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The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

119K views 908 replies 179 participants last post by  captain jack 
#1 ·
I'm curious on opinions on this one. When Baby boomers were in their 20's there were lots of them in small capable sailboats (some they made themselves) cruising across oceans; but now-a-days the majority of twenty-year olds appear to be utterly useless. I just don't get it, and I'm in my twenties, and cruising.


I'm also curious as to where people think the future of the sailing industry is going if there are so few young people involved?

Any thoughts?
 
#689 ·
one point to add to what I previously posted about our modern pop culture not introducing sailboats to kids is that, when I was a little boy, there were a lot of plastic toy boats. outside of pirates of the Caribbean toys, you just don't see toy sailboats for little kids, in the stores. it's just not in the public eye for future generations.

one other thing about the baby boom generation sailing, the introduction of relatively inexpensive fiberglass boats in the 50s took sailing out of the realm of the rich and put it in the realm of everyday people. fiberglass boats just aren't that cheap, anymore. the new fiberglass boats, instead of being aimed at the middle class, are now aimed at those with money. yes, you can find reasonable used boats but many average people who could afford them don't have the skills, time, or inclination to fix up an older boat. for them, they want a buy it today/ sail it today sort of hobby.

access to learning may be an issue, too. people are lazy. they don't want to invest time in stuff. we live in an immediate gratification society. as evidence I present to the following tale.

I was out sailing my dinghy, earlier in the summer. as I sailed, I watched this boat doing some odd things. it was about 24 foot or so. kind of a weekend cruiser. this was on the lake. I usually leave the sailor's cove and head upwind, towards the dam. that way, if the wind dies down low, I can sail back downwind to the dock, instead of beating through light airs.

in the morning, that day, the wind was variable and I realized I was doing things the hard way, so I turned her about and sailed down, heading for the other end of the lake. I saw this boat sailing out of the cove and head down, too. they were ahead of me, as I had sailed up first, before heading down. they reached their way out of the cove but, when they turned down, they never eased the main. they kept it sheeted in like they were beating. I thought that odd, but I have noticed that people aren't very glad to get pointers, no matter how badly they are screwing up. so, I left it alone and minded my business.

by the time I had closed the distance to about 10 yards, the wind had arrived so I turned about and headed back upwind. they did too. now, the size of their boat should have meant they passed me by easily. however, it took them awhile to come abreast of me. I waved and kept sailing. they didn't mind the trim of the jib and it luffed often, which slowed them up. there is an island on the lake, in line with the sailor's cove. it screws up the wind around it, for some distance, regardless of wind direction. so, as I approached it, I tacked over, sailed past it's wind shadow, and tacked back to my original course.

they just kept sailing right into the wind shadow, like they didn't realize that's what was happening. well, after a while of watching them sail in such an odd fashion, during a time while they were running with the main sheeted in for beating, I decided I watched them struggling enough ( it was obvious that they were ) and I sailed down to where they were, easily overtaking them.

I said hi and asked how they were doing. they replied that they weren't doing good. I took that as my cure and said hat I noticed that and inquired as to how long they had been sailing. they had bought the boat 3 months ago and had been trying to figure out how to sail by watching youtube videos. now, I don't think that is a bad way to learn sailing. I taught myself by reading lots of books and applying what I read. my first time out on my dinghy, I did just fine. but not everyone can learn without a teacher and it didn't seem to help them. so, I told them i'd help them out and said they needed to ease the main. I got them sailing ok and stuck with them. a guy in a cruiser sailed up to us. he and I had been talking while we sailed near each other, previously. he saw what I was about and also gave them pointers.

they suffered a mild accidental jibe because they weren't mindful of the tiller, once. I kept them from having another immediate accidental jibe. new sailor's tend to respond to an accidental jibe by turning the tiller to where it should have been before the jibe, causing another jibe, I notice. anyhow, they were heading back to the dock, reaching by that time. I had kept telling them how to sail, the whole time.

the wind had dropped and my boat sails very well in light airs. so, I was having no trouble keeping up. they began pulling down the jib and I was sailing in circles around them, talking to them, as they did. I offered to teach them how to sail. no charge. i'm on the water every weekend, anyway, and I hadn't started to sail in the bay, yet. I gave them my phone number and email. told them my schedule was flexible and the next time they decided to take it out, i'd be glad to show them how to sail it.

