Couldn't do it - Page 3 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related)
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree36Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #21  
Old 07-22-2012
smurphny's Avatar
Over Hill Sailing Club
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Adirondacks NY
Posts: 2,848
Thanks: 55
Thanked 63 Times in 61 Posts
Rep Power: 6
smurphny is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

Glad to hear you're not completely throwing in the towel just yet. +1 on Jon's suggestion to put in an inboard motor. It will open up a lot of choices as where and when you can go. I agree that hiring a "surveyor" who knows considerably less about your boat than you is nonsense. The price these guys charge is way out of whack for what they actually do. As most other posters are suggesting--action is required. Go out sailing. I know that often I just have to force myself to get out there instead of doing things like sitting on my duff in front of this infernal machine. Once out on the hiking trail above the tree line or off on the boat I always wonder why I don't do it more often.

Look for a little used Yanmar diesel or find a basket case and rebuild it.
chrisncate likes this.
__________________
Alberg 35: With a philosophical flourish Cato throws himself upon his sword; I quietly take to the ship.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #22  
Old 07-22-2012
chrisncate's Avatar
America, love it or leave
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Maryland
Posts: 4,672
Thanks: 18
Thanked 30 Times in 30 Posts
Rep Power: 5
chrisncate is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

All of you are right, with one minor exception - the part about me intentionally making it difficult on a buyer. Again, sling time turn around and as thorough an inspection as a person wants is one thing - go ahead and bring your surveyor for that if you like, but multiple days off? four full days - Tues to haul and dry out(?), Wed to inspect, Thurs to sail, and Fri to relaunch is excessive at this price point in light of the obvious work documented and done. Gimme a break here, there isn't that much to look at on Heron.

The potential buyer was very nice, and it's no fault on him at all (I feel pretty bad having to tell him no) - but he was also alluding to me delivering her 80 miles south as well. I can't give it away and be put through the wringer, no matter how wrong I may be at a lousy 15k. For right or wrong, either see the gift horse and take advantage quick, or lose a great deal by worrying about non issues like blisters or the rudder falling off. Think about it - you think we did what we did above, and the bottom is going to be falling apart? Even in light of the pic/vid proof that shows clearly otherwise? Did my hand sanded gel coat and eight layers of epoxy "not take" or something? Are the two and only through hulls that are through bolted and fully documented as they were installed not really what you are seeing with your own eyes?

Regarding putting a motor in, couple of things there - I wouldn't buy a new motor. I'll find one cheap, either in a boat someone needs out of that I can harvest a motor from, or one being sold used (recently saw one in running condition for 1k). Even if I simply installed a stern tube assembly, prop/shaft, knocked back out the rudder/prop area and made her ready to accept a motor, it'd go long way towards her value. I (luckily) had the forethought to leave the motor area intact so in the event she was to ever be repowered, it wouldn't be starting from scratch and could drop in easily.

Suppose I had even 6k in a motor install (I believe I can do it for far less, but lets just say), a motor in Heron would bring her right up to the top of the A30 market, which still appears to be about 30k for the best examples - which she'd easily be with an inboard. I've already lost the money on her by this point, and another couple of K spaced out over a year in order to recoup probably the same amount I was asking for her in total until yesterday doesn't seem like a bad idea - at least in our particular case, as we can get it done. Am I wrong?

As for getting back into the groove of sailing, all I can be is honest and say "I don't know". We're gonna take it day to day, no plans. The only plan is to get her back on land, get rid of the god forsaken composting head (yay!) and put a real one back in, sell the vane and oven, and continue making her the nicest A30 on this particular planet. This time, we'll make sure to savor the time and effort a bit more and not be in "we gotta get done and launch" mode.

*EDIT - We may wait awhile to go on the hard, might just sail her over the fall. Don't know.

