespans, suffer from more physical and mental health issues, have fewer children get divorced more, etc etc.

Oh, and they also tend to cause radical revolutions (Iran in the 70s, Cuba in the 50s, Arab spring in the current era).

So while your 401(k) may have taken a hit, to be frank, you've already contributed to society and will soon become a net debit....you're spent! The youth are wasting their most productive years. Hence the "lost generation" tag...its a generation of lost value to society.
Really interesting post and it does highlight some of the problems with "my" generation.

However, I think that there is something missing in the last few pages and that is the cruising "personality". Buying a boat and planning to cruise for a few years at my age (Early 30s) has from my understanding always been an endeavor that required someone on the "other" side of pop-culture's hypnotic blueprint of consumerism and work ethic.

Doing so in this era has been called even by my closest friends as "reckless". "You're gonna do what!? In this economy?"

Society works very hard to tell me that at my age, I should be working on my masters, working for a big firm, buying a condo close to the city, taking my kids to yoga classes... How many people that do follow that cookie cutter path end up cruising the south pacific with their fiance?

I dropped out of college in 2000 to work for a big ad firm in downtown chicago, then opened my own business at 26. I wasnt nearly as successful as I could have been had I kept climbing the corporate ladder, but the desire for freedom was something that from an early age prevented me from ever pursuing what everyone else was "supposed" to do. Every cruiser I have met has seem to have had that kind of outlook on life.

At present, there are a LOT of people my age and even younger that are starting to accept that the career path of their parents is not only impossible to follow, some are clever enough to figure out that this is exactly the time to do amazing things that previously would be considered "reckless". Now its a case of money it seems and not walking upstream in the river of career building.

While I prepare to embark on my adventure I catch glances of highschool buddies on Facebook pursuing their next degree, struggling to keep a house in the burbs afloat, married young with kids and honestly look quite unhappy. To each his own etc, but in my mind the few of us that were mocked 10 years ago for not becoming partner at some law firm are the ones that are eager to send post cards from the Azores today.

Those of us in our mid 20s to early 30s that are using excel to plan refits rather than house refinances, made that decision a loooong time ago.

Does anyone else think its a personality thing and not an economic issue?
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  #159  
Old 07-13-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisncate View Post
It's never a good idea to generalize one person of course, but when judged as a generation overall, Y's/millennials really seem to very often be oversized, oddly shaped, terrible at human interaction/social graces and are quite shut in and glued to a screen or device (I attribute the odd shapes to what we feed kids these days, but that's clearly another topic..).

Huh, now that I think about it - I don't trust anyone under 30...
In all this wonderful generalising let's stop and consider who started this thread, who asked the original question.....

Youmeandthed - A couple in there 20's currently cruising in Panama.
Maybe they are the exception that proves the rule? But come on the Gen Y's aren't all doomed, let's give these guys credit where it is due.
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  #160  
Old 07-13-2012
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Re: The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

I would say we all have the right to fear a bit that our society does not produce members who have leadership qualities. This is obvious these days, and might be the most frightening issue with where the world has gone.

I agree that we had to face criticism from our family and friends. Now that we are doing it, I think they are jealous and intimidated by it. Many friends can't even take off a couple weeks of their life to come cruise the San Blas. I don't smell that bad, I shower.

It is nice to see that there are others trying to break the mould.

We have friends in every stage of their twenties, some in more affordable areas are getting married, some are still in university, and some are somewhere trying to compete against millions of others to be the next big success. One main theme resonates, they have little assets and live hand to mouth (monthly payments).

Jennie just went back to Vancouver, and she is spending more in gas to get around than I am in moorage and cost of living. Does she need to drive around, not really; but people won't go to visit here they expect her to visit them. Also everyone seems to be running around like chickens with their heads cut off, throwing down money to buy over priced items.

Another issue to consider might be that Gen Y feels that they need to be validated or else they get low self esteem. I see this a lot, and when cruising you don't get a lot of validation. (but thanks Chall03) . We grew up in a world of constant validation, and have moved into a world of micromanagement. I honestly think the fear of doing something "unprescribed", and therefor unrewarded might be the issue.

I watched the movie "The Aristocrats" and to me it had a very good point. All the comedians loved this joke because it was a process, not a result. It was not a funny joke, and had a horrible punchline. However, they loved saying it because it allowed them to push the barrier and create their own experience with the body, the process. I think Gen Y is too focused on the punchline, and have never known that the journey holds all the value.
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