I never heard from them and never saw them on the lake again. months went by. if they were still trying to sail that boat, I should have seen them up there. there's no other lake near there for them to sail on.

I figure they got frustrated and gave up. it's a shame. I was more than willing to invest the time to teach them.
 
#690 · (Edited)
I think that is a big part of it. Power boats, personal water craft, canoes, kayaks, paddle boards, etc. all are much easier to learn how to use.

It could be laziness. It could be just a general lack of leisure time, or lack of information on available learning resources. There happens to be a few different options for learning how to sail not far from where I live, - both for kids and adults but I was completely unaware of them until a few years ago. It seems to me I used to see TV commercials from marine stores advertising sailboats when I was little, but no more. I'm pretty sure you
could watch the America's cup races on regular TV and local parks used to rent out sailboats but that's not the case anymore either.

Sailing became more of a mainstream activity back in the 70's but it's not any longer.
 
#691 ·
yeah. I think that's the case. a guy I know, who doesn't sail was discussing the recent race with me. he knows I sail and was asking how they could consider the hydrofoil boats to be boats. lol. but I do think it's no longer mainstream. big, fast, expensive power boats are made to look cool, in movies and pop culture; not sailboats.

clubs, sailboat manufacturers, and sailing schools ought to start hosting open houses. free sailboat ride events. something to raise public awareness. that might be one place to start.
 
#693 · (Edited)
That would be a good idea. I learned how to sail when I was little and I never thought of it as being that complicated. I like our sailing club but there's a fairly involved training process you have to go through before you can take the boats out on your own. Just to be clear, we're talking about dinghies and not 40 foot yachts.

I get it. They want to protect the members and the boats but at the same time it leaves people with the impression that sailing is hard. Some people leave the club having never "skippered out". Others that do skipper out leave because they are expected to spend two club sailing days a month training new members.

They have no problems attracting new members so I don't think it's seen as a major obstacle to the survival of the club but that might not be the case if there were competing clubs that required less commitment.
 
#692 · (Edited)
Again I think the thread was about young people really cruising. I take cruising as leaving your home port and headed out across an ocean and coming back to your home country in a year or so. I'm an American who's home port is Hood River Oregon and at that very small marina two sailboats left to cross the Pacific this year, both boats I assume are in Mexico right now. Both those boats had young couples on board. I see this everywhere we sail, not only in Europe but in the states as well. We are in the Canaries awaiting our passage to the Cape Verde Islands then to the Carib. We are on pontoon J of the marina Puerto Calero and there are 7 other boats on the pontoon getting ready to cross. Five of those boats have young sailors, we see this everywhere we go. I had a young couple maybe 22 or 23 aboard today to see our new boat. He is from Bermuda and she is from Glasgow they are headed to his home port after a couple years sailing. Their boat is not fancy but well taken care of. That is the way of the young sailors we see, inexpensive boats well taken care of.

It is foolish of me to even write about this subject because I can see most of the complainers here just don't get it and never will. Those who get it don't post on sites like this much because they are out having the time of their life while the rest of you ***** about every excuse in the world. I guess that's why the 1 % rule comes in to play with real cruising just like it did 40 years ago. You really want to do it and you have to sacrifice everything in your life and focus on going cruising, you have to be narrow sighted.

Anyway we are all working hard on our boats most days getting ready for the crossing, some days we take a day off from work and hitch around the island, drinking good cheap white wine, 80 cents a bottle and eating great sea food. In the evenings after five we hangout with other cruisers of all ages and drink some more while most of you just have wet dreams about cruising and forever nothing more. But I know maybe one of you will figure it out and screw all the crap you have brought upon yourself and come see what this life is all about. The oceans are big places and there is room for one or two % more.

Cheers
 
#694 · (Edited)
Again I think the thread was about young people really cruising. I take cruising as leaving your home port and headed out across an ocean and coming back to your home country in a year or so. I'm an American who's home port is Hood River Oregon and at that very small marina two sailboats left to cross the Pacific this year, both boats I assume are in Mexico right now. Both those boats had young couples on board. I see this everywhere we sail, not only in Europe but in the states as well. We are in the Canaries awaiting our passage to the Cape Verde Islands then to the Carib. We are on pontoon J of the marina Puerto Calero and there are 7 other boats on the pontoon getting ready to cross. Five of those boats have young sailors, we see this everywhere we go. I had a young couple maybe 22 or 23 aboard today to see our new boat. He is from Bermuda and she is from Glasgow they are headed to his home port after a couple years sailing. Their boat is not fancy but well taken care of. That is the way of the young sailors we see, inexpensive boats well taken care of.