Last edited by chrisncate; 07-22-2012 at 03:06 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #23  
Old 07-22-2012
chrisncate's Avatar
America, love it or leave
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Maryland
Posts: 4,672
Thanks: 18
Thanked 30 Times in 30 Posts
Rep Power: 5
chrisncate is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by smurphny View Post
Glad to hear you're not completely throwing in the towel just yet. +1 on Jon's suggestion to put in an inboard motor. It will open up a lot of choices as where and when you can go. I agree that hiring a "surveyor" who knows considerably less about your boat than you is nonsense. The price these guys charge is way out of whack for what they actually do. As most other posters are suggesting--action is required. Go out sailing. I know that often I just have to force myself to get out there instead of doing things like sitting on my duff in front of this infernal machine. Once out on the hiking trail above the tree line or off on the boat I always wonder why I don't do it more often.

Look for a little used Yanmar diesel or find a basket case and rebuild it.
Thank you, exactly
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #24  
Old 07-22-2012
Capt.aaron's Avatar
KNOT KNOWN
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Guanaja, Bay Islands, Honduras
Posts: 1,320
Thanks: 1
Thanked 19 Times in 19 Posts
Rep Power: 3
Capt.aaron is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

The people who bocked at buying obviously did'nt have a clue what they were looking at and therefore were not worthy. As nice as they may have been, sounds like they should buy a Catalina or Hunter. Those boats were made for land lubbers who want to poke there nose out into the bay. A surveyor worth his salt could look at that boat and in less than a half hour and advise the people to buy now while it's still available. It was written in the stars for you to keep her.
Jgbrown likes this.
__________________
" Some are boat wise and some are other wise"

Last edited by Capt.aaron; 07-22-2012 at 05:51 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #25  
Old 07-22-2012
chrisncate's Avatar
America, love it or leave
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Maryland
Posts: 4,672
Thanks: 18
Thanked 30 Times in 30 Posts
Rep Power: 5
chrisncate is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

Lol, I can feel the collective blood pressure spiking at:

Quote:
a Catalina or Hunter. Those boats were made for land lubbers who want to poke there nose out into the bay
You know knot what you do...

I'm serious about that beer someday..
Capt.aaron likes this.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #26  
Old 07-22-2012
chrisncate's Avatar
America, love it or leave
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Maryland
Posts: 4,672
Thanks: 18
Thanked 30 Times in 30 Posts
Rep Power: 5
chrisncate is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

Regarding the buyers, they were really nice and admittedly newish to sailing. They were just looking out for themselves and going by what they have read and researched. I don't fault them in any way.

The real issue there was the fact that I am not the type of guy to be blunt about my opinion on the whole heavy survey hoops thing to the buyer, as it never looks good to people when you're trying to explain why they don't need to verify that everything is ok. I'd have just wound up looking like I have something to hide, as that's what I'd think in that situation if reversed.

I was really hoping someone who knew boats enough would come along and be like, "seriously? This boat for 15k... with everything?", and hastily shove a deposit in my hand. This isn't my first large ticket item that I've sold, I do know the drill a little bit. It does appear in a lot of ways that it wasn't meant to be when I review how the entire selling attempt has gone..

A brief synopsis:

1- About 100 emails from folks who aren't actually in the boat market at all, they just want to talk to me about what we did on Heron and tell me about their cruising dreams. Flattering, but a waste of time with the added let down of false hope of a sale.

2- Spam (is item still for sale and what is present condition).

3- People who can't or won't read the text of the ad - "Does she have an inboard?" "What condition are the sails in?"...

4- Lowball offers, sight unseen. "I'll give you 5k today!" (I bet you will, you hemorrhoid..).

4.1- People asking me to donate her for the tax write off (sounds great!).

5- People from distant locations letting me know that if they were here...

6- A total of 5 people actually making it out to see her. 4 of which were all new to sailing, one of which was hoping to lowball.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #27  
Old 07-22-2012
sailpower's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Fort Lauderdale
Posts: 248
Thanks: 1
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Rep Power: 7
sailpower is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

You have taken the ad down but as I recall you did a beautiful job.

I do remember thinking that for most folks she still needed an inboard, head, electrical system, electronics and a FW water system?

