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-   -   Delamination. (http://www.sailnet.com/forums/general-discussion-sailing-related/89904-delamination.html)

utchuckd 07-19-2012 07:03 PM

Delamination.
 
When discussing delamination, is it only in reference to the hull/fiberglass? I looked at a boat today that, even though the decks were pretty solid when tapped, had a lot of what I would call delamination in the wood inside. The layers are just coming apart. Is this a major problem itself? Or maybe a symptom of something else? Here's some pics from a couple bulkheads and shelf supports along the cabin:

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j1...huckd/head.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j1...ckd/vberth.jpg
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j1...uckd/shelf.jpg




Also, though most of the bilge was dry it had a big old chunk of rust over a couple keel bolts (if you can make it out). What do you think, run from it?

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j1...uckd/keel1.jpg

misfits 07-19-2012 07:28 PM

Re: Delamination.
 
This type of delamination happens when things leak. Port windows, toe rails, hull joints.
Chances are the deck has some unsound areas but that doesn't mean the boat is toast.
IMHO, she's a project boat. Keel bolts, can't help you with that one. That was the one thing I was concerned about on my sabre but after rebedding the bolts, with the exception of one, they looked good & I was able to torque all of them down without them spinning, which is a good thing.

Jetexas 07-19-2012 07:42 PM

Re: Delamination.
 
The boat was probably full of water at some point. Just know you will have to replace all that plywood, and if you don't, it will stink like mildew forever.

I had to do it on my boat, but for the price it was worth it.

smurphny 07-19-2012 07:52 PM

Re: Delamination.
 
It does look like moisture damage. Poke around with a small, thin knife to check for rot. If it's "punky" and soft, it's a large problem. If it's just the top veneer that has peeled, I would think about getting some matching veneer and glueing it on, leaving the old plywood. You could also use Git-Rot or similar epoxy (West makes a similar product) if there is a bit of rot and relaminate the veneer.

The rust in that pan may be nothing but residue from something that sat there and rusted. Looks like a pan was glassed in over the bolts. A deeper exam needs to be done to check that the bolts aren't all electrolycized.

paul323 07-19-2012 08:14 PM

Re: Delamination.
 
Delamination is not just fiberglass - it applies to any laminated material (any material where multiple layers are bonded together to form a single unit). Laminated bows, for example, are very common in archery....

But back to your boat. The plywood has been soaked; some of the layers have swollen/shrunk/delaminated, the glue has failed. Plywood which has suffered this abuse rarely returns to its original dimensions, frequently suffers from rot, and generally has lost its structural integrity. Occasionally - rarely - the top laminate layer (veneer) detaches, and as this layer is principally decorative it can be replaced.

The top photo looks like longer-term water penetration, and looks bad.

The other areas may be fixable; in the middle photo it would probably be quicker, easier and more attractive to replace the wooden facia/front. It the third photo (assuming the wood is sound) veneer would probably fix it.

utchuckd 07-19-2012 08:23 PM

Re: Delamination.
 
Thanks all. I did poke around some with my knife and it seemed dry everywhere, but like y'all said,it has been wet at some time. Just didn't know if this was a seal up anything that leaks and repair/replace the wood, or if it was indicative of some larger problem. The chainplates look to have been replaced, so maybe it's already been taken care of.

boatpoker 07-19-2012 09:31 PM

Re: Delamination.
 
Don't even consider this boat until the glass is removed from the keel bolts and they are closely inspected. Replacing keel bolts on most boats is extremely expensive and and almost impossible on others without replacing the keel. It would help to know what model you are talking about.

utchuckd 07-19-2012 09:42 PM

Re: Delamination.
 
Cal 2-29.

boatpoker 07-19-2012 09:53 PM

Re: Delamination.
 
Don't see too many Cal's up here in Canada but I think you'll find that the keel is integral to the hull mold, therefore there are no keel bolts but they did have a steel beam for mast compression support and there is a very good chance that it is badly corroded.

tommays 07-20-2012 09:18 AM

Re: Delamination.
 
On the Cal 29 the rust is from the lifting hoops they used to place the lead in the keel

However the other rust is also from the mild steel mast step which is doused with water from the pan drain in the head area, cooler drain and the original leaking mast wires which funneled water directly to to the top of the beam

http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...r/PC052615.jpg
http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...ays/tabrot.jpg
http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...r/PC062618.jpg

http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...r/P1102627.jpg

http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...r/PC052617.jpg

If you look under the settee by the compression post you will most likely see a big rusty metal tab


http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...131_155712.jpg

http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...306_154839.jpg

http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...418_131627.jpg

The wood deal is endless bow to stern :eek:

http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...r/PB292613.jpg

But all my important stuff was still alive

http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...0_12050014.jpg

http://i565.photobucket.com/albums/s...1_09120020.jpg

And IHMP they fall into the boat worth saving IF your up to 2 years or so work


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