It is foolish of me to even write about this subject because I can see most of the complainers here just don't get it and never will. Those who get it don't post on sites like this much because they are out having the time of their life while the rest of you ***** about every excuse in the world. I guess that's why the 1 % rule comes in to play with real cruising just like it did 40 years ago. You really want to do it and you have to sacrifice everything in your life and focus on going cruising, you have to be narrow sighted.

Anyway we are all working hard on our boats most days getting ready for the crossing, some days we take a day off from work and hitch around the island, drinking good cheap white wine, 80 cents a bottle and eating great sea food. In the evenings after five we hangout with other cruisers of all ages and drink some more while most of you just have wet dreams about cruising and forever nothing more. But I know maybe one of you will figure it out and screw all the crap you have brought upon yourself and come see what this life is all about. The oceans are big places and there is room for one or two % more.

Cheers
I realize that the thread is about cruising but to me some of the same reasons you'll see fewer young people cruising apply to sailing in general. Personally, I'm not really bitching. I've only been participating in this forum a short while and it's been eye opening. I've come to the realization that cruising is really something I could do if I wanted to and I can see a path to that end. But long passages are something that's not really on my radar at this time and maybe never will be.

Anyway, the financial realities are different than they were 30 or 40 years ago. One can complain about that (not that it does any good). But there is more to it. I think it's also about choices and sailing is just not as popular a choice as it was decades ago, - and not just because of the expenses.
 
#698 ·
to address the money issue, there is a thread, over in the cruising/live aboard forum, about earning money as you cruise. and I have also watched informative videos about the cruising life, on youtube, done by people that live the life. there is one young couple, specifically, that tries to educate people about the lifestyle and are very encouraging towards people interested in it. but, the idea of scraping up for a cheap boat, leaving with the clothes on your back and very little money, and being able to work as you voyage is really just a fantasy. I have read a number of stories about people who did it, in the 'old days', but times have changed. you can't realistically expect to earn a living with odd jobs as you sail port to port, especially outside of the USA. at least, that is the consensus from those who have the experience.

you pretty much have to have the money, have a job that allows you to work from your lap top and pays really good, or something similar. that's just not a situation that you will find a lot of young people in.
 
#699 ·
The Admiral and I met a young guy at our marina who appeared to be twenty-seven ish, he had the look of a young man who just recently left selective service. He had Virginia plates on his truck. He had a 30ft nonsuch that was in wonderful condition, he said he purchased his boat at the beginning of the year, said he was selling his 20ish foot trailer sailer boat in the spring. So it seems that adventure and wanderlust is not dead in the young peoples world, and Me and the Admiral are both very happy to see this first hand. So the Duchess of Montrose is not alone :)
 
#702 · (Edited)
Hannah

Wine is 80 cents a bottle? no wonder you live large!! I'd never leave. Here one beer in a pub is $6, you need a $50k income for an apartment and an old car, lesss than that and you have to shack up with 5 room mates or freeze under a bridge, I just spent $800 on a tank of heating oil that will probably last 2 months and I am working to supply all 5 in my family with a roof, a bed, 3 meals and health insurance.

Seriously it is all great to hear about all the youngins who get out there and live the dream. But doesn't it stand to reason that someone somehwere is paying the price of supporting them. Keeping the homestead , or the rest of the family whole, paying airfare back and being the mommy/.daddy bank when things go wrong. Nothing wrong with that either - I wish my wife and I had some support when we started out. Instead it was straight out to the hourly wage farm - and move lively!

Very few, or almost no american kids are going to go cruising that without family or friends/ tribe - someone supporting them. There'd be no place to go home to, no one to call when you got sick ( WITH NO HEALTH INSURANCE!) hungry , your boat broke, or you just needed $$. Think about it. This is all over and above the cost of boat, equipment and daily expenses.
 
#708 ·
Hannah

Wine is 80 cents a bottle? no wonder you live large!! I'd never leave. Here one beer in a pub is $6, you need a $50k income for an apartment and an old car, lesss than that and you have to shack up with 5 room mates or freeze under a bridge, I just spent $800 on a tank of heating oil that will probably last 2 months and I am working to supply all 5 in my family with a roof, a bed, 3 meals and health insurance.