So, finishing the amazing job that you started would put her above the high market for most people even though she would be exceptional.

I wonder if you taking a year to add things that a lot of buyers will want will be cost effective.

BTW, there is no way a survey of this boat with its present systems should take 4 days. There isnít a whole lot for the surveyor to look at!

Haul, hang it, tap it, launch it and back to the slip. Put the sails up on the way back.
You have been dealing with a bunch of dreamers, wannabes and low ballers which is typical for this market.

Seems that if you can get 15K now with a one day inspection then maybe you just need to hang in a bit longer?

Good luck!
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #28  
Old 07-22-2012
mstern's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 684
Thanks: 8
Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts
Rep Power: 13
mstern is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

Chris: I am not surprised at your experience in trying to sell the boat, and I take no exception to your distaste with the survey process in this case. It seems for the best that this potential sale fell through. If you really wanted to sell the boat, you would have gone through with the survey (although I do agree that a four day survey for a boat that old at that price is really overkill).

I must respectfully disagree with the crowd here who suggest that you force yourself to go sailing now for your own good. Sailing and cruising are supposed to be enjoyable; we do these things sometimes because we want to (its fun!), and sometimes because we have to (stress relief, need for adventure, get away from the rat race). I don't know anyone who goes sailing or cruising because its the nautical equivalent of eating your vegetables. I've read a lot of your posts here, and I've followed your website. I sense nothing of the "cold feet" or "I've bitten off more than I can chew" to your writing. You sound like a young(ish) couple who have been involved in an all-encompassing, consuming effort to reshape your lives, and now that a major part of that is over, you are asking yourselves "what the heck are we doing?".

I am not a psychiatrist, nor do I play one on TV, but I think you have it right: keep the boat for now, maybe work on it some more (that seemed to be fulfilling, right?), maybe do some sailing, maybe not. No right or wrong answers here, just a lot of questions that only you two can answer.

You did a wonderful job with Heron; have you considered making boat restoration your chosen profession? If you aren't familiar with Tim Lackey's work, I highly recommend his website:

Lackey Sailing LLC | Restoring and Rebuilding Great* Boats

Maybe some ideas for you.

Best of luck to you, and I really look forward to reading about what comes next.
chrisncate likes this.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #29  
Old 07-22-2012
smurphny's Avatar
Over Hill Sailing Club
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Adirondacks NY
Posts: 2,848
Thanks: 55
Thanked 63 Times in 61 Posts
Rep Power: 6
smurphny is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

Chris, it's just a lousy time to sell ANYTHING right now...especially a boat or any other luxury item. Our economy is much, much worse than anyone is letting on. It's not getting better in the foreseeable future. I have a couple of Taylor guitars, for instance, that I don't use and would sell but unless I want to give them away, there is simply no market. People have hunkered down and sense something is terribly rotten and they feel there is a "Sword of Democles" hanging over the future of the USA.
kd3pc and chrisncate like this.
__________________
Alberg 35: With a philosophical flourish Cato throws himself upon his sword; I quietly take to the ship.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #30  
Old 07-22-2012
Capt.aaron's Avatar
KNOT KNOWN
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Guanaja, Bay Islands, Honduras
Posts: 1,320
Thanks: 1
Thanked 19 Times in 19 Posts
Rep Power: 3
Capt.aaron is on a distinguished road
Re: Couldn't do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisncate View Post
Lol, I can feel the collective blood pressure spiking at:



You know knot what you do...

I'm serious about that beer someday..
I will say many great sailors are on Catalinas and Hunters, (ie" Cruising Dad, and my budy Andy) but they are designed to be appealing to people making the transition from the comforts of suburbia to the cruising life.....just a little disclaimer if I offended anyone.... again...........yes, beer. If I had any money I'd give you $25,000 for her right now, that boat is sweet! and has none of the systems I don't want allready.
chrisncate likes this.
__________________
" Some are boat wise and some are other wise"
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:08 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.