Seriously it is all great to hear about all the youngins who get out there and live the dream. But doesn't it stand to reason that someone somehwere is paying the price of supporting them. Keeping the homestead , or the rest of the family whole, paying airfare back and being the mommy/.daddy bank when things go wrong. Nothing wrong with that either - I wish my wife and I had some support when we started out. Instead it was straight out to the hourly wage farm - and move lively!

Very few, or almost no american kids are going to go cruising that without family or friends/ tribe - someone supporting them. There'd be no place to go home to, no one to call when you got sick ( WITH NO HEALTH INSURANCE!) hungry , your boat broke, or you just needed $$. Think about it. This is all over and above the cost of boat, equipment and daily expenses.
Hi Sal,

I don't think most of the 20 somethings we meet come from wealthy families or have support from their families. They seem to know what they wanted and set out to save, buy a used boat, get it in the best shape they could, took care of all the loose ends and went sailing. These young men and women are very self confident, very polite and friendly all of them are that we have met. Most know they can't sail off into the sunset forever and that they eventually will need to go to work again, maybe a year maybe two. They watch their money, eat simple, drink hard and go to few marinas or restruants. And things on this side of the pond are tough with high unemployment with the 20 somethings. Yes they have good health care, hopefully Americans will have it soon too. Some worked in hi tech, some were auto body mechanics, pay all over the place.

Sounds just the same as when I did it in 1972, save for a couple years, live in a house with 5 other guys, save some more, work an extra job buy a boat fix it up, tie up the loose ends have your folks give a big party for you then just go until the money runs out, come home and find a job even in those days it was hard too. But cruising was all I could think about and I made it work. I'll say it again, if you really really want to you can find away just like whalesarecool did.

I got to love that guy who wanted to know how much my boat cost! What an angry dork. That's like asking a Montana rancher how many acres he owns:eek: We are in our 60's now and because sailing is our focus we can afford a really wonderful boat and proud as hell we can, we earned it and we deserve it as far as we are concerned. Life is not a practice run it's the real thing so bud or what ever your name is be happy living that wonderful life you have made for yourself.

The rest of you 20/30 somethings if you really want to go sailing make it happen. It can be done.

Cheers
 
#705 ·
Hannah sure ruffled some feathers! :laugher


IMO cruising does not mean living aboard. And someone living aboard does not necessarily "cruise". Hell, you can take 3 day "cruises" aboard a ship if you want.
I took this thread as asking why aren't more young people sailing. Perhaps I misunderstood.

Anyway, it's safe to say the world can't operate if the entire population took off in a boat to wander around the oceans and drink wine. There would be no balance.
The liveaboard-and-cruise'ers need those who are willing to give up that life they so desire or else wandering around the oceans while drinking wine would be dangerous. Think of all the nameless and faceless people who protect the waters and keep the thugs in line. And those earning a paycheck need the liveaboard-and-cruise'ers to keep a dream alive so they remain sane. We all depend on each other in the grand scheme of things.

You never know the obstacles other people are facing. Some may be working so they can buy their chemo to treat their cancer.
Perhaps they have a family member who is disabled. Is it an excuse or is it a reason for remaining on land to work and provide for that family member?
Or maybe they're trying to provide a lifestyle for someone they love, who they'd move heaven and earth to make that person happy. They'd rather be with that person than alone on a boat in the ocean.
Maybe they had plans to have a family and live life on the oceans, but their child was born with medical conditions requiring frequent medical care.

I think it's good to remember that we all wear different shoes. Some of those shoes were given to them without any other options. Some didn't have a choice to go buy the shoes they wanted.
We often make assumptions about people we're talking to as if they had the same choices we did when it's just not right.
 
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#707 ·
I'm in my 20's and am cruising with my buddy from Maine to the carribean on his 1972 30ft islander. Been a great trip so far. Follow us at whalesarecool.com. Any advice is greatly appreciated. Thanks! The economy does suck but it also comes with cheap old boats and the chance to live cheap and free! Don't know why more people don't do this other than not knowing about this option
 
#709 · (Edited)
yeah I like whalesarecool's blog.

I'm 100% happy for anyone who is out sailing for a year, no ifs ands or buts - do it while you can! Good for you on the retirement boat. I'm 8 years behind you. Stay thirsty, my friend.

family, tribe friends... someone to come home to is always good.
 
#714 ·
Yes there are many who live a sad life in many countries around the world and with no way out. I hope those of us who are more fortunate do what they can to help.

But with this thread I think we are talking about your average young person in a first world country. He or she is healthy, of sound mind. What sets them aside from the rest of the average folks and I think we are all a part of the average folks is they have a desire so strong to accomplish what they want that some of them succeed. Not all do and I know that but some do live their dream. I guess I have been lucky, only a high school education, barely and a good trade that eventually paid off later in life. But I knew what I wanted and gave up a lot of other things in life to get what I wanted. That's what I have been trying to say here. When I hear most likely healthy want to be sailors complain they are stuck as a slave to the man maybe they should get a little pissed off or a lot pissed off and make the needed changes so they can live the dream. If you have a big debt from university focus on paying it off as fast as you can, think,think how you can do it out side the box. If you have a wife or husband who does not share your dream you must decide what is more important to you and go with what is more important. But what ever you decide stop the crying and move on with life. Be happy as you can be and achieve your goals.

Here we are in the warm Canary Islands working 6 hours to 10 hours a day getting the boat ready for passage. Work is hard but rewarding, all most every cruiser here is doing the same. When it's time to stop working for the day we shower up and start to enjoy the other side of cruising while at the dock. We meet great like minded people, I'm sure we all had the dream and couldn't stop, the respect here amongst cruisers is great, no one puts someone elses boat down because its old or because its new. As long as the owner and crew put an effort into making sure they are sailing safe we all respect their show. Those out there who really want to live this dream most likely will and I hope a few of you will.

Bought 20 boxes of box wine at pay and cash this morning for 0.60 to 1.25 Euros each, no sin tax here. With the total supply we should never have to buy expensive wine in the Carib. Well I have to complete rebuilding the head as it is making loud noises and needs
to be greased but as soon as I do its off to a BBQ at the scotts boat next door. This week is the world championships here for the RC 44's, all young men and women in their 20/30's who have been working around the clock to get the boats ready, should be fun to watch when we are not working on our boat.

Cheers
 
#715 ·
People have more control over their lives than they realize or admit.

I've know people who were born in ghettos, in basically third world conditions, who decided their was a better life for them and made it (read the real life story of Jay Z).

I've also arrested a few hundred drug dealers, living in squalor, with a shoebox with $100,000 in cash under the bed, and $200,000 in electronics, clothing, DVD's cars, other non-durable consumer goods, who would argue that there was no way for them to escape their sad lives.

It is 99 per cent mindset. And, we can wish everyone in the world had it, but we can't give it to them, or make them be like us, no matter how sure we are, that they would be better off.
 
#716 ·
I am not saying you can't improve your life. I am responding to the statement that the circumstances in life have no effect on your possibilities. most assuredly, you can work to improve a bad situation. you are not usually completely stuck, although, depending on the situation, you may also be stuck to a degree.

some things you can completely overcome. some things you can work to your advantage. some things you can minimize he negative impact of. some things you can recover from. sometimes you can't, though. sometimes you are completely screwed.

even when you can overcome, very often it's like sailing into the wind, you have to take an indirect path and work it. so, it's going to take you longer, sometimes much longer to reach your goals. the loftier the goal, the longer it may take.

the post that started this discussion stated that, if you can't just drop everything and sail off across the sea, you just must not want it bad enough. the idea is that your life is completely in your hands and circumstances have no control over you. that's just not true.

the examples you gave are very valid, but there are lots of people offering opportunities to help people climb out of the lowest cesspools of life. there are a lot less opportunities, for people that are struggling to maintain their status out of the cesspool, to take the step to having real financial wherewithal. it's a lot harder to get past that point, for many people. it's not that they can't do it, in the end. but it may be that they really can't get to that end until later in life.

but, the truth is, life honestly does screw some people. it creates limitations that there is no way to completely overcome.
 
#717 · (Edited)
Some people truly have it hard, but most of the young people I see complaining about how difficult things are have buried themselves in debt to buy unnecessary things: a mortgage on a house they can't afford, new car payments, an expensive cell phone plan, etc. With such behavior, no income level would ever free them from debt & wage slavery.

These people have bought into the idea that spending gives quality of life, when in reality owning things you don't need mostly causes stress- whereas savings reduces stress and gives you freedom and financial security.

There's a growing movement of young people into frugality and simple living that find by cutting their expenses, they can retire wealthy at a young age with a very modest income. This article gives an example of how this works:
The Shockingly Simple Math Behind Early Retirement by Mr. Money Mustache
 
#729 ·
#722 · (Edited)
No, sal, you're missing the point- if one is making $150k as an architect, that is a good choice, which pays you back for all the hard work, etc.... BUT, if the market falls out and one is no longer making $150K as an architect, then one has a choice- go bankrupt and blame the economy and the circumstances, or recognize that it is time to find a new gig, before the inevitable bankruptcy- THAT is the choice.
No matter how bad the economy is, there are always opportunities.... unless you fail to see them.


30 years ago there were thousands of draftsmen, merrily scribbling away at drafting boards. Then, along comes CAD. the draftsman has a choice- learn cad, or blame the rise of the machines for his being out of a job.

Your choices determine your success.
 
#723 ·
I'm not missing it. Your point is a tangent. See if you can dig this -the title of this thread isn't

Why are there so few young people bankrupt and blaming others and refusing to reinvent themselves?

Its a valid point, that you should be able reinvent yourself but actually, as I see it -in this discussion - as it relates to reasons why young people are not cruising, your point is synonymous with those who say "the economy" except that you throw in a bit of Ayn Rand happy sauce and some moralizing. As I see it anyway.
 
#726 ·
I'm not missing it. Your point is a tangent. See if you can dig this -the title of this thread isn't

Why are there so few young people bankrupt and blaming others and refusing to reinvent themselves?

Its a valid point, that you should be able reinvent yourself but actually, as I see it -in this discussion - as it relates to reasons why young people are not cruising, your point is synonymous with those who say "the economy" except that you throw in a bit of Ayn Rand happy sauce and some moralizing. As I see it anyway.
I'm sorry, I though you were addressing my tangent which was addressing another tangent,but you are addressing the thread as a whole, although you quote my tangent. :) I can dig it.

LOL @ "Ayn Rand happy sauce and some moralizing." I'm not a "fountainhead", I am simply pointing out where I am coming from and why, having been there, done that.

Thanks for pointing out I have a valid point. :)
 
#725 ·
to address recent posts in this thread first.
Looks like there are some people who pretty strongly about their opinions and as we all know everyone had one. really its pretty interesting to see the varying viewpoints but I think we can probably all agree that there is a middle line somewhere which is where reality is. yes there are people who make poor decisions (our hypothetical Archatect who complains about no work instead of deciding to do something else) yes there are people who who have been beat down by things they nave no control over. (the paraplegic who wants to run a marathon) The reality is it takes a combination of opportunity and mental attitude. I could go on a lot more about this, about personality types, about opportunity, about privilage(inherited and created) but that is not what this thread is about

this thread asked about the future of the sailing industry and mentioned not as many young cruisers. I think over all 1st world countries have become a little less adventure oriented and a little more comfort oriented. this is not to say that there are not individuals who dont fit the norm's, there always are. but I think many more people will choose to go sailing for a year or two in between careers, in their 30's or 40's then the 20 somethings of yore who just jumped on board and hoped. People have become a little more paranoid(or informed) of would could really happen out there and take a little time to get prepared, think about what to do when they get back.

or I could just be talking out my A$$.
 
#730 ·
to address recent posts in this thread first.
Looks like there are some people who pretty strongly about their opinions and as we all know everyone had one. really its pretty interesting to see the varying viewpoints but I think we can probably all agree that there is a middle line somewhere which is where reality is. yes there are people who make poor decisions (our hypothetical Archatect who complains about no work instead of deciding to do something else) yes there are people who who have been beat down by things they nave no control over. (the paraplegic who wants to run a marathon) The reality is it takes a combination of opportunity and mental attitude. I could go on a lot more about this, about personality types, about opportunity, about privilage(inherited and created) but that is not what this thread is about.
great post. that is exactly what I have been trying to say. it takes a combination of opportunity and attitude. the right attitude, alone, isn't enough.

this thread asked about the future of the sailing industry and mentioned not as many young cruisers. I think over all 1st world countries have become a little less adventure oriented and a little more comfort oriented. this is not to say that there are not individuals who dont fit the norm's, there always are. but I think many more people will choose to go sailing for a year or two in between careers, in their 30's or 40's then the 20 somethings of yore who just jumped on board and hoped. People have become a little more paranoid(or informed) of would could really happen out there and take a little time to get prepared, think about what to do when they get back.

or I could just be talking out my A$$.
personally, I think you are spot on.
 
#727 ·
well one good thing about a global down economy is in certgain places you can buy huge deals boatwise...

30, 40, 50 footers for half of what they would cost in a booming economy...

so buy when you can cheap, save up when the boom hits and leave earlier than you plan to...never later! jajaja

peace
 
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#731 ·
well one good thing about a global down economy is in certgain places you can buy huge deals boatwise...

30, 40, 50 footers for half of what they would cost in a booming economy...
that's the truth. I never would have expected to get this cal 27 for $300, needing work or not, a number of years ago.
 
#736 ·
if you have the ability, i think that might be the most fulfilling. all my bike trips were like that. i'd decide on a general direction/location, then i'd just tie my things to the chopper and follow the front wheel.
 
#737 · (Edited)
Uncle Toad

Although I agree with the general spirit of your post, I take issue with -

"people who make poor decisions (our hypothetical Archatect who complains about no work instead of deciding to do something else) "

As being both unsympathetic and missing my main point entirely. In my original post where I spoke of this architect, the context was merely as a comparison of the number of jobs versus number of people looking for work. If there are X number of jobs and 2X number of applicants, you have a serious problem with people finding well paid employment. Even if everyone were to retrain, move and reinvent themselves, X is STILL LESS than 2X and the problem remains. And this affects the " young people going cruising " thing.

As an example I used the only experience I personally have to illustrate this, some fellow architects. But they did not make bad decisions. Even so, as smart and resourceful as they are, that was not my main point which seems to be lost. Not enough total number of jobs for the total number of applicants. 2X - 1X = 1X unemployed. This isn't what we are told in school, or in the media, so its hard for some people to get it. But its that simple.

No one at any point was arguing that a person should remain in a dead end profession.
 
#738 ·
it's quite true about the job market. the media and administration, espcially, don't like to talk about it. but it's a big factor in most people's lives. when i first started in the HVAC buisiness ( sheet metal mechanic. fabrication and installation of duct systems ), there were actually more jobs that applicants. it was super easy to get a job. i just walked in and asked about a job. i talked to the owner for less than fifteen minutes. he hired me on the spot. i never even filled out an application. that was in 1988, i believe. now, there are 20 or more people in line for every job you apply to. people are actually trying to make fast food a support your family type career, and pressing for $15/hr. that was mnever meant to be that kind of a job. it was always entry level. but times change. 'real' jobs are hard to come by.

not only does it effect the employment rate, but it effects the income rate. if there are more jobs than people to do them, employers are forced to compete for employees. they have to do somehing to entice you to work for them and then they have to try to keep you. if there are more people than jobs, it's the employees that are on trial. pay rates were higher, back then, comparatively ( less inflation ), and benefits were so much better.

when i started in HVAC, i was hired on at $8.50/hr and i had one week sick leave and two weeks paid vacation...all right after my 90 days were up. i was totally green. i knew nothing about HVAC.

now look at it, the most recent HVAC job i worked started 'green' employees out at $9.00/hr. no sick leave. after your 90 days was up, you got one week of paid vacation. two weeks after five years as an employee. that's a $1.00/hr increase, for the same job, in 20 years.

then, look at prices. in 1988, i was paying right around a dollar a gallon, for gas. a nice fairly new one bedroom cost me $395 a month. now, my girlfriend, who lives in a less expenisive area than i had, pays a bit over $500 for abn old, pretty run down efficiency.

it's actually been exponential, the way costs have grown in comparison to pay. in 1999, i got back into HAVC. i had left the field to pursue other interests. at that time, starting wages for green employees was $9.00/hr, as i noted above. i was started at that rate, until i proved myself. my rent was $600/month for a 2 story townhouse with a basement, 3 bedrooms and 2 full baths. by 2008, when i left HVAC due to the crash of the economy, starting wages were still $9.00/hr but rent for that same townhouse ( i had moved by then, actually, and saw it come up for rent ) was over $1000.

wages had not changed but rent had almost doubled. and we are all aware of the exponential increase in gas prices in the last few years.

it's a different world out there. kids are getting out of college and finding that they can barely find an entry level position, let alnone a good paying job in their chosen field.
 
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